Convince Me! Gen I vs Gen II

HardHitter · Mar 26, 2014

Hello All,

As you may know, I have been looking to get into an RT/10. I recently found a Gen I RT/10 that I thought I had my heart set on but now I'm having "second thoughts". This is the car in question: http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/cto/4325274086.html

The car has 40,*** miles on it, 2nd owner, was repainted and has a good amount of modifications to it (brembo front brakes, iforged 3 piece wheels, smooth tubes, k&n filters, borla exhaust, redone interior, sound system, adjustable suspension, hard top) and I can grab it for $26K. All of those modifications are what I would do to the car myself. I had a PPI done and the diff seems to be going bad, the hood springs don't hold the hood up anymore, etc.

I have yet to see the car because it is 300 miles away so I think that is one reason why, but the other reason why is how so many people say "don't get a Gen I and save your money for a Gen II"

The Gen II's I've seen are practically stock and are asking a good amount more than what this car is ($10K more) http://dodgevipersforsale.com/dodge-vipers-for-sale.htm the 2001 is the one I'm looking at and you can see that he's asking a pretty penny at $36.5k for it with just hard top and borla exhaust.

I can afford it, but obviously everyone is looking to get the "best bang for their buck" so I ask:

Gen I owners, why did you buy a Gen I over a Gen II? Would you do it again?
Gen II owners, why did you buy a Gen II over a Gen I? Would you do it again?
The $26K car vs the $36K car, which would you go for and why?

Mopar Steve · Mar 26, 2014

That is strong money for a gen 1 with 40k miles and no air. Doubt you could get your money back out of it if you were not thrilled with it. 23,500 would be all I would pay max. Clean original cars out there for less money.

SRToad4 · Mar 26, 2014

Gen 2 is refined in pretty much every way. It is faster, handles better, rides smoother, comfier, etc. I mean who wants to clip in windows every time they park the car? I also personally hate Gen 1 interiors with a passion.

Indy · Mar 26, 2014

Gen2 is a much more modern car in every sense...the Gen1 is a Kitcar in feel - it still is an awesome car, but lacks the refinement of the Gen2. Engine, suspension , interior etc....

Indy · Mar 26, 2014

http://www.theviperregistry.org/features.php

Check out this page for the changes for the different years....

whatthe · Mar 27, 2014

the price does seem to high for the car. I have a 94 that's a fun car. I don't race it pretty much use it as a regular car. You do have to pick your days weather wise to use the car. I paid 24k the car is not perfect but neither was the the price Find a better Gen 1 have some fun learn about the car and barring a major repair job you can probably get most if not all of your money back if you want a newer car later

7TH_SIGN · Mar 27, 2014

All these threads were started by you pertaining to the same question you are asking in this very thread. I don't know how else to convince you sir.

http://www.supraforums.com/forum/showthread.php?772626-Could-use-some-Viper-owners-insight
http://www.viperalley.com/forum/viper-discussions-gen-i/156362-gen-ii-worth-money.html
http://www.viperalley.com/forum/viper-discussions-gen-i/157482-convince-me-gen-i.html
http://forums.viperclub.org/threads/670508-Convince-Me!-Gen-I-vs-Gen-II
http://forums.viperclub.org/threads/670438-Gen-2-worth-the-money-even-if-Gen-1-is-modded
http://forums.viperclub.org/threads/670508-Convince-Me!-Gen-I-vs-Gen-II
http://forums.viperclub.org/threads/670390-Classic-Muscle-vs-Modern-Muscle

Darth Menace · Mar 27, 2014

I think he wants to be convinced one way or another, and will keep making the threads until the Gen II is the same price as the Gen 1. The the problem will be solved

Sybil TF · Mar 27, 2014

Get the Gen II. And get a GTS. Case closed.

rdutko · Mar 27, 2014

It's only been 3 years deciding. Give a guy a break

Darth Menace · Mar 27, 2014

I thought my six months was bad, but that involved pricing, etc.. I had the Gen II GTS chosen earlier. There are a few more car forums he should ask though

Matt M PA · Mar 27, 2014

The OP shows a Gen 1 with a repaint, and aftermarket "upgrades" vs a clean Gen 2 apparently with no stories. In my book...you're far better off buying a better car upfront. In this case, the 01 is the better choice of the two.

