LeMans needs the Viper back... Dodge are you listening?!

pitviper

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don't know if anyone realized it or not, but this LeMans 24 Hours was the first in TEN years to not have a Viper represented... back in 194 the very crude RT-10 road turned racer finished 3rd in class, behind only the 2 Dauer Porsche 962 LM ("road cars"), one of which was also the overall winner... it was not nearly as interesting in a way to not have the snake to pull for, even against much greater odds in the past couple years. with the GT classes moving closer and closer to the forefront of the sport, dodge needs to take advantage of this incredible marketing opportunity to go head to head with the C6R Corvette, Ferrari with the 550 and 575, maserati, aston martin, and lamborghini. there is even the potential for them to have a chance at the overall... can you imagine a Viper crossing the line first at 4pm come LeMans finish?! beating the world, that's what the task is. i know that there are major political issues with the whole mercedes/chrysler thing, but honestly, why not take some of the engineering that went into the SLR (or ME412 for that matter) and build a new Viper LeMans racer that will take the fight to the rest of the world on a world stage? sportscar racing is on the upswing again, and look at the marketing clout gm is garnering from their corvette successes (which, by the way, i hate corvettes, and nothing makes me cringe more than seeing those cars win when i know a properly prepared Viper effort would be soaking up the same results). it's only going to get better in the next few years, and with the FIA and ACO merging their rules, the costs for making cars that can run in series all across the globe will be lessened... even if you do not follow the sport as much, would you not feel a sense of pride in seeing the snake rise back to the top again? thoughts both for and opposed more than welcome!

pit
 

GTS Bruce

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Forget about Dodge and DC at Lemans.Enjoy the legacy of the Gen 1 and 2 cars when they were there.It over now.If you want a Lemans petigree car get a gen 1 or 2 viper,a ferrari,porsche or a new corvette.New vipers that don't even look like a VIPER have been relegated to tire smoking,sliding around contests competing with ricer cars.SRT stands for Street Racing Toyota. Bruce
 
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pitviper

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and now for the positive spin, featuring GTS Bruce... lol, sigh... unfortunately bruce, i am inclined to agree with you on certain occassions about the state of affairs concerning said issue. i do try to keep hope alive though that at the very least, someone might pull a Prodrive, and develop a road based Viper racecar for customer as they did with the Ferrari 550 (with obvious success) and are doing now with the Aston Martin DB9...
 

George Farris

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Could not agree more with pitviper. Vipers must be raced at LeMans!!! This is a hole in our legacy that is getting bigger as each year passes by. A large part of Viper's appeal comes from its racing successes.

Damn, it hurts not watching them race at the highest levels!!!
 
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pitviper

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amen, george... i actually got into the sport itself because of the success of the Viper at LeMans...
 

SRT10

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The appeal to NASCAR far surpasses LeMans in the country. Unfortunately, thats where Dodge is focusing its energy and resources. I don't care much for NASCAR and won't be watching LeMans without Dodge Vipers in it.
 

AviP

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I was at LeMans in 98 with Team Oreca invite to the VCA and I feel really sad that they don't race anymore. I had a blast. They were so competetive that they were forced to run with ballast. The sport can be restrictive at times. That said I wish there was a dedicated racing program (like Ferrari @ F1). Drifting *****.

-Avi
 

dennis

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The appeal to NASCAR far surpasses LeMans in the country. Unfortunately, thats where Dodge is focusing its energy and resources. I don't care much for NASCAR and won't be watching LeMans without Dodge Vipers in it.

That's the point. And since Dodge/DC gives a sh*t for europe... If it wasn't for Brabus, the Viper wouldn't even be here.

I guess LeMans would be more interesting for americans if again a manufacturer like Ford with the old GT40 would start an attack there. But the last attempts, especially the stupid Chrysler LMP900 engagement were desasters. With that amount of money being thrown into that project, the "old" Viper GTS-R would still own the racetracks.
 

Cris

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The primary reason we are not in LeMans is Mercedes history and scared Germans. Their lack of success and frills (read flying across the mulsane) have scared the Germans such that Wolfgang said he would NEVER support going back.

I do not see that changing until WW III or ...
 
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pitviper

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i think unfortunately that may be somewhat close to correct, which is why i would love to see a prodrive type effort to build up a new GTS racer using the Viper coupe when it comes out finally. and if you ask me, there has to be a solid american operation with the capacity to due the job... maybe even using some of nascars own might? what about the petty's for example? can you imagine the interest it would garner from that side of the fan base as well? an all american effort with familiar names bring the new Viper back to LeMans just as the action from the rest of the world is starting to come to a boil... maybe dan gurney could help out too...

pit
 

dennis

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The primary reason we are not in LeMans is Mercedes history and scared Germans. Their lack of success and frills (read flying across the mulsane) have scared the Germans such that Wolfgang said he would NEVER support going back.

