Building new garage - Need advice
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The foundation walls will be poured concrete.
There is rebar in the footing, but instead of having rebar sticking up they cut a "keyhole" notch in the footing that the walls will sit on. That notch locks the walls into the footing and it can't move. Town code requires it. They do not require rebar IN the footing but we did it anyway.
The foundation walls will be poured concrete.
There is rebar in the footing, but instead of having rebar sticking up they cut a "keyhole" notch in the footing that the walls will sit on. That notch locks the walls into the footing and it can't move. Town code requires it. They do not require rebar IN the footing but we did it anyway.
eucharistos
Enthusiast
this is a fine thread 
congrats ViperJon, thanks for today's pics, i love the building process
thanks others for all the ideas, i hope i can incorporate many of them soon
congrats ViperJon, thanks for today's pics, i love the building process
thanks others for all the ideas, i hope i can incorporate many of them soon
eucharistos
Enthusiast
pls post a pic of the keyhole if you can
no rebar in the footing required
+1 smart move on having it anyway
I'll try to keep it updated now that there is finally some action going on.
They are coming noon today to set foundation walls.
Keyhole is simply a slot down the footing center point of foundation wall. The walls are poured and the concrete flows into slot locking them in place so there is no side to side movement possible. Neat.
They are coming noon today to set foundation walls.
Keyhole is simply a slot down the footing center point of foundation wall. The walls are poured and the concrete flows into slot locking them in place so there is no side to side movement possible. Neat.
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you forgot the crapper and icebox
Another interesting aspect of the floor/foundation work is that the foundation which is 8" wide and must be three foot minimum depth will have a notch cut into it where the floor meets it. So the edge of the slab floor is actually recessed (rabitted) into the foundation walls instead of just butting to it. Makes it stronger and less prone to any settlement around the edges. Also gives you another 8" in actual interior floor square footage width as the floor extends onto the foundation walls in effect. So the entire outside dimension width is 28' but the actual inside dimension width is 27'4" give or take maximizing the interior square footage.
eucharistos
Enthusiast
I'll try to keep it updated now that there is finally some action going on.
They are coming noon today to set foundation walls.
Keyhole is simply a slot down the footing center point of foundation wall. The walls are poured and the concrete flows into slot locking them in place so there is no side to side movement possible. Neat.
You must be registered for see images attach
thanks for the pic
not what i had pictured in my mind, and it is cool and looks strong
Pouring the walls tomorrow have had a nice string of weather.
Then have to get ANOTHER site survey approved. Incredible red tape.
Hopefully start to actually frame end of next week.
Then have to get ANOTHER site survey approved. Incredible red tape.
Hopefully start to actually frame end of next week.
You must be registered for see images attach
Black Moon
Enthusiast
Looking great. When they backfill the sub-grade inside make sure they backfill in 8" lifts and compact, compact, compact. Best to use gravel and compact the crap out of it. Don't fall for the old 'as long as we compact the top it will be fine' line. Been doing construction for 30+ years and I know time needs to be spent on the sub-grade or you will have problems later. Also make sure they saw cut the slab to 25% MINIMUM depth (2" is best. This directs the concrete where to shrink and crack. I think the book says every 10' x 12'. IMHO
It's very interresting the difference type of construction.
In fondation, why don't you install parpaingx20 with Concrete casting in the clattered posts?
Black Moon says:" Best to use gravel and compact the crap out of it".
Exactly you need have a best suport, do you made Study of ground? (Composites for concrete density?)
In fondation, why don't you install parpaingx20 with Concrete casting in the clattered posts?
Black Moon says:" Best to use gravel and compact the crap out of it".
Exactly you need have a best suport, do you made Study of ground? (Composites for concrete density?)
VIPER BAZ UK
Enthusiast
Looking good..... My build is still going on ......
http://forums.viperclub.org/sneaky-petes-place/639644-started-another-project.html
http://forums.viperclub.org/sneaky-petes-place/639644-started-another-project.html
Foundation walls poured Saturday. Have to get a site survey and backfill can start next week.
Hope to start framing beginning of Thanksgiving week.
You can see the size difference comparing the old driveway to new structure.
Hope to start framing beginning of Thanksgiving week.
You can see the size difference comparing the old driveway to new structure.
You must be registered for see images attach
Black Moon
Enthusiast
Now THAT's a foundation. Wire and rebar, interlocking block and vapor barrier under the footing. Don'y yhink you'll see that anywhere in the US but that's very nice.
Black Moon
Enthusiast
Thanks for the updates - its always nice to see the project in phases!
As Black Moon stated - make sure they compact the interior base well. In increments of 8" layers with a plate compactor - backfilling with gravel, sand or possibly in your case (hard to tell by the photos) a nice subgrade. Make sure no topsoil gets filled back in. The base is just as important, if not more, than the depth of concrete to prevent sagging/cracking.