That being said, I prefer the Gen 1 RT over the Gen 2. All a matter of taste...no right....no wrong.

I'm probably not "average" in this regard, but I personally find a Viper with aftermarket mods as not desireable.

The OP really has to decide which Gen he wants...then find that car.

klamathpro · Mar 28, 2014

You need to go test drive both. The GEN-1 is amazing to anyone that never had a Viper. The GEN-2 is amazing to GEN-1 owners once they drive it. The suspension on the GEN-2 is completely redesigned, the chassis is 50% stiffer, and rear exit just sounds better on a stock 708 cam, the interior is better. The only thing I think the GEN-1 has over the GTS are more comfortable seats. My cousin who is a tall model with a sensitive back preferred the seats of the GEN-1 or the GEN-2 and nearly cried when I told her I sold it. I had my GEN-1 for over 7 years when I sold it last fall. Having the GTS, I really don't miss it much, maybe a little. It had 26k miles and sold for $26k. I would not buy the GEN-1 you are considering, there are better ones for the money. Personally a GEN-2 at $36k is about near the bottom of the market for a clean one so I would just pony up the extra dough if you have it.

Camfab · Mar 28, 2014

So you'll really be into the Gen I for about 29K after you fix the known issues, vs. a near mint car from a reputable dealer. It's really a no brainer if you value your money.

mtmclaughlin · Mar 28, 2014

Dude, if you're looking for us to say "buy generation I (or II) because it is a logical, rational choice", you will never get an answer. Buying a Viper of any generation is far from logical and definitely not rational if your objective is transportation. I would defer you to the Toyota Prius, the Chevrolet Volt, or the Fiat 500 (even the Abarth--no, especially the Abarth); then I'd tell you to keep it for 15 years. That's the logical thing to do. Heck, don't tell any of the other members I said this, but if you want an affordable big-engine roadster that has any measure of reason to it, buy a Corvette.

(*runs and hides*)

If you are looking for a poll of which Viper appears to be the most popular, it appears to be the Generation II car. If that is your standard, man, go get one and have fun! I made the fortunate decision of asking my Dad what he thought I should do when I was considering buying one (thinking he would be the voice of reason). He said, "when can we go get it?". When that failed to stop me, I finally approached my best friend and asked his opinion. He said, "well, you know me. I buy stupid stuff all the time and I'm happy!". That sealed the deal for me. If you're looking for that voice of un-reason, here it is:

Go buy the nicest GEN I or GEN II Viper you can afford. Just do it. Stop pondering.

Now, that car you're looking at for $26k: that's a nice looking car (the black GEN I). I can tell you that I bought an almost totally original (except for the pipes and smooth tubes), red 1994 with a hardtop and 10,000 fewer miles for a price that would put you within your budget. It was and still is absolutely perfect. As a 1994, it's also a first generation car and I have to bring the windows and top with me everywhere I go, I have to unzip the window to open the door, the radio came straight from the 1994 Dodge Neon, and the interior is the most spartan space I've ever had the pleasure to occupy. THAT is what I wanted! So that is what I went and got. If I wanted glass windows, I would have bought a Generation II.

I bought mine from a forum member here, actually, and I couldn't have been happier. In fact, I recommend this avenue. See if you can find somebody who wants to sell you his Viper on this forum and just go buy that. Usually, you can dig up a lot about the history of the car just by the caliber of person posting. Here, it's a really easy thing too: I haven't encountered a bad egg anywhere on this forum. In fact, a lot of people took time to speak to me over the phone and helped me bring emotion out of the hunt, educated me on the car, and then just chatted about how much fun they are.

To answer your question directly:

I bought a GEN I Viper--on purpose--six months ago. Many people recommended a GEN II, because they ARE better cars, but I wanted the first generation. I wanted zipper windows that you have to snap in and secure with a thumb screw because that is in the essence of this brutal sports car. I wanted NO exterior door handles because that was in keeping with the Shelby Cobra that its design was inspired by. Factory AC? Nope. It had to be installed by the dealer. Side pipes? Yes, please. Anything that they did to soften the Viper over the years was just great, honestly, but I didn't want the softened car with cruise control, ABS, or airbags. I wanted that three-spoke steering wheel with the little snake in the middle. I think the fact that the car has door locks, but no way of using them to actually secure the car (they're there for safety while you're driving) is hilarious. The owner's manual talks about the standard-issue Chrysler remote lock fob like this: "The [Lock] button arms the alarm. It does not lock the doors. The [Unlock] button disarms the alarm. It does not unlock the doors. The [picture of a car's trunk] button is not active and is not used." There is a button on my key fob that does literally nothing. I can hear a little sound under the dash where the computer is trying to trigger a trunk release, but there simply isn't one.