I do not see that changing until WW III or ...


Wolfgang Bernhard has nothing to do with the Mercedes LeMans engagement... That went all under Norbert Haug, who is still responsible for the F1 races. (Lack of success a reason for not coming back, no?)

The Chrysler LMP desaster, with an all american Oreca V8 :rolleyes: was more likely the reason, and not the aerodynamic problems of Benz.
 

Cris

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Dennis you may be correct but Wolfgang has been heard to tell the story of why he would never advocate a Chrysler return to Lemans and that story repeatedly was safety. The Chrysler LMP project received almost no press here in the US.
 

dennis

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Is LeMans a big deal over in the states, anyway? (Except for the GTS Vettes)

Anyways, I'd love to see some new race Vipers not only in LeMans but also in the ALMS, and FIA GT. I hope DC doesn't take Porsche as an example...
 

Jay H

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Sports car racing is liked but not loved here In the U.S partially because I think of the drivers and being mostly from other countrys. Face It its easier to yell Dale Jr than to yell almost any Lemans driver. I personally love Sports car racing and would love it to be as popular here as everywhere else in the world. ALMS was a good try for us here but speaking only for myself without Vipers and the BIG Viper Vette wars its not my thing. If it on Ill watch It but I'm not setting the VCR for It like before. Speed GT is much more my taste now and Is more entertaining. Dodge cant go back to Lemans untill its foe sure we will win and Its just not time. Think of how bad It would be for US (VIPER) to not be competitive and become the laughing stock of the racing world.(NOT THAT IT WOULD HAPPEN BUT...) They did it the first time because the had to prove it was THE CAR, and now we know that it was.( Most susscefull racing car of all time)
 

AviP

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The American viewer seems more interested in the entertainment factor than the racing factor. Unfortunately, this ratings based approach to racing makes it tougher for the diehard viewer. Nascar, with it's accident every 30 laps, is a crowd pleaser. F1, with Schumacher in control, is boring, even though it's technology at it's best.
 
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I would love to see the Viper's back to LeMans and the ALMS series.

The last few years the Viper's raced at Le Mans were fantastic. ORECA's Team Viper performance was outstanding.

Official Story, Dodge pulled out of LeMans to pursue NASCAR? Why? Consider, except for stickers, the cars at NASCAR's look alike. What is the connection between the Dodge product line and a NASCAR? NONE! Seems like a waste of money to be a party to the NASCAR Show which is getting more like professional wrestling. My Opinion.

Some of our largest regional events were around ORECA and the Viper racing at LeMans, Laguna Seca and Sears Point.
 

nitro

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I guess LeMans would be more interesting for americans if again a manufacturer like Ford with the old GT40 would start an attack there. But the last attempts, especially the stupid Chrysler LMP900 engagement were desasters. With that amount of money being thrown into that project, the "old" Viper GTS-R would still own the racetracks.
That disaster ran in the top 3 most of the race and finished 4th. Not bad for the only year they raced.
 

dennis

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Yeah, but who, especially in the U.S. cares for 3rd or 4th places?
the Viper didnt win its first time out either....


Anthony


Yeah, but this is something totally different. When you saw the Viper in LeMans, you knew it was a Viper, a Dodge/Chrysler product. The enthuasiasts, that loved the car already on the street pushed it even more. Well, I did for instance.

Remove all the sticker from the LMP car and 90% of the viewers wouldn't know it was a Chrysler, especially if it wasn't infront.

The GTS cars are pretty similar to the old times of NASCAR, when you could identify with the cars. Something like "Oh, see that's my car on place 3 in LeMans". No one can identify with a prototype car that shares nothing with a "normal" Chrysler and drives around on place 3.
 

VIPERnXr4ti

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Yeah, but this is something totally different. When you saw the Viper in LeMans, you knew it was a Viper, a Dodge/Chrysler product. The enthuasiasts, that loved the car already on the street pushed it even more. Well, I did for instance.

Remove all the sticker from the LMP car and 90% of the viewers wouldn't know it was a Chrysler, especially if it wasn't infront.

The GTS cars are pretty similar to the old times of NASCAR, when you could identify with the cars. Something like "Oh, see that's my car on place 3 in LeMans". No one can identify with a prototype car that shares nothing with a "normal" Chrysler and drives around on place 3.

while i agree the Viper should be back in international sports car racing, with FULL factory support...here are some issues with that from Chrysler's standpoint....the average American most likely has not even heard of the 24hrs of LeMans...and even fewer of them drive Vipers....the average American HAS heard of NASCAR...and LOTS of them drive Intrepids(granted not like NASCAR Intrepids, so unfortunatly the "my car" argument actually favors NASCAR over GT racing)...even most of the younger crowd(read: my age) dont know what LeMans is, and frankly dont care because its not really the type of racing/type of cars they are interested in...so this becomes the basis for Dodge backing the drift car...exposure to the younger, mostly import crowd....Dodge spending money on international GT racing is more than likley a waste as far as the US market goes....unfortunatly....