So far it looks like the contractor knows what he's doing.
The best thing anybody can do during the build is to do exactly what you are doing - Be aware, be involved, be present, and take pictures. That way the builder doesn't cut corners.
As Black Moon stated - make sure they compact the interior base well. In increments of 8" layers with a plate compactor - backfilling with gravel, sand or possibly in your case (hard to tell by the photos) a nice subgrade. Make sure no topsoil gets filled back in. The base is just as important, if not more, than the depth of concrete to prevent sagging/cracking.
So far it looks like the contractor knows what he's doing.
The best thing anybody can do during the build is to do exactly what you are doing - Be aware, be involved, be present, and take pictures. That way the builder doesn't cut corners.
Quoted from Viper Jon - "Prices we got ranged from $6800.00 to $2900.00 for the SAME thing. All licensed guys (they have to be for town demo permit). Amazing 4K difference. Was really surprised at that large a variation I figured they would all be pretty competitive. When it comes to this non skilled aspect I'm just taking the lowest guy period. They have to be insured and licensed."
In case you were still wondering why the big difference in estimates you received.....
There are so many variables in presenting a price to the client. I do demolition work so I will give you some insight as to some of the more elusive reasons. Number one is how bad the contractor wants the job. If the contractor has had a slow month with no projects on the horizon he may bid very competitive to make sure he gets the work. On the other end of the spectrum, the high price you receieved may have come from a contractor who was very busy and really didn't need the work - but he put in a price anyway on the off chance you chose him and he gets to ride the gravy train all the way to the bank. Some contractors have even been known to underbid the actual cost of the project and take a hit - just to keep the other guys from getting the job! (Silly reasoning I know)
Another variable is in the disposal of the material. Some contractors only have a shop and equipment and rely solely on disposing of material at a licenced waste site. They get charged by the ton for getting rid of your old garage. On the other hand, some contractors own property and "dispose" of the material at their place saving the cost of disposal. This method, while generally not legal in most jurisdictions, allows the contractor to outcompete his rivals by saving thousands of dollars in disposal fees (Burn the wood and bury the concrete when no one is watching)
There are just so many other reasons why prices differentiate wildly.
Another reason is in the post-project cleanup, i.e. the higher priced guy may have alotted budget for thoroughly cleaning up of site, removing ALL material and grading the location nicely with a dozer, while the other lower priced guy may just pull up all the big pieces and leave you with a bit of a mess - ("Oh, you want ALL the small shrapnel cleaned up and the ground graded neatly????... I see....well that will be EXTRA Mr. Viper Jon)
Thats why its good to read the fine print or thoroughly discuss the scope of the project beforehand with the bidders - to make sure you can compare apples to apples.
I can think of a hundred more reasons, but I'm starting to write a novel here and should stop
In case you were still wondering why the big difference in estimates you received.....
There are so many variables in presenting a price to the client. I do demolition work so I will give you some insight as to some of the more elusive reasons. Number one is how bad the contractor wants the job. If the contractor has had a slow month with no projects on the horizon he may bid very competitive to make sure he gets the work. On the other end of the spectrum, the high price you receieved may have come from a contractor who was very busy and really didn't need the work - but he put in a price anyway on the off chance you chose him and he gets to ride the gravy train all the way to the bank. Some contractors have even been known to underbid the actual cost of the project and take a hit - just to keep the other guys from getting the job! (Silly reasoning I know)
Another variable is in the disposal of the material. Some contractors only have a shop and equipment and rely solely on disposing of material at a licenced waste site. They get charged by the ton for getting rid of your old garage. On the other hand, some contractors own property and "dispose" of the material at their place saving the cost of disposal. This method, while generally not legal in most jurisdictions, allows the contractor to outcompete his rivals by saving thousands of dollars in disposal fees (Burn the wood and bury the concrete when no one is watching)
There are just so many other reasons why prices differentiate wildly.
Another reason is in the post-project cleanup, i.e. the higher priced guy may have alotted budget for thoroughly cleaning up of site, removing ALL material and grading the location nicely with a dozer, while the other lower priced guy may just pull up all the big pieces and leave you with a bit of a mess - ("Oh, you want ALL the small shrapnel cleaned up and the ground graded neatly????... I see....well that will be EXTRA Mr. Viper Jon
)Thats why its good to read the fine print or thoroughly discuss the scope of the project beforehand with the bidders - to make sure you can compare apples to apples.
