1 3/4" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

[RedGTS]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

Well, that's what I was hoping to hear, and the reason I went with 1 3/4" was because of the SC, so hopefully everything will turn out OK. But this is a good lesson for everyone considering expensive headers that is going to stay n/a--bigger is most definitely not always better, so be careful!

Ronnie

 

[SneakyPete]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RedGTS:
Well, that's what I was hoping to hear, and the reason I went with 1 3/4" was because of the SC, so hopefully everything will turn out OK. But this is a good lesson for everyone considering expensive headers that is going to stay n/a--bigger is most definitely not always better, so be careful!

Ronnie

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I decided on 1 5/8 the happy medium, did not know if I was going to do any other mods, so now that I bought a S/C, if I want the other 10 rwhp or so, will have to sell them and get 1 3/4. One of my friends wants them, so should not be a problem.

Research is key.

 

[Mike Adams]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

My suggetion would be to order youself a 1997/98 computer and install it getting rid of that nasty check engine light. And increasing throttle reponse. Or get O2 from Dan Caign. They bolt right in no problem. If the 02 sensors are not ready correctly you will lose power.

 

[RedGTS]

1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

I know the creampuffs supposedly don't respond as well to exhaust mods, but this is ridiculous!

I dynoed my '01 GTS with filters/tubes and Snake Oyl rear muffler delete a couple of months ago and got 415 rwhp and 459 torque. I dynoed again today (same dyno) after installing B&B 1 3/4" headers and catback w/high flow cats and got 411 rwhp and 451 torque. It was hotter the first time I dynoed than it was today, although that shouldn't really matter b/c all numbers are SAE corrected. I got the larger 1 3/4" headers because I'm getting the Roe S/C, and I had heard they may be too large to achieve a lot n/a, but I didn't expect to LOSE power!

The only possible reasons for this I can come up with are:

1. The 1 3/4" headers are too large for a n/a application;

2. Having a check engine light on at times after the header install has mucked up the PCM (I have a code reader and have been resetting the code, and it was not on at the dyno); or

3. The only other change I made since the last dyno was going from Roe smooth tubes to chrome 3" diameter tubes with reducers on each end for aesthetics, and that somehow affected things (I don't know how, but I do know they were a ***** to get on).

Should I be worried I somehow screwed up the exhaust install?

Ronnie

 

[SneakyPete]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

Thats pretty normal.
I believe a 1 5/8 header upgrade on a 01/02 only yeilds about 10 hp gain, that is why I passed on headers on my 01, put them on my 97.

The 1 3/4" headers are too large for a n/a application, one guy in town put in 1 3/4 header and cat back on 99 ACR and lost some power to header size, but he did not care because he is working on a Turbo setup.

Not to worry, Sean actually gained 10 rwhp when he added the 1 3/4 with S/C alreadly installed, so you are in perfect position to install the S/C.

 

[RedGTS]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

Mike, I agree with that in general, but as I mentioned I had reset the light and it was not on, so unless it takes the computer some time to "get back to normal," it shouldn't have mattered, should it? Also, my understanding is that the 02/check engine issue doesn't cause the computer to pull timing at WOT. I think one of the Apex guys has posted previously about dynoing cars with the check engine light on, and that it made no difference in their experience. I'm hoping it's just because the 1 3/4" units are too large for an unmodified engine--do you know of anyone who has used them on an otherwise stock '00+ car and gained power?

Ronnie

 

[ronviper]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

Redgts i have a 2000gts red with the same headers and exhaust as you. My car makes 441rwhp and 481rwtq before the headers i was 423rwhp and 478rwtq. I also have the Sean Roe vec1 which helps with air fuel ratio, i can feel a difference when i move the numbers around. It's a cheap item that could help you, it's worth the effort.

 

[Mike Adams]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

I do know the headers do improve the power as Ron posted. I also know that an 02 sensor car read 0 for a 10 minute test ride. I his complaint was lack of power and I replace both front o2 sensors. This fixed it alot will do a dyno to find the difference.

Any car with High flow cats sould pull larger numbers than before something has to be wrong. Rons pull is about average with cats and without should put it above 450, heads will pull it to around 500 rwhp. Cam puts it up to 520 to 540 rwhp all with the same headers you have.

Thanks

Mike Adams

 

[GTS-R 001]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

Ronnie,
For the check engine light just modify your O2's like ROE does or get the Cragin O2's. If you get a new computer you have to get a dealer to enter your serial # and mileage + your lookin at a $50 cost instead of $400 - $600 for a computer.
I think that if you do some further mods after the Roe SC you are getting then you might need an upgraded ECU anyway ( not just a stock one ). So save the money till later!
As for the power situation my car a 2000GTS, when i threw it on a mustang dyno ( no dynojets within 300 miles of me ) all I got was an accurate torque reading as once I got into the powerband my tires would spin out, but anyway I got 516RWTQ with the B&B system , but then I also have a VEC1 and the Mopar ECU that is supposed not work, but I could feel a difference the minute I put it in.
Fix your O2 sensors then drive for 10 minutes 4-5 times with the air conditioning on, this puts the computer into a quick learn mode to relearn your car, then try it the dyno again. I think your problem is just running super rich, which can really hamper your peak Hp #, If I were you I would throw a VEC 1 on there as well.

 

[ronviper]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

EdmontonGTS i also have the Mopar computer and swear by it Mike Adams was at the dyno before and after the Mopar computer. Before Mopar ecm 415rwhp and 448rwtq after 423rwhp and 478rwtq. Then the B&B 441rwhp and 481rwtq also wih Roe's vec1.

 

[GTS-R 001]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

ronviper
Good thing these Mopar ECU's "don't work". It gives us a bit of an edge over the rest of 'em.

 

[onerareviper]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

EdmontonGTS,

I will be really interested to see some dyno numbers (before/after) on that beast, when the Roe SC is installed. Have any plans to do so?

Later

P.S. - I wonder if Sean Roe ever played with the Mopar computer on his test mule? I don't recall ever reading any post.

 

[GTS-R 001]

Re: 1 3/4\" B&B + B&B catback = nothing n/a??

onerare,
I am planning to Dyno b4 heads/cam/rockers, b4 ROE SC, and after ROE SC/70mm TB's. Heads/cam/rockers shipped to me yesterday so I will install soon. I think the final combo Dyno pull will be most impressive as the heads will be restricted by the stock manifold flow. But once the combo is together,....
Mopar ECU, I don't think Sean has one in his car, I think it might help out over a stock ECU. I'm also working quite extensively on the fuel system research, incase upgrades are required.
I shall post all results so anyone else who is buying the ROE system can benefit.