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Discussion in 'SRT10 and SRT10 Coupe Discussions' started by redtanrt10, Jun 12, 2009.
Dodge Viper handed over to Fiat, franchise safe…for now
here comes the ferarri apologists....
Says Fiat will likely "wind down" the Viper, aka discontinue it. Big surprise there!
I guess there is a slim chance Fiat will be able to see the value of having a car priced between the regular cars and their high priced Maseratti and Ferarri.
At least Fiat is offering Race Yellow.
If anything they should get ride of Maseratti and keep the Viper. Do me it doesn't make sense to let it die. The american market is a big part of the exotic car market. I don't see many americans buying a Maseratti instead of a Viper if the Viper is dead. If they don't want to keep it I hope they at least sell it to a company that want's to continue on with the Viper tradition.
After reading that article I don't know if I'd call it all that safe:
More than likely, Fiat will simply wind down the Viper brand. Fiat owns Maserati and Ferrari and sees the Viper as a competitor to its high-dollar sports cars. As such, Fiat will likely kill off the Viper to eliminate the competition.
They are actually increasing the Maserati lineup. In the end, Fiat wants to use the Chrysler franchise to sell small (fuel efficient) cars. Besides if Fiat has to choose between an Italian sports car vs an American sports car, they would choose Italian. So it would be no surprise if the Viper is discontinued. Fiat will show it's new lineup within 90 days, so that's 1st week of Sep. OTOH, Fiat did bail out Chrysler.
Why is Viper considered a competitor to Ferrari while Maserati isn't?
Can't Fiat just sell the Viper rather than discontinuing it?
Yes they can, and I am sure they will be more than happy to do so if they can find a buyer.
A competitor to it high dollar sports car? No way is it a competitor! While performance it definitely is, the market for Ferrari and Maserati are completely different then the Viper. To me it is the perfect edition. a more reasonably priced, no holds barred sports car. When someone goes out to buy a Ferrari or Maserati they are not comparing it to or considering a Viper as another option. Two different cars, in two different niches.
"More than likely, Fiat will simply wind down the Viper brand. Fiat owns Maserati and Ferrari and sees the Viper as a competitor to its high-dollar sports cars. As such, Fiat will likely kill off the Viper to eliminate the competition."
If Viper is discontinued,Americans will buy new Corvettes.I have a Gen.4 Viper and a C6Z06.Is Corvette is nice and also very fast,but it is not a Viper.I will stay with American high performance.Period.
...pull the plug. This "life support" uncertainty is killing me. Pull the plug, turn the Viper into an official collectors car and the rest of the world will be saying "I should have bought one when I had the chance". It will be nice to make this club more exclusive. I look at the Ford GTs and say to myself "man I should have bought one". I'm glad the gen 4 made it out. If the Viper is going to die - this is a great year for it to go - go out on top.
I don't see the Viper progressing too much more - not like the difference between the gen 3 to gen 4 engine wise. I honestly don't see or predict sports cars getting over 700 hp, commonly. There will always be the Veyron like car every so often. I predict the future will be in transmissions. 600-650hp with 7-9 speed trannys. When you have gears you don't need the hp. You keep the engines much "greener" and still retain the performance. I'm expecting to see more paddle shifted cars with electronically shifted trannys in the 8-9 speed range.
Just the way I see it thru my cracked crystal ball.
"hears the faint sound of taps playing in the background"
I have to agree. If Viper dies most Americans will look to Corvette or even Porsche before Ferrari or Maseratti. If you ever had an Italian exotic the poor service and service/maintenance costs will make you sick. With Fiat's distribution network in Europe I think they're missing a great opportunity if they don't try to market the Viper there. Chrysler has never successfully marketed the car out of the US. I think with the right distribution network and marketing the Viper would do well in Europe.
Neither of those will do - it doesn't have the same raw excitement and power of the viper... There are interested parties it will survive!
10 Million in todays dollar is not a lot of money. I am sure, 10 people in the Viper community could come up with a million each and buy the controlling interest in Viper. We are talking about a plant and all the technology, already developed, to continue the legacy. There has got to be a lot of talent in the Viper community that would love to be a part of this company. People talk about loving the job they are in, what better could it be than to be a part of the Viper manufacturing and sales of this vehicle. I know Dodge is the soul of the Viper, but it would be worse to have it end all together. There has got to be something we can do. Forget all the ego trips, the Viper must be saved! How many Vipers are sold and at what price? Add that up and how much income is there? Just my 2 cents. I will work just to cover my Viper payment per month!
