Runflat Tires (aren't so bad)

Kai SRT10

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Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

Folks on this board seem to universally hate the stock PS runflat tires.

I have to say that I don't find them to be all that bad. They may not be good for drag racing, because you can't really underinflate them for more traction, but for daily driving and track days on road courses, they work pretty well. Although they aren't as progressive at the limit as full competition tires, they handle track days with ease, and once you learn to "read" them, they give you quite a bit of warning before they let go.

Not only that, they last a really long time. They have exceptional durability, and I put over 15k miles on my first set, which included more than 20 hard-driven track days. Even when they were replaced, I still could have easily had a couple thousand more miles out of my rear tires. I don't think that there are many ultra high performance tires that will give you that sort of wear.

As for the dreaded wheel-hop and lack of traction, I don't see it much. Do they have less traction than my Sport Cups? Yes, but the runflats are street tires. They have pretty good wet traction for an ultra high performance tire too, and I drive them in wet weather without concern. To this day, Motor Trend has never tested any car with a faster time in their figure 8 course. That is a test which really pushes a car (and tire) to the limit when it comes to usable grip. If the stock runflats really **** as bad as everyone says, there is no way that the Viper does so well in the figure 8 and on the skid pad.

I like the added safety of runflats, and when I go to an open road race, I use the stock runflats instead of my Sport Cup competition tires because the beefy runflat construction gives me peace of mind in a sport where high-speed blow-outs are the major cause of serious accidents.

Things I don't really like about the runflats are their extra weight, and the fact that their ultra-stiff construction also mandates the use of heavier/sturdier wheels to accomodate them. I'm sure that there are other tires out there that are better (don't know why Michelin won't make the PS2 in stock Viper sizes) but I really don't find the stock runflats to be all that bad. In fact, I find that they area pretty good combination of performance, durability and safety. When it was time to replace my stock tires, I bought PS runflats as the replacement. I just didn't see any real reason to change to something else for daily driving.
 

FLYNLO

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

Good thing you mentioned the weight on the tires. Can you imagine if you replaced the stock SRT wheels with some copperhead wheels, that is a saving of 34 lbs on all 4 corners? Not to mention the fact that if you replace the heavy run flats, you save even MORE weight? Im sure you do...and unsprung weight can equal a LOT of time in a straight line event, or many other events for that matter...just my 2 cents.
 

vipersrt10

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

I just put the same tires that are stock on, but the non-run flats. the non-run flat michelins (so far) seem to stick a bit better, but they track the road more and feel like they have more sidewall flex in the turns. I am not completely used to them yet
 

Skip White

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

Much has been said on this subject.

I have cursed these tires for many reasons, but as Kai, said, they are very good tires, considering what they are.

If you test these tires on a road force balancer, they will scare you.

No quality conventional tire comes close to the variance in a runflat, and that is not good.

I'm willing to say, Michelin has done there very best to make this tire mimic a conventional tire, but it doesn't even come close.

As I've said before in my long winded posts, I love the idea of not being down with a flat or worse yet, driving on a conventional tire down to 10lbs or so, and not knowing it. Other than that, there is no reason in the world to run this terrible tire.

Skip
 

MAVERICK

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

I agree with Skip. If you are going to go to the trouble of making so many mods to the car, you might as well go with a sticky tire. You'll have to replace it much sooner but you'll always know you can get the power to the pavement whenever you need it without breaking loose. If you're caught in a rainstorm then you'll just have to slow down and be careful.
 

SylvanSRT

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

And are there any other options for tires or only the same tire in a non-runflat? I would be much more interested in the road racing tire type/use tire and not a drag radial type.
 

Skip White

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

I'm sure Michelin has a the oem size in a conventional tire for the Viper.

I've allways ran the big foot Nitto 315/45/18 drag radial.

Conventional tires will cost a good bit less, and the wear about the same as a runflat.
 

Franko

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

I agree, i don't think they are that bad. I was able to manage a 1:37 at Big Willow with my run-flats and stock suspension. Not a pro time by no means but considering stock hard rubber i think they held up ok.
 

VTen555

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

This post is so timely for me. I picked up a nail 2 days ago and had to drive @ 15 miles. It was late and I was glad I didn't have to wait for a flatbed.

If I tracked the car a lot then I would have 2 sets of tires anyway. But for the street I'll stay with the runflats.
 

vipersrt10

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

I agree, i don't think they are that bad. I was able to manage a 1:37 at Big Willow with my run-flats and stock suspension. Not a pro time by no means but considering stock hard rubber i think they held up ok.

-that beats my 142s I turned on my gsxr 750 in 1995, nice track though....coming outta 8 going into 9 aiming for the inside parking cone and hitting the straight....... :2tu:
 

MAVERICK

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

I have the SRT with Kuhmos... I went to a lighter wheel, the 18" SSR Comp, I think both Skip and Kai have the same wheel. Now you have the flexibility of going to a wide range of tires... I also run the Michelin slicks when I track it... the Nitto Drag Radials are a great tire too. The smartest thing I did was to switch to 18" all around. To fill the wheel well I am going to lower the car 1" with the Moton shocks and also install PST carbon fiber racing shafts.
 

VIPER D

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

I have the SRT with Kuhmos... I went to a lighter wheel, the 18" SSR Comp, I think both Skip and Kai have the same wheel. Now you have the flexibility of going to a wide range of tires... I also run the Michelin slicks when I track it... the Nitto Drag Radials are a great tire too. The smartest thing I did was to switch to 18" all around. To fill the wheel well I am going to lower the car 1" with the Moton shocks and also install PST carbon fiber racing shafts.


