Sat inside the new 2013...DAMN IT !! NO ROOM compared to my gen2

kratedisease said:

The seat in the 2013 was all they way down but the bottom of the seat frame appeared to be at least 4 inches from the floor pan!!!

Why SRT would not get a seat frame with greater ability to completely Lay flat or close to flat on the floorpan amazes me , ESPECIALLY that the roof overhang on the windshield is so low !!!

Yes , I hope that a seat lowering kit will be available......solutution to this 16 year old ergonomic/design flaw of low front roof overhang...

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If it were offered from Mopar that would would show some corporate good will ... more drivers would be able to fit while wearing a helmet as well.

Thanks for your review; it's clear that you still have passion for the GenV.

Yes... Love the new 2013.... I was on the internet constantly following the spy shots right up to the reveal and WOW the car absolutely EXCEEDS my style/design expectations, the side pipes are so cool, the design is a show stopper just like the gen2. The interior is super nicely done and high quality. The hood curves are so cool and exciting.

As an owner of a gen2 I was so disappointed with the gen3 and gen4 design/style...my point of view only.... I like a car that is a bit flashy and emotional

But the small cabin and very low roof overhang on the windshield made me decide NOT to buy the car. You can understand my frustration as I had already mentally "bought" the car with check in hand and I took the day off from work to go to the dealer ( who by the way had a 10G mark up over sticker on the showroom floor, but the owner of the dealership very quickly said he would sell the car for near sticker and was totally negotiable) and was all jacked up to do the deal.

I actually bought my gen2 Viper back in 1997 from Fitzgerld Motorsports/Dodge over the phone with out ever actually seeing or sitting in the car because I was so jacked up
and just had to have one.

Yes, I am a bit bitter that the car has a low front roof overhang, and no shoulder room... and I walked out unhappy.

Woodhouse has lowered the Gen V seat for taller customers, and I believe they've posted how to do this on Facebook.

Thanks, and by the way how do you you like your 2013 ??

VENOM V said:

Woodhouse has lowered the Gen V seat for taller customers, and I believe they've posted how to do this on Facebook.

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Saw the pictures of the lowering of the seat but it only showed a picture of a bolt. Any idea of additional info ??

kratedisease said:

I rarely post on most forums because the conversation tends to degrade to where it is now ( Picture above of treadmill). And comments about Chris Christie .

Its sad when the morons and drop outs push the conversation down to their level...

let me guess "MAKARA" and "Madninjaskillz" ...... you both have dual Phd's in engineering and you both are also physicians ( P.S. thats another fancy word for doctor... you two dopes) so you know that the treadmill will make me shorter and my shoulders will get narrower if use the treadmill, and therefore I will fit better in the car.

Its called READING COMPREHENSION. I said the car is too tight in the shoulder area ( Not abdomen...a fancy word for belly you goofy dopes) and roof over hang drops too low for my height. read my posts again.

VERY SIMPLE ... everyone else who posted got it....

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Oh, good Lord. It's a joke. It wasn't an attack towards you or even directed towards you. Someone else had mentioned that they didn't think that the seat bottom was wide enough and made for kids. It is more in response to that. I've had seat lowering kits in most of my vipers. I believe that Woodhouse posted a thread where the seat could be lowered by taking some spacers out rather than having to get a lowering kit, which is rather nice. As far as shoulder room, I don't know about the Gen V, but my gen IV has less than my Gen I and II seemed to. If your butt is too wide to fit in the seat, perhaps it isn't the car's fault, but the cars certainly are not spacious in the shoulders for athletic people.

Jack B said:

Is this even a legitimate post?

1. Join date 5/13.

2. 15 posts.

3. First love is a vette.

4. How many 300 lb people are comfortable in a Gen2.

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Bingo! Sounds more like a troll looking to stir up trouble and spout off how nice the new C7 is.

Alabaster Mamba said:

Bingo! Sounds more like a troll looking to stir up trouble and spout off how nice the new C7 is.

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Who are you stating is a Troll ?

