Oil Weight?

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franchise

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not to be picky here...but it is the same as european cars...so it says "european car formula" on the mobil 1 0w-40 bottle...
 

Stuntman

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Steve, do you have any experience with Shell Rotella T6 5W40?

It seems to have a great additive package and very positive UOAs in the BMW world.
 

Dom426h

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Stuntman,

T6 is what i've been running for the past several changes. Street & Track, and I drive Hard:drive:
It was recommended by our previous resident fluids guru Tom who taught me a lot about fluids & additives.

It usually goes on sale once a month or so at Advance or Autozone where I used to grab a couple jugs.
Normal Price 28. On sale for 25.

Now that I have amazonprime its 21.74 shipped to my doorstep.:2tu:
 

USMCLY

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im with Dom, I have been using T6 in everything. I did for my old viper and my supercharged viper. Walmart sells it for 21$ as well.
 

Stuntman

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FYI:

Mobil 1 10W30:

Kinematic Viscosity at 40*C (ambient): 63
Kinematic Viscosity at 100*C (212*F): 9.86
SUS Viscosity @ 210*F: 61.72
High Temp High Shear: 3
Flashpoint: 367*F
Molybdnum: 65
Titanium:0
Boron: 75
Silicon: 15
Sodium: 6
Calcium: 2617
Magnesium: 28
Phosphorus: 675
Zinc: 780

Mobil 1 0W40:

Kinematic Viscosity at 40*C (ambient): 75-80
Kinematic Viscosity at 100*C (212*F): 13.4-13.5
SUS Viscosity @ 210*F: 71.5
High Temp High Shear: 3.8
Flashpoint: 430*F
Molybdnum: 72
Titanium: 0
Boron: 186
Silicon: 4
Sodium: 6
Calcium: 2683
Magnesium: 13
Phosphorus: 896
Zinc:995

Shell Rotella T6 5W40:

Kinematic Viscosity at 40*C (ambient): 87
Kinematic Viscosity at 100*C (212*F): 13.6-14.2
SUS Viscosity @ 210*F: 72.5-73.3
High Temp High Shear: 3.8
Flashpoint: 446*F
Molybdnum: 63
Titanium:0
Boron: 65
Silicon: 3
Sodium: 4
Calcium: 820
Magnesium: 1261
Phosphorus: 1123
Zinc: 1257

Mobil 1 15W50:

Kinematic Viscosity at 40*C (ambient): 125
Kinematic Viscosity at 100*C (212*F): 17.5-18
SUS Viscosity @212*F:
High Temp High Shear: 4.5
Flashpoint: 450*F
Molybdnum: 71
Titanium: 0
Boron: 150
Silicon: 6
Sodium: 6
Calcium: 2824
Magnesium: 165
Phosphorus: 1064
Zinc: 1238


Quick analysis:

-In order of thickness (both at ambient (~70*F) and 212*F): M1 10W30 - M1 0W40 - T6 5W40 - M1 15W50. M1 0W40 is not thinner than 10W30 at ambient temperature.
-In order of Flashpoints & HTHS (highest to lowest): M1 15W50 - T6 5W40 - M1 0W40 - M1 10W30
-From a Zinc & Phosphorous standpoint (ZDDP), Rotella T6 has the strongest anti-wear additive package.
-M1 products have a slightly higher Boron anti-wear additive than Rotella T6.
-They all have similar Molybdnum anti-wear additives.
-M1 products have similar detergent (Calcium & Magnesium) additives, while Rotella T6 uses more Magnesium with similar levels to Calcium while M1 heavily uses Calcium and very little Magnesium.

...So there probably is no reason to choose M1 10W30 when you have M1 0W40 and 15W50 to choose from, and Shell Rotella T6 has a great additive package and viscosity and performance wise is a good middleground between these two.
 

BYAIC

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Nice thread! I’m about to do a fresh oil change and I see that Mobil 1 has a High Mileage formula now, it says for cars over 75,000 miles that it cleans all of the sludge in one oil change and helps “prevent“ leaks. I’m seriously considering it this go round, I have about 66K miles.

Any thoughts or advice?
 
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MoparMap

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If you regularly change oil anyway I don't think I'd be too worried about sludge to clean out, even at higher mileage. That being said, I think it does have some extra additives that help old seals swell just a little bit to make them seal better. At least I think that is was I had read in the past. With modern o-ring designs maybe that isn't as big of a deal, but probably can't hurt.

