Yellowing sills and cats

[luc]

I am changing the sills on my 00 GTS with 6500 Miles due to the free color change.
I am thinking of replacing the cats,not for more HP but to keep the sills cooler.
I don't really want more noise,I have a 2.5: Corsa cat-back,but by reading some posts (JonB) it will seem that extra noise is a side effect of high flow cat.
How much more noise on a 2.5" cat?
Also if I decide to keep the stock cat for noise reason,do any of you know what is the cat maximum temperature?
I Want to put some extra heat insulation between the cat and the factory insulation and I need to find a material that can handle the cat heat.
Thanks.
Luc.

 

[cstegall]

Guys,

You are heading in the right direction. Jon sold me some Belanger headers that will be put on next week. I am leaving the stock cats on(opened to 3")because of the noise level reduction versus HiFlow cats. Jon advised that I pull out the insulation in the sills and Paint the inside of the sills with VHT paint(available at most speed shops).
Call Jon...he will fill you in.

Hope this helps,
C Stegall
01 GTS

 

[luc]

Do you mean to pull out the insulation to paint the sill and to put them back on?
or to leave them off?
Thanks.
Luc.00GTS Black/Yellow

 

[cstegall]

luc,

JonB advised that I pull out the factory insulation and then paint the interior side of the sills with the VHT paint. Install the insulation back in and you should be fine(according to Jon).

C Stegall

 

[Fred(DrivingSchool)Kinder]

My 98 GT2 had yellowing side sills at 1800 miles. The fix was to remove the sills and paint the inside(sill) with VHT1500, returned the hardware (cats, etc) to their proper location. No more yellowing sills.

 

[ViperGTS]

Same problem with my 99 GTS...any help appreciated...
JonB? Please check your private mail. Thanks!

 

[LTHL VPR]

I know of a few people who have used the VHT1500-2000 and the sill still discolored. It does seem to cut down on the heat, but it may just prolong the process.

We have also used a high heat cloth, in addition, to the side sill insulation. Together, this cuts down on the temperature noticeably and should prevent discoloration, assuming your stock catalytic converters are in good shape.

One of our customers brought us in their Viper a couple weeks ago and the side sills were burnt black, and the paint was actually peeling. It turns out he had a stock modified 'high flow cat' inastalled somewhere else, and it was clogged up. No matter what you do in that case, chances are the sills would still discolor.

Other than the high temp material we sell to cure this problem, you can also try a high flow cat. Yes, the sound level will increase, but the choice is yours.

If you have any questions, you can reach me at 408.562.1000. We can help you out!
Thank you.
-Wayne (LTHL VPR)

 

[SapphireGTS]

I have high flow cats and the corsa 3 inch. I have noticed a heat reduction (in cab) of about 50%

 

[onerareviper]

Luc,

I have the Corsa 2.5 inch with Sean Roe's high-flow oval cats, and the system sounds great!! I don't think it is to loud, but I guess that's in the 'ears of the beholder'. These cats definately cut down the heat, and increased horsepower (seat of pants testing). Not sure if it will fix the yellowing problem, as my side sills were yellow before I put the high-flow cats on. Give Sean a call - He is very professional and knows his stuff!!!

P.S. - I am in the process of having the dealer replace or repaint my side sills. This problem is a real 'pain in the asp'.

 

[luc]

ELEM55,

Glad I could help you.

Dodge is well aware of this problem and there is no reason on a $70K+ car to accept less than a brand new sill.

Onerareviper,

There are 3 logic,practical reasons to be able to "force " the dealer to replace them and not to repaint the sills.

1/ To do a as good than factory paint job, you need to take the sill to bare metal.
To do that correctly you need to remove,by drilling out the rivets, the little closure piece on the back of the sill.
Dodge doesn't supply nor have a part # for both this piece or the rivets,so the body shop will have to use some hardware store rivets that could be way different than the original ones.

2/There is a good chance that the insulation is damaged and the insulation only come with new sills.
What is the point of repainting a sill without putting new insulation?

3/ The new sills carry a diferent parts # and my service manager told me that he was told BY Dodge than the reason they have a different # is because they are up-graded,better parts than the "old" sills.

Also what make the dealer think that he can do a better job than the factory and than the yellowing will not come back after the paint job?

Bottom line,don't take no for an answer, the money for the new sills is not coming from the dealer pocket,as a matter of fact ,he make about $500 per sill under waranty.

The only reason some dealers prefer to repaint instead of replacing the sills is to look good in front of Dodge.

At the end of the month if dealer A has $10K in waranty but Dealer B has only $5K,which one do you think that Dodge (or any manufacturer for this matter) will compliment or will tell to "work" on it's waranty cost?

Customer Service is a joke.(Most of the time with most of the dealers with VERY FEW exceptions and we are lucky to have a couple of those on this board).

Luc.00GTS Black/Siver and YELLOW!!!!!!!

 

[onerareviper]

Luc and Elem55,

What exactly did you do/say to have the dealer replace, instead of repaint the side sills? Did they also replace the insulation on the inside of the sills? Please help, as I am trying to convince my dealer to do the same....

Thanks in advance...

 

[onerareviper]

Thanks a million (Luc - Elem55).

I will keep you posted on my progress.

 

[JonB]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by luc:
....I don't really want more noise,I have a 2.5: Corsa cat-back,but by reading some posts (JonB) it will seem that extra noise is a side effect of high flow cat. How much more noise on a 2.5" cat? Also if I decide to keep the stock cat for noise reason,do any of you know what is the cat maximum temperature?
I Want to put some extra heat insulation between the cat and the factory insulation and I need to find a material that can handle the cat heat. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

3 questions 3 answers.

--A 2.5 hi-flow is NOT as loud as a 3.0" hi flow. But any true HF cat will "significantly" increase the volume at WOT, and "moderately" at cruise and idle.

--External OE cat temps are 500-600 degrees at the outlet (restriction) area INSIDE the cat, and the external case can be 400-500 degrees when operating properly. Much higher if running too rich. Temps on the substrate can reash 1100-1200 deg f.

-- We have some material that NASA uses on the back side of the space shuttle heat shields! [Actually stamped NASA logo on it.]
Not cheap, but gar-un-teed race-temp fix ! We can get you the "stock n trade" racer stuff, from cloth to honeycomb to waffled. But HF cats and VHT-1500 paint will prevent 90% of the complaints...... out-of-tune running causes too much heat in 10% of cases.

 

[luc]

JonB,
Like always,when it's about Vipers, you have the answers.
Thanks again, we are very lucky to have you on the board.
What I really appreciate about you is that helping us seems always to be a higher priority to you than selling us parts.

.

Luc.