Completing my Due Diligence on the Viper

[Turbo63]

I am new to the Forum and respectfully request your patience and advice. I have owned 5 Vettes including my current ride a 2005 C6 Corvette. To be quite frank I am in search of something unique and exotic under $100k and have been very intrigued by the Viper now for the past several months. I went to a nation-leading Viper dealer in Pa (Barbera Dodge) and test drove a 2005 SRT-10. An incredible car indeed! I would be purchasing the car as a weekend toy -- hardly no intentions of running the car at a track -- it would be around town, to the beach, the club -- a weekend toy roadster but with some balls. The Vettes are nice but really giving me a yawn especially after I purchased my C6 only to see about 8 of them in the following weeks post my acqusition. Now to the point and to some real world questions as a test drive isnt that long:

1) getting used to the SRT-10 ~ for those that have done this before me how do you compare the two vehicles in terms of ride and performance?

2) Pedal placement ~ the clutch, brake and gas are close to one another -- how tough is it to get used to the feel?

3) Tire spin ~ I plan to take my wife and girls (12 and 14 and one at a time) out for the occasional spin around town -- I have read a ton of stories regarding tire spins and "hello to the rear end" kinda stuff -- is the car controllable or does it have a mind of its own? I know it does not have traction control or active handling -- but can it be managed appropriately?

4) Any other advice that can be offered to a newbie would be appreciated greatly either on this forum or through a PM.

I live in the Northeast part of the country and would be making the purchase in February right before the warm weather curve of premium car pricing. The Vette would be going by-by as well ~ only room for 1 toy in the household.

Thanks folks!

 

[Fred(DrivingSchool)Kinder]

1. My first and last Vette was a 69 so the Viper is like a luxury ride. Sorry not to have a more current comparison.
2. Pedal position comfort is a matter of seat time.
3. The car has no car control feature or CPU. The driver has to control the car. Before taking anyone for a ride take a Skip Barber Performance driving school. The Viper's massive torque is the feature that will get a driver in serious trouble who lacks car control skills.
4. Warning, Viper ownership can be very addictive.

Advance Welcome to the Viper Commmunity.

 

[redsrt03]

I've never driven a 'vette, but I bought my Viper new in April of 2004.

This is what I've learned.

a) The ride is uncomfortable. It is hot and bounces you around like a wooden roller coaster.

b) The car is hard to drive. Crusing the freeway at 65MPH and hit some patched pavement and it's all you can do to keep it on the road.

c) The car is unforgiving. Get on it and make a bad shift and you are in a ditch (at least 2 or 3 people have totaled their new Vipers by shifting back into 2d (or 1st) when they wanted to go to 4th (or 3rd).

Bottom line. The Viper is a dangerous car!

BUT,

It can be awesome fun to drive.

Take off hard from a red light and get sideways in first, at 60MPH shift into 2d and nail it. Shift to third as you start to go sideways again. Look in your rear view mirror and look at all the other cars a 1/2 mile behind you.

Get on an open freeway with good pavement and cruise at 80MPH. Whenever some kid in a modded-out import tries to tailgate you, get it on it and watch him disappear as you accelerate hard through 100MPH and beyond.

At 20 MPH (in 2d) slowly drive onto a freeway from the merge lane as a semi-truck going 65MPH barrels toward you. Nail the Viper hard just before you get in the truck's lane, and watch the eyes of the trucker as he thinks he's getting ready to cream you, but you accelerate in front of him at a phenomenal rate.

Drive it so that your wife doesn't want to ride in it with you anymore.

Now your having fun.

it

 

[madman]

Here is my mix of experience (05 model):

1. drove C5, not C6. C5 'floats', Viper's steering crystal crisp. C5 holds the straight line, YOU control the viper on 'less then perfect roads'.

2. As Fred said... It's very comfortable for me

3. Everything depends on the RPM. Play with it around 2000-4500 RPM and you get tons of fun and feeling that the beast is very tame (= not dangerous) with tons of power/torque. Above 4500RPM you should know what you doing. It's V10 and 8L = the engine has huge resistance=> match RPM when going from 3rd to 2nd at these RPMs

4. If you buy new 05 like I did - let it go for some time and don't put performance upgrades on it right from the start. I noticed that the car was hot but now with 1200 miles on it I don't see no heat no more. Get RB1 navigation from dealer or off ebay - easy swap and great added value.

And yes, it won't be your weekend driver, you bet it won't. Better look for addiction relief counseling

 

[SRTJOE]

redsrt03

"Drive it so that your wife doesn't want to ride in it with you anymore".

That's funny you said that, The second time my wife went
on a cruise with me I went around a 25mph curve at about
55mph scared the **** out of here and she will not get in my car anymore! Its better that way!!!

Turbo63,

To me the Vette is an everyday driver but when you get
into the Viper you come to LIFE!!!!

 

[JohninFL]

My two cents:

#1 Buy an SRT:10 if you are thinking this hard about it you will regret that you did not pull the trigger.

#2 Could not agree more with the above posts. As an experienced sports car pilot you will have no problem with a Gen III viper. This car is fun to drive slowly. No need to go 90 mph + to get a thrill . Nail it in 2nd and a smile appears and stays. My 9 year old daughter asked last night if she could sleep in it after a beautiful drive to the beach at sunset. (boys waving at her probably had something to do with it).

