Conner plant to close via new UAW contract..

[JonB]

Re: Conner plant to close via new UAW agreement..

...The "term of the agreement" is 4 YEARS...so, closing CAAP during the "term" could mean very soon or in 3.5 years... -J

Bingo.

Remember the timeline and impetus of this story was the 36-hour UAW strike....of course the UAW will make an issue of strategizing to protect its members.

If you've been to CAAP post-Prowler, it is an under-utilized facility for sure. It was a total expense drain the past 59 weeks,,,,,zero production. On the books CAAP looks like a huge money pit to Cerberus. When the MACK AVE plant closed for MY 1996, there was no VCA website to bemoan the demise of the long-delayed 96. And the 1996 GTS release was delayed until June 1996 !!! It sure as hell did not come out in Oct 1995..... Some of 'us' were VERY ANGRY! I even held a written promise from Dodge in 2/96 that I would have my car to pace races in May 1996..... it did not happen....... but no website existed to share the pain and suspicion.

The 08's will be rolling down the line VERY soon, and if you look at the HISTORY of Viper Production, what is happening now has happened before......

 

[Vipermann]

I think if you plan on modding a viper, you should stay away from the 2008. I don't see tuners sinking allot of R&D money into a shrinking market.

Sort of not really true.

I had an '05 with: a mopar exhaust, 1.75 rockers, a DC flash tune, a CC flywheel, CC underdrive pulley, K&N and 3.33 rear gears ... all together about 560HP (crank calculation)

Even so, the '08 will be a much better car than my '05 was, right off the lot.

The only mods I plan for my '08 are: 3.33 gears and 'maybe' an exhaust and headers.

The fact is, the '08 won't need many, if any, other mods. The only way your statement 'might' be true, is if you plan to add some kind of blower/turbo, which most people don't do anyway. I for one, would rather have a 650HP+ '08, n/a with headers, than a blown '03-'06 anyday. For most folks, any more HP than that just isn't worth the reliability worries.

 

[JKVIPER]

Maybe Crysler Sells the Viper to David Richards and it is rolled into the Aston Martin umbrella?

Call me crazy, but just a thought.

 

[RMBSRT]

Oh, I won't argue with buying Vipers when you can - whether it is 2008 or 2028. More car sales equals a stronger future regardless. But the new car regs shouldn't impact the Viper much (if at all) from what I understand. Airbags are good, emissions are good, etc. And again, why would a manufacturer knock off a profitable car, especially when it represents such a huge impact to the company's image overall? It's one thing if it was losing money or was a meaningless car lost in the cookie cutter shuffle, but it is neither.

And if you honestly think that SRT or the Viper team is going to make it a Corvette, well then you haven't been paying attention. Pick up any auto magazine discussing the 2008 (and there are a ton of them) and each one points out that the Viper is raw and is meant to stay that way. Search for direct quotes from guys like Herb Helbig and you may rethink your position.


PS. This is NOT directed at RMBSRT, but the general mindset of those writing the Viper off prematurely...

Ok...lets look at the options.

Where are they going to move the Viper production too. The drivetrain and chassis of the Viper is very unique in the product mix of Chrysler. With such a low volume car where would Chrysler move the production line (with all of it's tooling) so they could intergrate it into an existing product line. Can you see Vipers on the same production line with Ram trucks?

I am just trying to apply logic on where Cerebus would spend the capital to set up the Viper line. I do think the Viper should make it to 2009 or 2010 but...I do not think the profitabilaty of a low production car would allow for a heavy R&D budget to make a new generation of the platform....unless they are looking to make the Viper a higher production car. To go to a higher prodcution car they are going to have to make some big changes to the car.

I certainly hope the Viper will maket it...I just do not see it going to a new generation platform with the current owners. The capital expendures to do so does not make sense at the current production numbers. Just my opinion....

 

[RMBSRT]

Sort of not really true.

I had an '05 with: a mopar exhaust, 1.75 rockers, a DC flash tune, a CC flywheel, CC underdrive pulley, K&N and 3.33 rear gears ... all together about 560HP (crank calculation)

Even so, the '08 will be a much better car than my '05 was, right off the lot.

The only mods I plan for my '08 are: 3.33 gears and 'maybe' an exhaust and headers.

The fact is, the '08 won't need many, if any, other mods. The only way your statement 'might' be true, is if you plan to add some kind of blower/turbo, which most people don't do anyway. I for one, would rather have a 650HP+ '08, n/a with headers, than a blown '03-'06 anyday. For most folks, any more HP than that just isn't worth the reliability worries.

You are right. My thoughts were focused on a FI set up. Plus the challenge of the new computer of the 2008 will be tough to crack for any major upgrades.

 

[MoparMan]

Ok...lets look at the options.

Where are they going to move the Viper production too. The drivetrain and chassis of the Viper is very unique in the product mix of Chrysler. With such a low volume car where would Chrysler move the production line (with all of it's tooling) so they could intergrate it into an existing product line. Can you see Vipers on the same production line with Ram trucks?