Does your 97 have an interior bypass door release, for some reason mine did not come with one.

kratedisease said:

went to the dealer yesterday and sat in the new 2013..... big ****... less room inside than my 1997 gts.... I guess Ralph Gilles is not that big of a guy !!. i am 6'2'' and 290lbs and the worst offensively tight area is the left door shoulder room or lack of it since I can barely turn the steering wheel with my left arm because it is wedged between my chest and the left driver door panel.... I left the dealership in my C6 corvette that felt like a motorhome inside compared to the viper....guess I am buying the new C&7 Vette instead... The 2013 viper cabin is tighter than my 1997 GTS viper cabin and the overhang of the roof down to the top edge of the windshield is way too low. Could barely see out off the car unless I ducked down. I see the stupid italian quirky nature added to the car. EVEN the owner of the dealership agreeded the new 2013 was tighter than the old gen 2 cars. so pissed....

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PhoenixGTS said:

For the record, the latest figures out from the Center for Disease Control (yes I know all you guys in Texas surely think this is a communist organization with no credibility) reports these averages for folks in the USA over 20 years old: Men:
Height (inches): 69.3
Weight (pounds): 195.5
Waist circumference (inches): 39.7
Women:
Height (inches): 63.8
Weight (pounds): 166.2
Waist circumference (inches): 37.5
Damn people ARE fat in this country! A 40" waist is AVERAGE for a guy who is 5'9" tall? No wonder I can't find 15 1/2" neck dress shirts that aren't like tents down below.

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That is a fat ass women at 5'3" 166 she wouldn't ride in my viper anyways

Green viper 1 said:

That is a fat ass women at 5'3" 166 she wouldn't ride in my viper anyways

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LOLOLOLOL!!

Perhaps we touched a nerve, eh Mak? lol What does this guy expect coming on here and saying he's a fatty. With all those PhDs you should know that taking care of your body and exercising will aid in health and life expectancy. ... but I digress. The internet is a cruel place. It was just a bit of shinanagins so lighten up. We are all Viper fans here.

Jack B said:

Does your 97 have an interior bypass door release, for some reason mine did not come with one.

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YES, its a lever on the both doors, up by rear top of the door. I assume they all should. Can you post a picture of what your door interior panel looks like

I'm 6'2" and 218 lbs and I found the new SRT felt cramped. It didn't sem to have either the legroom or just room in general like my GenII. I also thought the seat was generally lacking in comfort. As for the car in general---I liked it a whole lot more in person than in pictures. I just don't want to make the equivalent if of a house payment for one when my GTS and my house are both paid for. Cheap I guess.

madninjaskillz said:

Perhaps we touched a nerve, eh Mak? lol What does this guy expect coming on here and saying he's a fatty. With all those PhDs you should know that taking care of your body and exercising will aid in health and life expectancy. ... but I digress. The internet is a cruel place. It was just a bit of shinanagins so lighten up. We are all Viper fans here.

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Thanks for the reply. I just wanted to keep the conversation fact/info based.

By the way I run 3 miles at least once a week and have done so for the last 31 years.

AJ02 said:

I'm 6'2" and 218 lbs and I found the new SRT felt cramped. It didn't sem to have either the legroom or just room in general like my GenII. I also thought the seat was generally lacking in comfort. As for the car in general---I liked it a whole lot more in person than in pictures. I just don't want to make the equivalent if of a house payment for one when my GTS and my house are both paid for. Cheap I guess.

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Thanks for your post.

I was getting grilled and beat up here on the forums for LOVING THE NEW VIPER and going to the dealer ready to buy the GTS only to walk out frustrated because....

1) the roof overhang is way way too low where I can only drive if I duck my head down.... ( totally unsafe and ridiculous in today's automotive market)

2) LESS shoulder room than my 1997 GTS where my left arm is pinned between the door and my chest and I cannot turn the wheel using my left arm.

TWO major issues that made me walk out and NOT buy the car.

If I was not hot for the car I would not be so pissed.

All I was looking to express.....

If it's headroom, I think Woodhouse posted on how you can lower the seat, which I'm tempted to try.

If its width of the seat, consider buying a Recaro or other brand seat that is the size you want. It's amazing how much nicer it is in general to have a seat made to your own size. It's common for racers, but for some reason not many people consider it with street cars (at least not yet).

If it's the distance between the seat back and the steering wheel or pedals, those are adjustable.

While it's tight, I think between these three different areas of "adjustment", there's enough room in the cockpit for most guys < 300 and < 6'5". Above either of those, it's probably not going to work.

Just my $0.02.

P.S. I used to race a Lotus Exige with a full cage, at 6'1", 210, so I'm used to folding myself into somewhat smallish spaces.