Generally speaking from what I've read and heard, as long as you keep it fresh pretty much any oil will do the job effectively. Weight is probably a bigger concern than anything else, but even that can have a range in any car. The new Hemis were really particular about oil weight because of the MDS system. I don't know if the gen 4 and 5 might be similar due to the VVT as well, but there are plenty of people tracking gen 4s with a heavier oil I think, so probably not as big a deal for them. Blackstone did a paper a while back that looked at a single common engine and all the different oils people had put in it and the results pretty much said it didn't matter as long as you changed it regularly. Wear amounts for all the different materials were pretty much in line across all the different brands. I suppose everyone's driving style and use cases are different though, so hard to tell. I know on my car I don't like to get it out if it's not going to fully get up to temp in whatever trip I'm doing. Short trips like that are harder on oil because the temps don't get up high enough to boil off any condensation that might have formed.

At this point though I have just gotten in the habit of sending a sample to Blackstone whenever I do an oil change. It's cheap enough insurance and I'm even more paranoid after my rebuild. My latest one read high in copper and iron which has me a bit worried, but it's also the first change I've done after the dozen or so dyno runs I did back to back when getting it tuned, so I'm hoping it was just some initial break in. They suggested just changing it early and checking back in to see if the levels are still high or if they have gotten more in line with typical numbers. Easier to catch a worn bearing now than to replace a spun bearing and all the domino damage it can cause later.
 

BYAIC

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I went with the general consensus here and used 0W40 for my oil change this go round instead of the 10W30. Two issues popped up that I could use some advice / input about.

1. I only put 10 quarts, maybe slightly less because of some spillage. But on my dipstick the oil shows above the “safe” line. Should I add the other 1/2 quart?

2. When starting the car the Oil Pressure light is illuminated for an uncomfortable period of time, 2-4 seconds. Anyone ever experienced this after an oil change?
 

MoparMap

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If your dipstick is showing okay I think you're likely fine. Realistically speaking the oil quantities in the manual assume a dry engine I believe, which you'll never really be able to get in practice with a standard oil change. There is always going to be some residual in the engine, and as big as our engines are that could be a reasonable amount. I assume you checked after you ran the car as well? The oil filter can hold a surprising amount of oil I've found. I never used to prefill them before I had the Viper, but have gotten more in the habit of doing that, at least on cars where it's easier to do (like something with a vertical filter).

My oil pressure light is similar, even just with day to day use, not only on a change. Do you have a gen 3 or 4? When I did my rebuild I changed out to gen 4 style main bearings. They have a longer oil groove to keep oil going to the rods for more of the crank rotation, but that leads to less oil pressure at low rpm at least since there is less resistance to flow now. I used to idle at 50 psi, but with the new bearings it's more like 20-30 when warmed up. I guess what I'm getting at is that lower idle pressure would take longer to put out the oil light I would expect, so you might still be getting flow just fine, but not necessarily the pressure.
 

BYAIC

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If your dipstick is showing okay I think you're likely fine. Realistically speaking the oil quantities in the manual assume a dry engine I believe, which you'll never really be able to get in practice with a standard oil change. There is always going to be some residual in the engine, and as big as our engines are that could be a reasonable amount. I assume you checked after you ran the car as well? The oil filter can hold a surprising amount of oil I've found. I never used to prefill them before I had the Viper, but have gotten more in the habit of doing that, at least on cars where it's easier to do (like something with a vertical filter).

My oil pressure light is similar, even just with day to day use, not only on a change. Do you have a gen 3 or 4? When I did my rebuild I changed out to gen 4 style main bearings. They have a longer oil groove to keep oil going to the rods for more of the crank rotation, but that leads to less oil pressure at low rpm at least since there is less resistance to flow now. I used to idle at 50 psi, but with the new bearings it's more like 20-30 when warmed up. I guess what I'm getting at is that lower idle pressure would take longer to put out the oil light I would expect, so you might still be getting flow just fine, but not necessarily the pressure.
It’s a 2004 Gen III. I always ran Mobil 1 10W30. So I have to have flow but it’s taking longer with 0W40 to build adequate pressure. I had a short drive today, it took what seemed forever to build pressure on 1st startup, on the 2nd it popped right up - but the oil was warmed up at that point.

I guess my concern is damaging my engine at cold startup. Am I worried about something that’s not real? I’d hate to dump 10 quarts of fresh Mobil 1 but…
 

MoparMap

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Hmm, that's a tough one. I think with modern materials and lubricants it's probably not going to be an issue, but I can understand it being unnerving all the same and would feel similar. I would think as long as you wait a bit to let everything stabilize before you drive it that you'd probably be fine. Bearings sort of soak up oil to some degree anyway, so I don't think it's like they are completely dry for a few seconds until oil gets to them. Admittedly this one is out of my field of expertise though. I think you're probably fine to at least use it up as a regular oil change interval though. Maybe go back to the other stuff at the next change for peace of mind?
 

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