What makes you think they're not looking at assembly lines that can build not only more than one model but more than one platform vehicle on the same line? I'm not saying that Viper production would move to the Warren plant, but it's not completely far-fetched that the next Viper platform could be built alongside other platforms on the same assembly line.

 

[RMBSRT]

What makes you think they're not looking at assembly lines that can build not only more than one model but more than one platform vehicle on the same line? I'm not saying that Viper production would move to the Warren plant, but it's not completely far-fetched that the next Viper platform could be built alongside other platforms on the same assembly line.

I know that you can do a flexible manufacturing process on building the car. My point is, will Cerebus spend the money to intergrate the LOW VOLUME Viper into another production line? I think that is the biggest challenge the Viper will face.

 

[PatentLaw]

Only Mr. Pemberton mentioned THE WORKERS. Hello to all of you out there in Viperland, but your cars were made by PEOPLE. If the plant closes, then that would be sad, but I dont really care about a building. The people that have dedicated themselves to producing the cars that we love should be taken care of. Just my two cents.

Oh, and another thing......a Viper made in Mexico, Canada, Japan, Korea or any similar place would be a no go for me. Viper is American. Pure. Management should understand that. The workers should understand that. The engineers should understand that. The customers, ALL OF US, should let management know how we feel about the people who have created this automotive icon.

I for one thank you.

 

[Y2K5SRT]

Man has it been a long time since I last posted on these forums. After reading all your post I only have one thing to add.
If the Conner plant closes I'm out of a job. If the Viper is just moved to another assembly plant there is no guarantee I will follow it. And please, would you really want to work at another plant where the Viper isn't being built?
Well, let's see what the future holds.

Hi Thomas!! I don't think you have a whole lot to worry about just yet in my very humble opinion. If/when the Viper is moved I sure hope you will follow it! I figure when we take delivery of our next Viper we want you there like you were back in '99. Still have that little model Viper we gave you when we picked up our black/silver GTS? Hopefully you got one of the VCA key chains I dropped off a couple months ago: We had one for every employee in the plant along with a personal note of thanks from Bob Carroll, our National President. We love you guys (and gals) at the plant and trust your future with the Viper will be a long and successful one, no matter where it might be.





(and thanks for the gentle reminder PatentLaw...)

 

[RMBSRT]

Only Mr. Pemberton mentioned THE WORKERS. Hello to all of you out there in Viperland, but your cars were made by PEOPLE. If the plant closes, then that would be sad, but I dont really care about a building. The people that have dedicated themselves to producing the cars that we love should be taken care of. Just my two cents.

Oh, and another thing......a Viper made in Mexico, Canada, Japan, Korea or any similar place would be a no go for me. Viper is American. Pure. Management should understand that. The workers should understand that. The engineers should understand that. The customers, ALL OF US, should let management know how we feel about the people who have created this automotive icon.

I for one thank you.

Well said. I purchased my Viper because it is made in the USA. I could of bought foriegn but I will always only buy AMERICAN MUSCLE. I for one will be moving up my purchase of a new Viper Vert. Cerebus is focused on the bottom line and I will show my support to the workers by putting my money to work too.

OK folks ...lets make some noise!!!

 

[Frank 03SRT]

We met Thomas (ViperLss) on a CAAP tour some years back. He was one of our main points of contact for the tour. I'm sure he wouldn't remember us, but we sure do remember him. I will never forget his enthusiasm and kindness. He was "on fire" for the Viper, and you could tell he really loved his job. And it seemed that everyone in the factory had a similar attitude, with smiles on their faces.

Thomas is a great representative of the CAAP folks. May their future be secure.

 

[418viper]

Heres the link to the UAW contract as posted over in the corvette forums. Looks like more than just Conner could be closing. The link opens a pdf file which you need to scroll way down to see plant commitments.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/showthread.php?t=1839433

 

[WOT!]

Did any of you read page 12? To me it appears that UAW was looking to lock in as many jobs as possible. So the list is really only a commitment to the UAW that production will continue to a certain point. It does not say that Chrysler cannot continue production beyond those commitments. Form a contract negotiation standpoint, I would not commit myself to anything that was long term either, specially the auto industry.

Now I know it says that the company plans to close the facility during the term of the agreement. That does not say that the production of the viper will not continue. Maybe moved just like others have suggested. But I bet UAW would not complain if they decided not to close the facility in the long run. I wouldn't be surprised if Chrysler added that as an option in their favor just in case it they decide to consolidate plants. Unused space cost money.

 

[MoparMan]

I know that you can do a flexible manufacturing process on building the car. My point is, will Cerebus spend the money to intergrate the LOW VOLUME Viper into another production line? I think that is the biggest challenge the Viper will face.

Also, don't forget the possiblility that the next Viper will be contracted out to be built for Dodge by another entity.

 

[RMBSRT]

Would Saleen purchase the CAAP plant? Is the plant size suitable for a niche automaker? Could Saleen then contract out to other brands for small runs of specialty cars?

I am just thinking out of the box here. There are several manufacturing firms in Europe doing this. Cerebus could make some money on selling an asset they are not using to its fullest extent.