Not that I have a dog in this fight (5'6" and 195lbs hehe) but you just have to see the width of the center console to know that it's not a 'relaxed' fit. I'm not pleased to see that my waist size is way smaller than the average woman's waist in the US...but in some ways I'm not shocked either.

The choice of putting the transmission right behind the engine, combined with a longish V-10 configuration means the Viper has centralized its mass a lot more than the late model Corvettes. The V8 is shorter but more importantly put the transmission in the rear, originally pioneered by the Porsche 928 AFAIK. More mass towards the center is better for handling but obviously the driver and passenger are getting splayed out to the sides in the Viper's case.

I'm pretty sure that the only thing that can be done to fix the space issue for my giantish compadres would be to relocate the transmission to the same place the Vette and 928 have it. Everything else would be a small band-aid fix, but custom offset seats (inset to the inside bolsters) might be possible (but potential DoT crash compliance issues and expense).

So u join in May make a couple of posts and mention u own a vette,,,, your stupid attempt is of no intrest.

Why is owning a Vette such a crime? The guy just said he's really broad in the chest and can't fit...does anyone else who is physically similar have this problem? Don't understand why it always seems to be such a drama fest to put anything out there that doesn't make the Viper look perfect...the OP never made a big fuss other than to ask a question that seems legitimate.

Chorps:

Sit way back, get outside the circle and think about it this way:

1. An admitted corvette/first lover with 15 posts starts his tenure at the VCA with criticism.

2. No disrespect to anyone, but, we are discussing why a 300 lb individual isn't comfortable in a sports car. Isn't there something a little strange about that?

3. Do you know of any 300 lb person that is totally comfortable in a Gen II - you don't find that strange? I have a Gen 2 and at 190 lbs I am not totally comfortable. Do I hate the car, no, I love the car. I am a realist and I understand what the limitations are when looking at performance and comfort.

Now lets look at the larger picture, I can point to well over 1000 negative posts in about a dozen Gen V threads . In most, (but not all) those posts come from about a dozen individuals. For the most part they are "Enthusissts" with a limited number of posts. Is any of that familiar and you wonder why the "VCA Members" on this board are just tired of the sh... Lastly, in most cases the premise of the GEN V deficiency has been proven to be false or over exaggerated.

I expect my Gen V soon and I will measure both my Gen II and the Gen V relative to the seat centerline. I will post those results and also give everyone a seat-of-the-pants review about the relative comfort. Before we condemn, let's analyze, re-analyze, then, publish.

Sincerely

Your Servant and Dedicated Engineer

chorps said:

Why is owning a Vette such a crime? The guy just said he's really broad in the chest and can't fit...does anyone else who is physically similar have this problem? Don't understand why it always seems to be such a drama fest to put anything out there that doesn't make the Viper look perfect...the OP never made a big fuss other than to ask a question that seems legitimate.

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Jack;

You do not have to measure them as I can tell you from first-hand experience that the GEN V has a lot more room than the previous models. My first Viper, a GEN III Coupe was tight feeling and had overhang in the front roof, BUT that is what I loved about it for a coupe. The seats were tighter across the mid-shoulder (but no different than other modern sport or racing seats with support), while the seat bottoms were just fine but I have wider shoulders considering I am 5' 8" and 190 lbs, athletic to amateur body builder shape in dimensions only, not visual or cut like that.

Now my second Viper, a 96’ RT/10 seems to have a lot of room too but has no windows, no roof, etc. so everything just hangs out. The GEN 1, 1.5 & 2 seats are more comfortable for me personally because they do not have as much lateral support built into them at the mid shoulder level so my wide back can just go across. I notice my right leg touches the driver side speaker in the Gen 1.5 whereas in my GEN III Coupe it never touched so the GEN III coupe seems to have more space to me than my GEN 1.5 RT/10 does.