That all makes me happy. I would buy a car just like this again if I had the chance. I've owned four convertibles (three have been roadsters), a motorcycle, and a four door sedan. I daily drove the motorcycle (a Buell Lightning sportbike) every day for two or three years and put 20,000 miles on it--rain, shine, snow, or sleet. I rode it 300 miles to the beach in 90 degree weather from New York City while my friends put their bikes on trailers. That made me happy. Coincidentally, the Viper is faster and it doesn't fall over when you push on it.

My $0.02.

HardHitter · Mar 28, 2014

mtmclaughlin said:
Dude, if you're looking for us to say "buy generation I (or II) because it is a logical, rational choice", you will never get an answer. Buying a Viper of any generation is far from logical and definitely not rational if your objective is transportation. I would defer you to the Toyota Prius, the Chevrolet Volt, or the Fiat 500 (even the Abarth--no, especially the Abarth); then I'd tell you to keep it for 15 years. That's the logical thing to do. Heck, don't tell any of the other members I said this, but if you want an affordable big-engine roadster that has any measure of reason to it, buy a Corvette.

(*runs and hides*)

If you are looking for a poll of which Viper appears to be the most popular, it appears to be the Generation II car. If that is your standard, man, go get one and have fun! I made the fortunate decision of asking my Dad what he thought I should do when I was considering buying one (thinking he would be the voice of reason). He said, "when can we go get it?". When that failed to stop me, I finally approached my best friend and asked his opinion. He said, "well, you know me. I buy stupid stuff all the time and I'm happy!". That sealed the deal for me. If you're looking for that voice of un-reason, here it is:

Go buy the nicest GEN I or GEN II Viper you can afford. Just do it. Stop pondering.

Now, that car you're looking at for $26k: that's a nice looking car (the black GEN I). I can tell you that I bought an almost totally original (except for the pipes and smooth tubes), red 1994 with a hardtop and 10,000 fewer miles for a price that would put you within your budget. It was and still is absolutely perfect. As a 1994, it's also a first generation car and I have to bring the windows and top with me everywhere I go, I have to unzip the window to open the door, the radio came straight from the 1994 Dodge Neon, and the interior is the most spartan space I've ever had the pleasure to occupy. THAT is what I wanted! So that is what I went and got. If I wanted glass windows, I would have bought a Generation II.

I bought mine from a forum member here, actually, and I couldn't have been happier. In fact, I recommend this avenue. See if you can find somebody who wants to sell you his Viper on this forum and just go buy that. Usually, you can dig up a lot about the history of the car just by the caliber of person posting. Here, it's a really easy thing too: I haven't encountered a bad egg anywhere on this forum. In fact, a lot of people took time to speak to me over the phone and helped me bring emotion out of the hunt, educated me on the car, and then just chatted about how much fun they are.

To answer your question directly:

I bought a GEN I Viper--on purpose--six months ago. Many people recommended a GEN II, because they ARE better cars, but I wanted the first generation. I wanted zipper windows that you have to snap in and secure with a thumb screw because that is in the essence of this brutal sports car. I wanted NO exterior door handles because that was in keeping with the Shelby Cobra that its design was inspired by. Factory AC? Nope. It had to be installed by the dealer. Side pipes? Yes, please. Anything that they did to soften the Viper over the years was just great, honestly, but I didn't want the softened car with cruise control, ABS, or airbags. I wanted that three-spoke steering wheel with the little snake in the middle. I think the fact that the car has door locks, but no way of using them to actually secure the car (they're there for safety while you're driving) is hilarious. The owner's manual talks about the standard-issue Chrysler remote lock fob like this: "The [Lock] button arms the alarm. It does not lock the doors. The [Unlock] button disarms the alarm. It does not unlock the doors. The [picture of a car's trunk] button is not active and is not used." There is a button on my key fob that does literally nothing. I can hear a little sound under the dash where the computer is trying to trigger a trunk release, but there simply isn't one.

