Gen V Autoweek

mnc2886 · Oct 16, 2012

Traction control demonstration at 4:17....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDkATucwHiM&feature=youtube_gdata_player

They are really starting to highlight the GTS as a much better car than the base model. Soon enough, we'll have a 911 vs 911 turbo situation...

DMan · Oct 16, 2012

Well depends on your perspective, I see them explaining the compromises in the GTS. it's plainly a slower model for more money. If there's a cultural dichotomy that occurs it'll be "real" viper guys buy the SRT and guys who really want a vette experience and a viper name badge pay more and buy the heavier leather smelling GTS.

I don't think we'll get that cultural rift because of our community, but if there was one, that's the one that is striking to me. Kind of like how we have a population that bashes major stereo upgrades and 20+ inch heavy wheels or any mod that isn't track or perf oriented.

In a 911 turbo you pay more for more perf. In a viper you pay more for a heavier softer car. Big difference IMO.

PDCjonny · Oct 16, 2012

Nice video, although not exactly a "review" since it's Ralph and an SRT engineer discussing their own baby.
More of a commercial.

09 Venom · Oct 16, 2012

I highly doubt that 95% of new Gen V Viper owners will be able to tell by 'seat of their pants' the difference in speed of the 2 models.

DMan said:
Well depends on your perspective, I see them explaining the compromises in the GTS. it's plainly a slower model for more money. If there's a cultural dichotomy that occurs it'll be "real" viper guys buy the SRT and guys who really want a vette experience and a viper name badge pay more and buy the heavier leather smelling GTS.

I don't think we'll get that cultural rift because of our community, but if there was one, that's the one that is striking to me. Kind of like how we have a population that bashes major stereo upgrades and 20+ inch heavy wheels or any mod that isn't track or perf oriented.

In a 911 turbo you pay more for more perf. In a viper you pay more for a heavier softer car. Big difference IMO.

kdaviper · Oct 16, 2012

DMan said:
Well depends on your perspective, I see them explaining the compromises in the GTS. it's plainly a slower model for more money. If there's a cultural dichotomy that occurs it'll be "real" viper guys buy the SRT and guys who really want a vette experience and a viper name badge pay more and buy the heavier leather smelling GTS.

I don't think we'll get that cultural rift because of our community, but if there was one, that's the one that is striking to me. Kind of like how we have a population that bashes major stereo upgrades and 20+ inch heavy wheels or any mod that isn't track or perf oriented.

In a 911 turbo you pay more for more perf. In a viper you pay more for a heavier softer car. Big difference IMO.

The GTS is the faster model around a track. The stiffer track suspension setting offsets the extra weight, according to Ralph in another video.

George Farris · Oct 16, 2012

That car just keeps getting more and more desirable all the time ...

mnc2886 · Oct 16, 2012

DMan said:
Well depends on your perspective, I see them explaining the compromises in the GTS. it's plainly a slower model for more money. If there's a cultural dichotomy that occurs it'll be "real" viper guys buy the SRT and guys who really want a vette experience and a viper name badge pay more and buy the heavier leather smelling GTS.

I don't think we'll get that cultural rift because of our community, but if there was one, that's the one that is striking to me. Kind of like how we have a population that bashes major stereo upgrades and 20+ inch heavy wheels or any mod that isn't track or perf oriented.

In a 911 turbo you pay more for more perf. In a viper you pay more for a heavier softer car. Big difference IMO.

I understand what you're saying. What I am really getting at is I foresee the possibility of highly different Viper models as time goes on. I think it may be a good thing too. I feel confident that the ACR will be vastly different which is what people here seem to desire.

bigmack339 · Oct 16, 2012

"....as well as a dramatic stifness increase." Yep, that's what the new car does.

DMan · Oct 16, 2012

kdaviper said:
The GTS is the faster model around a track. The stiffer track suspension setting offsets the extra weight, according to Ralph in another video.

I guess iut depends on when you talk to him, when I spent time with him he was clear that the SRT was the track car, lighter, faster, etc. And the GTS was the comfort model that so many current and potential owners wanted ... not a bit about the GTS having better perf. But we'll get numbers once the testing in industry happens with real cars, probably around Jan-Feb if we're lucky. I'm sure marketing wise, SRT wants the GTS to be faster so you're paying $20K for more than full stripes and a nice interior, but I'm more skeptical for two reasons ... one because of what I heard from the horses mouth & two because I know marketing people & the $ is important (not being critical, we all know they need to be $ successful & hope they are for sure). I'm sure between the 2 cars it's a drivers race, in a line or on a roadcourse.

Dave.

DMan · Oct 16, 2012

mnc2886 said:
I understand what you're saying. What I am really getting at is I foresee the possibility of highly different Viper models as time goes on. I think it may be a good thing too. I feel confident that the ACR will be vastly different which is what people here seem to desire.