When SRT was out here in the Rockies doing High Altitude testing a couple of times the past couple of years and being inside and around the those cars as well as the GEN V GTS show and GTS-R race cars at the Bandimere Mile High Nationals last year, I have been in multiple GEN V cars and they all felt the same. I felt small in the new GEN V interior. I sat lower in the seat, the door panel seemed higher at eye line and with the lowered console it just had a lot more room than previous GENs. I did notice the seats, which had a ton of additional lateral support in the lower and mid should sections did seem more confining to my back build, however the lower section was not pinching in any area. Maybe SRT should offer a less lateral aggressively bolster seat as an option. You know like the ones the VCA members apparently chose at VOI11 in SLC. I believe that to be a missed step that Sergio called them “barkalougers” and to remove them. I love cool seats too which the new ones are, but then there is comfort to consider. I believe the seats the VCA members chose at VOI11 would be a nice idea for them to consider as an option. Having a

The interior has more room period, end of story, no reason to even measure. If people want the more adjustable seat, pony up and buy the GTS or add in the seat lowering measures to the SRT. I thought from the various GEN V models I sat in, that the seat went up and down in the GEN V GTS I was in. Did they do away with that feature? It certainly wasn’t 4” off the floor. This is not a ½ ton truck with a bench seat. The mere mention of such is ridiculous.

Common sense states that if someone who has a previous GEN Viper all these years is willing to go in and *****-nilly plunk down six figures on a new car but cannot plunk down $100+ dollars on a VCA membership, something just does not add up.

I am all for open forums but the extreme Vette pushers, Viper degrading comments have gone from basic car guy mutual respect, admiration and slight rubbing to anything that can be said to devalue and degrade the new Viper, SRT and Ralph, all to drive people away. I am sorry but that is wrong and should not be tolerated. It is no longer a situation of you cannot say anything negative about the new car or criticize certain points of the design to now personal attacks on Ralph or the entire SRT organization or all aspects of the Viper. If that is what it means to be a diehard Vette fan, have at it and go with your own kind. But have enough self respect to just not degrade the SRT product or the Viper in the process when the door hits you behind on the way out. The one time you should use that “inner voice”.

Sure I say bad things about the Vette as it is just not for me and I don’t like them. Not all of them but most, especially the new one. I just cannot see the appeal on an unproven car like this. It’s my prerogative and god given free right in provide my opinion in my house within the bounds of good taste, but you don’t see me on Vette forms doing everything I can to down play the vette in their home to try to drive everyone to another brand like Viper.

VCA, this is our house and why the negativity and model Viper degradation is continually being tolerated is beyond me.

The new car is not perfect but then again it is not a failure either. There is a lot to be said about the fact it is still here.

The new car has shallower side bolsters. This allows a little more spillover for bigger folks. The door panels are also deeper but you have to get below the window sill to get any benefit. The pedals are also moved closer to center. So much so that if you center your foot on the gas pedal you rub the transmission tunnel. Having had all Generations of Vipers I find the Gen I and II the roomiest. Gen V comes in second and Gen III and IV third.

Jack,

Thanks for taking the time to put out a well reasoned response. That's all I'm talking about, there's nothing wrong with refuting the original question, but having some numbers behind the response (and question) would be much better than attacking the messenger.

One of the things that I disliked about the Porsche seats (not sure which ones, but it was a first gen Cayman), was the wings (lateral lower back bolsters) seemed to come way up...like it was designed for a guy who was really tall. It cut into my lats and I didn't find it comfortable at all. Maybe the OP has an issue that is similar? It'd be nice if the Viper was designed to fit 100% of the people who want to buy a Viper, but honestly with such a big transmission in the middle the interior room is pretty tight.

I drove my buddy's Gen II without any issues, I find it as comfy as any other car, the Gen IV is a little long in the cushion but I'm only 5'6"-5'7".

My friend who is 5'10" and 260 pounds fits in my Gen IV without complaint and he's built like your traditional strongman wrestler with the thick sausage fingers. If the OP doesn't fit, he doesn't fit, but I'm more interested in the quantitative portion of how he doesn't fit. If the numbers don't match up, it could be BS, but until the numbers are proven, is it so difficult to be civil?

As to which way the OP leans, he claims to own a C6 vert and a Gen2 GTS...I'm guessing the Gen V seat design might be too svelte for his big frame.

Jack B said:

Chorps:

Sit way back, get outside the circle and think about it this way:

1. An admitted corvette/first lover with 15 posts starts his tenure at the VCA with criticism.

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Coloviper said:

Common sense states that if someone who has a previous GEN Viper all these years is willing to go in and *****-nilly plunk down six figures on a new car but cannot plunk down $100+ dollars on a VCA membership, something just does not add up.

...

The new car is not perfect but then again it is not a failure either. There is a lot to be said about the fact it is still here.

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Just checked out the OP's posting history and his first posts were about Gen2 info...nothing critical about the Gen V there... not sure about how this tenure thing works but I doubt he's willing to plunk down any kind of dough to join a community that eats their own.