....and while i agree with your argument about the GTS cars being like "old school NASCAR" to an extent, there is a major difference...when cars like the Charger etc. were racing at Daytona in NASCAR LOTS of people owned them....lots of people could really say "Hey thats my car winning the Daytona 500!"...but the average person does not own Dodge Vipers, Chevrolet Corvettes, Ferrari 550 Maranellos, TVRs, 911s, and the such....

Anthony
 

dennis

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I totally agree. My point about the Viper and the GT cars is just the one, that there are still lots of fans outside, even if they don't own a Viper, all the enthuasiasts see a Viper racing, and don't tell me there's one in the U.S. that doesn't know the Viper. It's definately more recognizable as a Chrysler product than any prototype will ever be.
Not only talking about LeMans, but also the ALMS, Daytona 24h and so on...

I'm not quite sure if it is waste of money, since GM is also racing with their "car" in LeMans, and uses it for pretty good advertising.
 

VIPERnXr4ti

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I totally agree. My point about the Viper and the GT cars is just the one, that there are still lots of fans outside, even if they don't own a Viper, all the enthuasiasts see a Viper racing, and don't tell me there's one in the U.S. that doesn't know the Viper. It's definately more recognizable as a Chrysler product than any prototype will ever be.
Not only talking about LeMans, but also the ALMS, Daytona 24h and so on...

I'm not quite sure if it is waste of money, since GM is also racing with their "car" in LeMans, and uses it for pretty good advertising.
oh ur right on about the enthusiasts(like myself who LOVED watching the Viper run at lemans) and now find myself staring at my 2 AutoArt Viper GTS-Rs(98 lemans winner, and 00 Daytona winner) remembering watching them on TV kickin Corvette ass!!...and i agree that people know what the Viper is...even if they have never seen one in person they KNOW what the Dodge Viper is...

...and maybe i should have gone into the "waste of money" more...when Chrysler was campaigning the Viper it did little to flaunt its success...and in turn got little exposure from it....even car mags went crazy when the Vettes won at Daytona, but said little about the Vipers doing it the year before...even though the Viper doing it was the more monumental accomplishment...mainly because GM did more to let everyone know that they are kickin ass and Chrysler didnt...and unfortunatly maybe they dont realize it was THEIR fault they didnt get the exposure they should have....


Anthony
 

DEVILDOG

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The Dodge marketing department has got to be one of the worst on earth. Why?...as mentioned above they failed to promote the historic wins they had at FIA, Le Mans, Daytona and ALMS. Therefor, most Americans still think the Vette is the greatest sports car in America(AutoWeek 7/5/04). Why would a marketing department want to promote its "halo" car(being sarcastic)? This is one reason I will keep my GTS since it has an amazing race history. I don't think SRTs are going to have one. The marketing professionals at Dodge are probably busy 24/7 trying to figure out how to beat Chevy's fantastic success at having one of its nascar drivers(Dale Jr.) on a "collectable" KFC chicken bucket! Class shows! :rolleyes: Get a clue Dodge and DC!!!
 

Saleen-Explorer

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The Dodge marketing department has got to be one of the worst on earth. Why?...as mentioned above they failed to promote the historic wins they had at FIA, Le Mans, Daytona and ALMS. Therefor, most Americans still think the Vette is the greatest sports car in America(AutoWeek 7/5/04). Why would a marketing department want to promote its "halo" car(being sarcastic)? This is one reason I will keep my GTS since it has an amazing race history. I don't think SRTs are going to have one. The marketing professionals at Dodge are probably busy 24/7 trying to figure out how to beat Chevy's fantastic success at having one of its nascar drivers(Dale Jr.) on a "collectable" KFC chicken bucket! Class shows! :rolleyes: Get a clue Dodge and DC!!!
I fully agree.

Team ORECA needs to make a comeback, tell the VCA to screw raffles and blah blah, donate it to a good cause, racing :D

When the coupe comes out, I wonder if DC will start making a change. I don't watch Nascar, or drifting, as I'm sure most Viper owners are the same. I'm 22 and always liked Lemans scince I was younger, the younger crowd today basically doesn't care about anything like true racing as they were brought around the slow and delerious crowd.
 

Hisserman

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You're right!! Dodge had the "heartbeat of America" and they fumbled it. They lost Lutz and now Wolfgang, one wonders if they can pull it out. :confused:
 

VIPERnXr4ti

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Team ORECA needs to make a comeback, tell the VCA to screw raffles and blah blah, donate it to a good cause, racing :D
unfortunatly donating money to Oreca right now would probably just allow you to fund one of the Porshces they currently run in some series...wouldnt go to anything with the Viper because as far as i know since Chryler pulled factory support that have had no affiliation....so i wonder if they even touch the Vipers they have left....


Anthony
 
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