That all makes me happy. I would buy a car just like this again if I had the chance. I've owned four convertibles (three have been roadsters), a motorcycle, and a four door sedan. I daily drove the motorcycle (a Buell Lightning sportbike) every day for two or three years and put 20,000 miles on it--rain, shine, snow, or sleet. I rode it 300 miles to the beach in 90 degree weather from New York City while my friends put their bikes on trailers. That made me happy. Coincidentally, the Viper is faster and it doesn't fall over when you push on it.

My $0.02.

Really appreciate your feedback and your 2 cents. Here are my thoughts

Why I want RT/10 over GTS
I owned a 2000 Miata as a daily driver and had a 6.0L GTO as my weekend driver. The Miata was my first convertible car and I never had the top up on the car. Even when I parked, I left the top down, never locked my car and just never had anything inside the car that was valuable because they'd be able to just pick it up and walk off with it. I sold the Miata and missed that. The RT/10 gives you the same opportunity of enjoying the California sun, which would be the only time I'd drive the Viper anyway, but it also comes with a hard top for if I want to cruise around with a top.

Why I like a Gen I over Gen II
Honestly, its the just side pipes

Ideal car
Black on Black Gen II Rt/10 with side pipes. My understanding is that the Gen II only offered black exterior in 1999 and 2000. In addition, the 708 cam and forged motor stopped in 1999. Therefore, I would be looking for a Black 1999 RT/10. That is going to be looking for a needle in a haystack haha

7TH_SIGN · Mar 28, 2014

HardHitter,
Everyone has given you the difference between the GEN I RT and GEN II GTS. We also shared with you why we picked a RT or GTS.

You can go on forever reading what we have to say. You will never truly know which version is for you until you get behind the wheel and test drive both.

Indy · Mar 28, 2014

...and the hood on the Gen2 looks far better with the air louvres and naca inlet in my opinion...and you will get a better sound with the exhaust pipes exiting in the same location - but you are right, the side pipes do look really nice. Too bad they also got rid of the 3 spoke wheels, one of my all time favourite designs. Good luck in your search! BTW: Check out some other colours too - they all look awesome

Darth Menace · Mar 28, 2014

HardHitter said:
Therefore, I would be looking for a Black 1999 RT/10. That is going to be looking for a needle in a haystack haha

You're right...my fingers are bloodied from all the effort

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...=[DODGE[VIPER[]][]]&listingId=350376414&Log=0

WSAYERS80 · Mar 29, 2014

I have a Gen 2. 2002 GTS Final Edition.. Its in the shop due to a common issue vipers seem to have with crank bolts. However the Gen 1 RT\10 was my dream car till the GTS came out then I was in love with that. Later gen 2 01' and 02's they introduced ABS and better shocks.. You really just need to figure out what you like and just go for it.

rusty96 · Mar 29, 2014

I will have to agree with the other posts. You have to drive each one to make up your they are both two completely different cars, If I had to compare I would say the gen 1 is more like a muscle car, and the gen 2 a super car. I would say I like them both, so buy a cheap gen 1, then save up and buy the gen 2. And have the best of both worlds.

jdeft1 · Mar 29, 2014

um......, my old gen 1 kicks ass, I don't give a **** about the newer cars (much) and really don't care lately. My gen 1 is for sale: BTW.....,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G89eTU3ZZTo

mtmclaughlin · Mar 30, 2014

Thank you for posting that video, by the way. I won't see or hear mine for a while still (stupid winter just won't end) and I almost forgot how completely bonkers these things sound idling (and doing everything else). I actually put on my headphones to hear it better!

rusty96 · Mar 30, 2014

I will have to agree with the other posts. You have to drive each one to make up your mind, they are both two completely different cars, If I had to compare I would say the gen 1 is more like a muscle car, and the gen 2 a super car. I would say I like them both, so buy a cheap gen 1, then save up and buy the gen 2. And have the best of both worlds.

kratedisease · Mar 30, 2014

gen 2 is a better car. newer =better.

Darth Menace · Mar 31, 2014

kratedisease said:
gen 2 is a better car. newer =better.

Hmmmmmmmm.......very vague answer there

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/03/1969_Ford_Mustang.jpg

VS

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/foru...about-camber-kit-2003-mustang-gt-p1010205.jpg

FrankBarba · Mar 31, 2014

I'll take an unmolested Gen I Please.....

Convince Me! Gen I vs Gen II

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