I don't think anyone's claimed that the Gen V has been a failure but everyone on the forums seems to make every little statement a zero-sum game. I'm just wondering if the fist-pounding on the pulpit is pushing people away from the community and just leaving a bunch of die-hards that look cross-eyed at anyone new just because they're 'not from around these parts'.

I've sat in a Gen III-IV, & V. The Gen V had more interior room, but it wasn't a massive difference. The car has a true cockpit feel. I wouldn't want it any different. My shoulder's are pretty broad and at 6'0" and 225 lbs, I was pushing the interior room at the arms and shoulders, but I can certainly see how a 300 lb dude would have some comfort issues. Maybe they'll put the transmission in the rear and make more room on the inside someday, but it would change the character of the car so I hope not.

Referencing my concern about shoulder room in the Gen V, I went to the only dealer in the KC area that has any Gen V (LE), and was able to talk them into letting me sit in it and compare to my 2003. There is plenty of leg room for this 6'-1" guy, and the shoulder problem I had is not there in the current model. The salesman said they changed the side bolsters so that there is more room up there in the shoulders. I did notice the head knocking problem getting into the car, but that was true of the 2003, if I remember correctly. Also the headroom seemed less with the seat all the way back and down, with my head about 1" from the roof, and hair touching. I suspect the Woodhouse mod would fix this "sort of" problem. AND, hair continues to depart my head, so ---. Bottom line: it is just fine with to this slender guy (170 lbs), and has plenty of room. (sorry for no paragraphs, but cannot figure out how to do them on this board)

Jack B said:

Chorps:

Sit way back, get outside the circle and think about it this way:

1. An admitted corvette/first lover with 15 posts starts his tenure at the VCA with criticism.

2. No disrespect to anyone, but, we are discussing why a 300 lb individual isn't comfortable in a sports car. Isn't there something a little strange about that?

3. Do you know of any 300 lb person that is totally comfortable in a Gen II - you don't find that strange? I have a Gen 2 and at 190 lbs I am not totally comfortable. Do I hate the car, no, I love the car. I am a realist and I understand what the limitations are when looking at performance and comfort.

Now lets look at the larger picture, I can point to well over 1000 negative posts in about a dozen Gen V threads . In most, (but not all) those posts come from about a dozen individuals. For the most part they are "Enthusissts" with a limited number of posts. Is any of that familiar and you wonder why the "VCA Members" on this board are just tired of the sh... Lastly, in most cases the premise of the GEN V deficiency has been proven to be false or over exaggerated.

I expect my Gen V soon and I will measure both my Gen II and the Gen V relative to the seat centerline. I will post those results and also give everyone a seat-of-the-pants review about the relative comfort. Before we condemn, let's analyze, re-analyze, then, publish.

Sincerely

Your Servant and Dedicated Engineer

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Very Interesting that again I am attacked and discredited.... I find this very sad that I MUST NOT find any flaws or "shortcommings" in the new Viper ( solely of my opinion) or you will disparage and discredit me over a friggen car.... you are insane.... we are talking about a friggen car .... NOT talking religion or Politics or how your wife or daughter looks !! I never said your wife has a big nose or that your daughter is flat chested....( BUT you act torward me as if I did) OMG!!! You are so UPSET as if I am criticizing your daughter ...god forbid I do not LOVE EVERYTHING about the gen5 Viper...... You really are SICK.... something is wrong with you.....do YOU HAVE SEX WITH YOUR VIPER ?? I am sorry but I have so many different interests that I cannot be on this form solely continually answering others discrediting comments ...... how dare I be 290lbs and complain about lack of room. You really are sick !! AND I how dare I be tall and complain about roof overhang ??? Surely The GEN 5 viper is perfect.... it is my height that is flawed...

I know.,, according to you I am a plant and it is my goal, as a 290lb guy, to single handedly make sure that no one buys the gen5 Viper .... because as we all know EVERYONE who buys a Viper is 290lbs exactly like me... YOU ARE VERY VERY SICK JACK B.

We're going to go ahead and close this one, it's going nowhere but downhill. But if anyone is interested in the bolt thing which as we understand it you take it out and you get some more height then contact Mark Jorgensen at Woodhouse Dodge, Blair NE. Changing the height might change the shoulder issue a bit as well.