Yea, I agree, I love where SRT is going. I especially love the package after-purchase options they're headed for, I can see getting an SRT and adding aero and other perf pkgs as you go to custom tune the car to your exact desire & stay all SRT equipment. Ford made a great run with this with SVT & FRPP although they've still got the offerings but the SVT branding had gotten soft under the distraction of the Shelby badge marketing. Sorry, lil tangent there.

bcmarly · Oct 16, 2012

3,354 (1,521.4) – Viper model
3,297 (1,495.5) – Viper model with SRT Track
Package
3,431 (1,556.3) – Viper GTS model
3,374 (1,530.4) – Viper GTS model with SRT
Track Package

The difference between the GTS and SRT models is 77lbs. As I perused the VOI 2012 pictures and looked at some of the participants I believe there is more weight loss that can be achieved. LOL

Bobpantax · Oct 16, 2012

So to make it short, the GTS is the SRT with the "delicate soul"options.

ViperGMC · Oct 16, 2012

DMan said:
If there's a cultural dichotomy that occurs it'll be "real" viper guys buy the SRT and guys who really want a vette experience and a viper name badge pay more and buy the heavier leather smelling GTS.

I think this forum would be well served if folks spoke for themselves instead of for others. I don't know what exactly a "real" viper guy is. I have a Viper and I have tracked it more than most people on this forum and I prefer the GTS over the SRT. I am looking forward to what the GTS brings. Being a Viper guy does not mean only driving around town in a winged ******** track vehicle, in fact most Vipers do not have wings on them. Wanting the GTS does not make me a vette seeker. The only Vette I will ever own is a 58". I am looking for something different. I did not buy a Gen IV because there was not enough difference from the Gen III to justify it for me. More HP is easy to get out of these cars when you are looking to go faster. I want new cool stuff, I draw the line at paddles and so when the vette goes there it will be a definite separator. The point is, change is OK fellas, we are big enough to handle it.

05Commemorative · Oct 16, 2012

ViperGMC said:
I think this forum would be well served if folks spoke for themselves instead of for others. I don't know what exactly a "real" viper guy is. I have a Viper and I have tracked it more than most people on this forum and I prefer the GTS over the SRT. I am looking forward to what the GTS brings. Being a Viper guy does not mean only driving around town in a winged ******** track vehicle, in fact most Vipers do not have wings on them. Wanting the GTS does not make me a vette seeker. The only Vette I will ever own is a 58". I am looking for something different. I did not buy a Gen IV because there was not enough difference from the Gen III to justify it for me. More HP is easy to get out of these cars when you are looking to go faster. I want new cool stuff, I draw the line at paddles and so when the vette goes there it will be a definite separator. The point is, change is OK fellas, we are big enough to handle it.

Completely agree.

Jay M · Oct 16, 2012

What is the weight difference between an SRT and a GTS? Would a *********, once a month, track guy really care about a few pounds?

It seems to me that the only reason the SRT exists is so that a current Viper owner doesn't feel like they can't afford a new one. It's a gentle step up in price.

If you've got the money, you might as well get the GTS. For an amateur driver, I don't think the added weight will matter. A professional driver will gut the car anyway.

Being a convertible owner, I can't really take mine to the track, but I do love driving it. Having nice leather, a comfortable seat, a comfortable suspension that absorbs bumps on crappy roads (rather than bouncing across them), a full entertainment system, and navigation doesn't make a the Viper any less awesome, it just makes it better. Then with the twist of a knob on a track day, you have nearly the same setup as an ACR.

Paddle shifters on a Viper? I would love it when I'm stuck in stop and go traffic on the 405. But on the track, or an open road, I think they would be pretty ***. I had the privilege of driving a GT-R the other day. I could not believe how smooth the shifting was. It had the same feel, and lack of feedback, as a video game. Awesome technology, but it felt too much like an automatic.

~Jay

Moundir · Oct 16, 2012

What's up with Ralph calling all the older cars "soft and flacid"?! ***, Ralph! You dont have to bash the older model cars to sell the new one!

PDCjonny · Oct 16, 2012

Moundir said:
What's up with Ralph calling all the older cars "soft and flacid"?! ***, Ralph! You dont have to bash the older model cars to sell the new one!

That's one of my biggest peeves with the whole Gen 5 campaign.
Every review and comparison has to bash the older Generations, in fact they even bring one along to compare how much they ****.
Lot of guys here spent 6 figures for their crappy Gen 4's. Thanks for the appreciation.

ViperGMC · Oct 16, 2012

ViperJon said:
That's one of my biggest peeves with the whole Gen 5 campaign.
Every review and comparison has to bash the older Generations, in fact they even bring one along to compare how much they ****.
Lot of guys here spent 6 figures for their crappy Gen 4's. Thanks for the appreciation.