I can think of a hundred more reasons, but I'm starting to write a novel here and should stop
AFL in NJ
Enthusiast
When compacting the gravel for where the garage floor is poured, don't be afraid to add water while compacting the gravel. I used to do compaction testing when I was a construction inspector and the days when it rained all day, even one pass with their big vibratory compactor gave the best readings 10" down. Those dry/hot days with no moisture they'd run that compactor back and forth multiple times and barely make the minimum compaction to pass.
Also, if you were thinking of adding a lift, consider sonotubes where the lift points attach to your floor.
Regards,
Aaron
Also, if you were thinking of adding a lift, consider sonotubes where the lift points attach to your floor.
Regards,
Aaron
viperdrummer
Enthusiast
Jon:
I am not as far along as you but here are some pics of a 26X26 I am adding because my 26X26 attached garage even with lift got maxed out.
Feel free to tell me where mine might be going wrong because I have no clue. My guys cannot get anything done because every time they take a pi$$ the County has to come do an inspection. Thanks, Terry
I am not as far along as you but here are some pics of a 26X26 I am adding because my 26X26 attached garage even with lift got maxed out.
Feel free to tell me where mine might be going wrong because I have no clue. My guys cannot get anything done because every time they take a pi$$ the County has to come do an inspection. Thanks, Terry
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vancouver-gts
Viper Owner
You guys should have hired this crew to build your garages .No red tape ,I'm sure. I personally wouldn't trust staying in that place 
China builds a 15-story building in 6 days « Don Surber
"From my informant: “Arizona should hire them to build a wall on the Mexican border before Washington catches on…..”
I personally wouldn't trust staying in that place China builds a 15-story building in 6 days « Don Surber
"From my informant: “Arizona should hire them to build a wall on the Mexican border before Washington catches on…..”
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^^^^ a BIG +1 on what AFL in NJ said about adding water to the subgrade base. I was going to mention this in my prior post, but opted not to, because a lot of people get wary of unconventional advice. So I am glad he brought this up - he is absolutely right. In my experience as well, any base that has received copious amounts of rainfall compacts to a superior firmness, alot more than mechanical compacting alone can achieve.
Man you got that right. I didn't even know it but once the forms are stripped off the foundation walls I HAVE to get another site survey ($500.00) to make sure we didn't cheat on the size and position. Two copies to the town and another 3 days at least for approval to frame.....endless.
Quoted from Viper Jon - "Prices we got ranged from $6800.00 to $2900.00 for the SAME thing. All licensed guys (they have to be for town demo permit). Amazing 4K difference. Was really surprised at that large a variation I figured they would all be pretty competitive. When it comes to this non skilled aspect I'm just taking the lowest guy period. They have to be insured and licensed."
In case you were still wondering why the big difference in estimates you received.....
There are so many variables in presenting a price to the client. I do demolition work so I will give you some insight as to some of the more elusive reasons. Number one is how bad the contractor wants the job. If the contractor has had a slow month with no projects on the horizon he may bid very competitive to make sure he gets the work. On the other end of the spectrum, the high price you receieved may have come from a contractor who was very busy and really didn't need the work - but he put in a price anyway on the off chance you chose him and he gets to ride the gravy train all the way to the bank. Some contractors have even been known to underbid the actual cost of the project and take a hit - just to keep the other guys from getting the job! (Silly reasoning I know)
Another variable is in the disposal of the material. Some contractors only have a shop and equipment and rely solely on disposing of material at a licenced waste site. They get charged by the ton for getting rid of your old garage. On the other hand, some contractors own property and "dispose" of the material at their place saving the cost of disposal. This method, while generally not legal in most jurisdictions, allows the contractor to outcompete his rivals by saving thousands of dollars in disposal fees (Burn the wood and bury the concrete when no one is watching)
There are just so many other reasons why prices differentiate wildly.
Another reason is in the post-project cleanup, i.e. the higher priced guy may have alotted budget for thoroughly cleaning up of site, removing ALL material and grading the location nicely with a dozer, while the other lower priced guy may just pull up all the big pieces and leave you with a bit of a mess - ("Oh, you want ALL the small shrapnel cleaned up and the ground graded neatly????... I see....well that will be EXTRA Mr. Viper Jon
Thats why its good to read the fine print or thoroughly discuss the scope of the project beforehand with the bidders - to make sure you can compare apples to apples.
I can think of a hundred more reasons, but I'm starting to write a novel here and should stop
I understand competely what you are saying but still think that a 4K difference is extreme. Out town required receipts for the disposed materials, both the wood and the concrete.
Anyway, the guys were great that did the demo got rid of ever stitch of material,, graded the site and left the area spotless. Half a day job. Not sure what the 6K guy could have done different except maybe buy me dinner...
.Fatboy 18
Enthusiast
Damm, looking at some of the garage pics on this thread, you guys have too much space Some really fantastic garages 
Some really fantastic garages 