(Sorry, my background as a financial analyst is showing here....)

 

[AviP]

What if we all pool in 100K each, would we be able to buy out Conner Ave minus the UAW? What is it worth?

 

[Paul Hawker]

Don't forget about the capabilities of McLaren.

 

[ViperLSS]

Hi Thomas!! I don't think you have a whole lot to worry about just yet in my very humble opinion. If/when the Viper is moved I sure hope you will follow it! I figure when we take delivery of our next Viper we want you there like you were back in '99. Still have that little model Viper we gave you when we picked up our black/silver GTS? Hopefully you got one of the VCA key chains I dropped off a couple months ago: We had one for every employee in the plant along with a personal note of thanks from Bob Carroll, our National President. We love you guys (and gals) at the plant and trust your future with the Viper will be a long and successful one, no matter where it might be.





(and thanks for the gentle reminder PatentLaw...)

I for one am still hyped about being able to build the Dodge Viper. In my opinion. Would I like to follow the car if it is moved to a new plant? In a heart beat! But there are rules I have to follow when it comes to job placement. Would I follow the Viper if it was out sourced to another company? I honestly don't know. I have my family to think about before making those types of career changes.
And yes even though I have thinned out my Viper collection I still have the Black/Silver GTS. And yes, all the craftspeople at Conner got the wonderful gift from the VCA. And the letters with them. Thank you very much. I have placed mine away for safe keeping.

Frank 03SRT

How can you not be excited about building these cars? I am proud to say I am the only Viper Craftsperson that has a Viper Tattoo. I've had it since March 2000.
Well I may not remember who you are, maybe. But that just means it's time for another trip to Conner Ave. We hope to see all of you there.

 

[viper77]

ViperLSS:
When can we come down and see you in action? Hint, Hint.

 

[Warfang]

I for one am still hyped about being able to build the Dodge Viper. In my opinion. Would I like to follow the car if it is moved to a new plant? In a heart beat! But there are rules I have to follow when it comes to job placement. Would I follow the Viper if it was out sourced to another company? I honestly don't know. I have my family to think about before making those types of career changes.
And yes even though I have thinned out my Viper collection I still have the Black/Silver GTS. And yes, all the craftspeople at Conner got the wonderful gift from the VCA. And the letters with them. Thank you very much. I have placed mine away for safe keeping.

Frank 03SRT

How can you not be excited about building these cars? I am proud to say I am the only Viper Craftsperson that has a Viper Tattoo. I've had it since March 2000.
Well I may not remember who you are, maybe. But that just means it's time for another trip to Conner Ave. We hope to see all of you there.

Makes me want to brave the crappy roads of Michigan again to go see you guys in action before someone turns out the lights. Keep up the good work!

 

[ViperGTS]

I truly hope the "Dream Weekend" will happen in JAN 2008.
Have been there (CAAP) 5 times now I want to see the Saleen plant also!

 

[Ronvpr]

Cerebus only cares about one thing "the bottom line". As an employee of Chrysler I remember the stipulation for being hired for the Viper Team: Great attendance. Good interveiw. A willingness to work in a team enviorment. I just started my apprenticeship at that time, so I was unable to apply. Getting back to my point. Cerebus has hired a very anti-passionate guy for sales/marketing in Jim Press. Can you think of anyone else that could take the driving excitement out of a vehicle more than this guy from Toyota? I mean he has been pushing "boring white appliances" on America for the last 37 years at Toyota. How could he even imagine what it is like to own and drive a Viper? Chrysler is axing quite a few vehicles which include Aspen/Durango, Liberty/Nitro, Sebring, Compass (understandable), Dakota (mistake), Magnum, & Commander. I wouldn't be surprised if Mr. "milk toast" Press tries to get rid of SRT also. What you're going to have is pretty much a smaller version of Toyota/Honda/Nissan. Cars, for people who know nothing about cars, or care about, drive. I really hope it doesn't come to that. Just my opinion.

 

[Paul Hawker]

Jim Press is considering getting rid of vehicles that compete and take sales away from other vehicles in their line or do not offer a compelling reason to buy.

The Viper falls into none of these business cases.

The Viper stands alone in Chrysler as a halo car, production technique evaluation car, and makes a significant statement about the capabilities of Chrysler.

Getting rid of the profitable Viper would serve no benefit to Chrysler.

 

[2000_Black_RT10]

UAW contract being rejected.. still up in the air, no additional words about the Connor plant though.

3 more UAW locals reject Chrysler deal - Yahoo! News

 

[PatentLaw]

Stunned that the Delaware union did not reject it by larger numbers. Their heads are on the chopping block and it does not look good. Wonder if buyouts at the potentially closing plant have anything to do with it. Younger workers get screwed while older workers reap the benefits.

 

[Canyon707]

To many speculators here. It's really wait and see. Rarely do things remain the same.

 

[RoadiJeff]

Several workers in St. Louis voted against it because they do not like the idea of the VEBA health-care trust fund if it will be managed by the union. Caterpillar did this and the fund was bankrupt 6 years later.