So let me understand this, when a car company develops a new model it should not be better than the previous model. They should not make any improvements in fear of upsetting the buyers of the earlier models. Hmmm . . . interesting sentiment.

DMan · Oct 16, 2012

ViperGMC said:
I think this forum would be well served if folks spoke for themselves instead of for others. I don't know what exactly a "real" viper guy is. I have a Viper and I have tracked it more than most people on this forum and I prefer the GTS over the SRT. I am looking forward to what the GTS brings. Being a Viper guy does not mean only driving around town in a winged ******** track vehicle, in fact most Vipers do not have wings on them. Wanting the GTS does not make me a vette seeker. The only Vette I will ever own is a 58". I am looking for something different. I did not buy a Gen IV because there was not enough difference from the Gen III to justify it for me. More HP is easy to get out of these cars when you are looking to go faster. I want new cool stuff, I draw the line at paddles and so when the vette goes there it will be a definite separator. The point is, change is OK fellas, we are big enough to handle it.

I agree, i don't think there'll be a rift in our community by models because people speak for themselves. We have a loud group who will, same that bark at radios and traction control, but I don't think it's enough to cause two populations of owners, at least I hope not. All of my vipers are verts, amd you can track them, autoform rollbar FTW. But those who refer to "real" viper guys, I think are a small group by comparison and IMO we'll always be one group. As I put it in another post, car vs car should be a drivers' race on the strip or road course, or as put above, the thinner owner, lol.

As for putting down previous gens, I kind of agree. Lets not forget the ring record, and they can easily speak about the new gen being better without saying the previous gen being bad. Seems like semantics, but not really. But I think once production cars get out there the comparo will be more about exotics costing twice as much, especially for the GTS, it's interior is simply impeccable.

PhoenixGTS · Oct 16, 2012

mnc2886 said:
Traction control demonstration at 4:17...

That looks a lot more like a demonstration that the traction control can be turned off completely with all that smoke.

Moundir · Oct 16, 2012

ViperGMC said:
So let me understand this, when a car company develops a new model it should not be better than the previous model. They should not make any improvements in fear of upsetting the buyers of the earlier models. Hmmm . . . interesting sentiment.

By no means is this how John or I feel! Of course we want improvements! But for the president of the company to call the gen 4s "soft and flaccid" is a slap in the face to the current owners! Stupid move that's not gonna win over many loyal viper owners!

klamathpro · Oct 16, 2012

I would think "a little more soft and placid" would describe the opposite of the Gen IV. The Gen V being "Light-Footed" makes the old one the opposite of "soft and placid". If my 98' GTS is "soft and placid", then the Gen V is "fluffy and sedated".

Previous Vipers should be labeled "hard and raucous".

PDCjonny · Oct 16, 2012

ViperGMC said:
So let me understand this, when a car company develops a new model it should not be better than the previous model. They should not make any improvements in fear of upsetting the buyers of the earlier models. Hmmm . . . interesting sentiment.

The point. It went WAY over your head.

Torquemonster · Oct 16, 2012

Good video. I think that when people talk off the cuff they should be given far more slack than when they give a prepared speech where every word had to be considered. He's being honest but in a context he did not expand on. I took "soft and flacid" to refer to the chassis dynamics not the car itself. Nobody could call the older Vipers soft, but there is apparently a big difference in chassis stiffness. I think that is great.

ViperGMC · Oct 16, 2012

ViperJon said:
The point. It went WAY over your head.

Good lord, that's your response, don't be so insecure.

Bobpantax · Oct 16, 2012

All this typing about soft and flacid and stiff and soft seems a bit peculiar to me. Maybe SRT needs a ****** edition Viper.

Ev1E9 · Oct 16, 2012

Bobpantax said:
All this typing about soft and flacid and stiff and soft seems a bit peculiar to me. Maybe SRT needs a ****** edition Viper.

I guess it will be baby blue?

I believe Ralph was referring to chassis stiffness. I guess you can feel the 50% difference between Gen IV and Gen V.

DMan · Oct 16, 2012

Bobpantax said:
All this typing about soft and flacid and stiff and soft seems a bit peculiar to me. Maybe SRT needs a ****** edition Viper.

Hopefully they will and it'll be called an ACR.

;-)

Mike Adams · Oct 16, 2012

I am buying GTS and going on a diet LOL

mnc2886 · Oct 17, 2012

PhoenixGTS said:
That looks a lot more like a demonstration that the traction control can be turned off completely with all that smoke.

It was intended to be sarcasm...

BTW, ViperJon is right. I think the comments made in all these videos about the previous Viper is inappropriate. For one, take notice it is every video, not just one misspoken sentence. That is the sentiment of the Gen v campaign that supports the attempt to capture a new type of owner. How else would you capture a market that had normally not wanted your product? Bash the old one...

Sorry, but Jon is right and there are better and more classy ways to convey your point.

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