For that 10 million you probably buy 100 million worth of debt.
Funny how this sounds a lot different that was has been stated on this site multiple times. Hum....
Don't give up just yet, I hear Steve Saleen is still interested in the Viper.
I hear Santa Clause is too, but like you, I can't cite any sources.
Steve Saleen with VCA members as partners. Now there is a thought that might get to the bank.
the viper,zr1 and shelby gt500 will all be gone in the next 2- 5years imo.if they do keep these cars they will not be producing 550 hp and up anymore.muscle cars will be gone again soon.if they do stop viper no biggie there so many available for sale new and used theres not enough buyers to buy whats available at the moment.
As long as there is a Corvette ZR1 looking to lay claim as a Ferrari-beater and world class performer at a value price, then Fiat has a motivation to go after that market segment with the Viper. A redesign is necessary, but they could easily produce the car we all want to see in a $120-130k package. I'm thinking 700hp, some carbon fiber panels, nicer interior but no nanny tech, carbon brakes, and wild styling with Pinninfarina help. Anyone who fails to see the opportunity in this segment (i.e. porsche turbo pricing) is kidding themselves. The Viper is a natural fit to go after it.
That said, I love the idea of the VCA participating in a partnership to own the company that builds future Vipers. Gotta be creative though to get members to kick in some equity (i.e. every member can buy a share in the company for as little as $500, gets to vote on design decisions, gets first dibs on new models, etc.).
I think Fiat needs to be given a chance and shown how valued the Viper is. I don't think they will appreciate being insulted nor encouraged to keep the brand by all the doom sayers.
Let's give them some encouragement because you can bet someone from there will come to this site.
as for the "end of an era" doomsayers - here is a heads up on engine tech from just one pleb on the fringes:
bigger advances in the gasoline internal combustion engine have ALREADY been made than anything we have seen in the past decade - including direct injection.
This new tech offers incredible power and economy with minimal capital retooling - making it a no brainer for the first OEM to pick this up and run with it. It's been a quarter of a century in the making so is no untried half baked crack pot idea.
Because the US auto industry is in such a mess, this tech looks set to slip right past them. So, this tech is likely to go to Europe first because contacts there do not waste time in BS, they make quick decisions and run with them to pre-production stage. Funding for something this good should be the smallest hurdle of all.
If the muscle/super car era dies it will be political not due to any in-ability to have clean emissions, low fuel consumption, and high power. 500 cubic inches and 35mpg at highway cruise is not a tough target, at all!
I say the best is yet to come, but we will have to wait and see.
I'm with you that's why I've posted the petition to try and show Fiat how important the Viper is to us and could be to them.
Please sign the "Please sign this petition!!!!" thread. The Viper needs your support!
You lost me on the last one (Pinninfarina help). I like the Vipers and their outrageous american styling, just as they are. Euro cars are "pretty" but not nearly as aggressive looking as a Viper. No thanks to any euros dipping some effeminacy into the Viper.
If you EVER been to Italy you'll know - it's ALL about "National" Pride and they would rather keep another Italian Brand such as Maserati rather "than-a the American"
...just like the Germans
Daimler made sure even their compact cars had an AMG equivalent that can keep up with the Viper before spending any time on it. While Daimler had the Viper, we lost most of our competitive advantages.
I was at a local cruise this afternoon and spotted a guy with a Viper T shirt eyeballing my engine... Turns out he's been involved with not only some of the Hemi development and I guess some earlier Viper engines, but also engineering on the current 600hp engine.
According to him Fiat is inclined to keep the Viper "depending on orders". I mentioned that the recent threads here were debating whether orders were even being taken, though I didn't keep up with that thread so I don't know what the final verdict on ordering Vipers was. So it seems to be a Catch 22 situation of a sort.
What else...umm the cost to Chrysler for the 600hp engine is $12,000. Penske was interested in Viper but the failing economy and Penske's Saturn involvement put an end to that. Both Saleen and the painter they contracted the Viper paint out to are/were both having financial troubles, which was part of the reason for the delays in production. Maybe that's old news, I don't read thru the Gen 4 threads much.
Fiat is very disappointed in the condition some of the Chrysler plants are in, and that's going to remedied. I've got his card, but he doesn't have any spare parts lying around.
Ops, he also mentioned the 2009 Challenger with a 600hp Viper motor was done mostly in house because the budget get the engine in was only $2000..