I also did the same thing but I use bfg's drags on my 18's. Now I have 2 sets of rims 18's for racing and 20's for show both sets are non runflat's

6400IMGP0351-med.JPG



6400asanti_21-med.JPG


vd.. :2tu:
 

SylvanSRT

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

i dont want to modify my e-brake sys to run 18" on wheels. that still does not tell me if there are any road race tires that will work on OE size wheels
 
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Kai SRT10

Kai SRT10

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

i dont want to modify my e-brake sys to run 18" on wheels. that still does not tell me if there are any road race tires that will work on OE size wheels

I know of no road race tires that work on OE size wheels.

The only tires I know of that fit the OE size wheels are the Michelin Pilot Sports (you can choose either run-flat or non run-flat versions.)

I appreciate the benefits of other wheels and tires for competition situations. If you race your car a lot, or attend a lot of track days, by all means get yourself some race rubber. I have SSR wheels and Pilot Sport Cup tires for the track, and SSR wheels and BFG drag radials for the strip. These tires and wheel combinations are clearly superior to the OEM tires/wheels for competition.
I agree that there are many other tires that will work better for racing. However, I like the runflats on the road for everyday driving, and for the occasional track/strip day, they work ok.
 

Y2K5SRT

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

I have no desire to modify the e-brake and then worry about lowering the car to fill the wheel well. I would rather wait and see who will step up with a decent 19" tire. With the new Chebby coming out with 19 x 12-inch rear wheels (325/30ZR19 tires), a few more tire manufacturers will probably look at making at least a nice drag radial in that size.

In the meantime, I am surprisingly happy with the runflats. No wheel hop and very good traction when inflated to 32 PSI all the way around. I pulled a respectable 1.85 60' on the runflats, whereas my very best with the GTS (stock Pilots) was 1.82 on a better prepped track. Yes, the ride is a bit more stiff and I can ALWAYS use better traction, but until Kumho makes a tire for my car, runflats work just fine for me.
 

vipersrt10

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

<The only tires I know of that fit the OE size wheels are the Michelin Pilot Sports (you can choose either run-flat or non run-flat versions.)>


thought somebody said they have pirellis in the stock size, but the side wall was less so it looks funny, think it was big carrot
 

MAVERICK

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

What about the Bridgestone Potenza RE050A which the Ferrari Enzo uses? I heard some guys were running these...
 
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Kai SRT10

Kai SRT10

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

What about the Bridgestone Potenza RE050A which the Ferrari Enzo uses? I heard some guys were running these...

I think that the Enzo rears are slightly taller (345/35/19 for the Potenza vs 345/30/19 for the stock Michelins).

Front tires seem to be the same (275/35/18.)

So, it would probably fit, but you'd get a touch more "rake" to the car's stance.

Radius is 13.57 inches for the Michelins, 14.25 inches for the Potenzas.

Seems like a good idea for those who think that the 3.07 gears just aren't tall enough ;)

I'd be interested in pictures of a Viper with Enzo tires.

Looks like it may not be an easy fit, however.

http://vca2.viperclub.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB21&Number=394110&Forum=UBB21&Words=enzo%20tires&Match=Entire%20Phrase&Searchpage=0&Limit=125&Old=allposts&Main=394110&Search=true#Post394110



Kai
 

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

When you add power, the run flats can become dangerous.
 

vipersrt10

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

the non run flats kinda ****, too much sidewall flex, maybe theres not enought air in them, what the best pressure to run them at? they grip real good, but are all over the place flexing, i dont feel to good at 120 with the car swaying back and forth, the runflats never did that
 

Gforce

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

curious - anyone know how much these run flat wheels/tires weigh? How much of that is wheel versus tire?

cheers -

j
 

vipersrt10

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

i upped the pressure in the nonrun flats to 38-39psi, and it still has alot of sidewall flex, wonder how high i can go
 

Skip White

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

You can go to 52 in the most Michelin Pilots. You will notice a big difference, as you increase. Only problem is if your not on very smooth roads, they will pound you to death,(the car also).

When I trailered my car, I pumped the tires to 50lbs to give me a bit more clearance on the ramp. I forget to let them down, but the roads in this part of the country were fairly smooth. I must say the car did handle great, but the traction suffered a bit, but not as much as I would have thought. When I took the car back home, I had to let them down. The car road terribly on not so smooth roads.

Try them at about 44 in the front, and 40 in the rear. If you can stand it, the car will handle nicely. The tires will not bulge in the center, as they are rated to handle high pressure,(to a point).
 

vipersrt10

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

You can go to 52 in the most Michelin Pilots. You will notice a big difference, as you increase. Only problem is if your not on very smooth roads, they will pound you to death,(the car also).

When I trailered my car, I pumped the tires to 50lbs to give me a bit more clearance on the ramp. I forget to let them down, but the roads in this part of the country were fairly smooth. I must say the car did handle great, but the traction suffered a bit, but not as much as I would have thought. When I took the car back home, I had to let them down. The car road terribly on not so smooth roads.

Try them at about 44 in the front, and 40 in the rear. If you can stand it, the car will handle nicely. The tires will not bulge in the center, as they are rated to handle high pressure,(to a point).


-do you have the non run flats? i will try upping the pressure some more, at 38 the thing still wants to break loose with any imput going through high speed turns, very scary
 

Skip White

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Re: Runflat Tires (aren\'t so bad)

Yes I have non-runflats. I have Goodyear Eagle F-1's on the front, and the Nitto 555 drag radials on the back. I run about 32 in the front, but the Goodyears are 10mm wider than oem and about 3% taller, so I can get by with less pressure, due to tire volume size.

If the car is breaking loose, experiment with the pressure, the car may do better with less pressure but not feel so good. You will get used to the feel. I'm not into autocrossing, so I really have very little experiacne in that area.

Good luck,
 

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