#3 It is truly a work of art and science combined. It has an hard edge which makes you feel special. The c6 is technologically compelling but what a yawn. There is a pride of ownership with a viper and a source of wonder for passers-by that is hard to duplicate.

#4 I bought a pristine 03 with less than 1,000 miles two mos ago for 22k under an 05 sticker. You might consider shopping for an 03 or 04.

#5 Your daughters friends will talk about you respectfully and you have a better chance of staying golden for a few more years.

#6 Just do it: Life is too short to not reach out and take something you really want.

 

[Turbo63]

Sure appreciate the insight and quite frankly the replies cause more concern then comfort. Again I have owned Vettes for a long time (clearly not a Viper I know) but I would hope driving it carefully and respecting the torque would yield a fun and safe experience. I dont need to blast the thing around the area at 100+mph -- simply want a change from a Vette to a Viper to enjoy the exotic, rare nature of the car, the look, the feel and when familiar, of course the power. If used responsibily can the Snake be managed safely without a Viper Days series of sessions (not saying I wont do that eventually but....) Thanks for the help and other insightful comments!

 

[madman]

Hey folks, stop scaring him SRT is not really that bad. I came to it from little S2k, my torque available grew 4 (!!!) times and see - still well and alive even with the driving through the latest Bay Area storms.

You will find that SRT is a very tame beast, especially with the experience from already strong engine. That handling is not a big deal, just have hands (at least one) on the steering wheel all the time. In reward you get crisp steering you would never get in vette. Good luck!

 

[SnakeEye]

Hey folks, stop scaring him ...

LOL Good point madman.
Turbo63...The SRT-10 is quite tractable in stock form. Being accustomed to C5's as you are, you most likely will be pleasantly surprised with the handling limits even despite its lack of traction control. Heck, I modded my Snake to 3.55's for even more torque on tap and then the Paxton after that. Mabybe you too in time will find that regardleess of the extreme limits of stock Viper you may still want more. First step to having the ride of your life is to pick up an SRT-10. Hope to see you as an Owner in the Viper community soon. Cheers.

 

[sal3coach]

If you are really worried go drive one at the Skip Barber High Performance Driving school. Two days of fun and a lot of Viper seat time.

 

[redsrt03]

Turbo63,

One last thing about the Vipers. They suffer from poor workmanship and are frought with mechanical problems.
They rattle and klunking noises come from the rear end.

My own Viper, which I bought new in April 04, had to have the clutch replaced at 4000 miles. Even though the warranty specifically covers clutch disks for 12months/12k miles, Dodge refused to honor the warranty since I couldn't prove the failure was due to a defective part, assembly, etc. It wind up costing me $2000.00 in repairs. The car also had the differential replaced and the cat converters and resonators. It was in the shop from 29 OCT 04 - 16 DEC 04.

Other owners have reported (in this forum) problems with bolts falling our or being loose (crankshaft, pressure plate, etc.), differentials breaking (at least 2 people), clutch problems, loose or missing body panels, etc.

So in short, it's like having a beautiful wife who sleeps around. You have to be extremely motivated to put up with her and have to accept VD as a normal part of your life.

As for me, I enjoy my Viper as I like to drive fast (I've had it in triple digits dozens of times in the first 6 months of ownership), but I will never buy another Dodge product and as soon as Toyota comes out with a 500hp sports car in the Viper's price range, the Viper is history.

 

[29OUTLAW]

Turbo63,

It was in the shop from 29 OCT 04 - 16 DEC 04.

If your car's out of service for 30 days in the first 12,000 miles you can lemon-law protection. Shifts burden of proof from buyer to manufacturer. Just a thought.

 

[Fred(DrivingSchool)Kinder]

I have purchased five Vipers and still have three.

The quality is very good form my ownership own and the experience of VCA members I know. Have there been an occasional problem? Yes! Have they been corrected by DC Yes!

A clutch is like a brake pad to me. It wears based on usage. If someone is slipping the clutch it will fail and should not be considered a manufacturing defect. I can destroy a set of stock brake pads in a day and that would not be manufacturing defect.

In my opinion Vipers are much more reliable then other exotic High Performance cars.

I would not have purchased my 2nd Viper if I had quality problems that were not corrected to my satisfaction. And I do not blame a manufacture for not making a car that can not be damaged by the driver.

My $.02

 

[Janni]

You'll be find - don't drive like an idiot. Be smooth. Gradually get used to the torque. You ought to be very careful during break in anyway - and slowly ratcheting up your RPMs and no full throttle stuff. That should give you a good feel for the car.

DON'T power shift. Don't "show off" - get the adrenaline flowing and you tend to miss shifts or catch 2nd when you want 4th and that's a "bad thing".

Take the car to an autocross.

The SRT is a VERY well planted car. Coming from a GTS, I am continually amazed how well it holds the road and does all it does without a lot of hoopla.

I've driven the car hard and I honestly don't understand how people do some of the amazing feats of 360's, curb hopping, airborne launches that they do.

You'll be fine. Bottom line, you can't drive this car like a 4 cylinder rental car - but you already know that. I swear some folks don't.....

 

[Turbo63]

what happens if you catch 2nd and not 4th? Thanks Janni for you insight!

 

[Janni]

well....

If you are ******* it - and not paying attention, the wheels will grab and spin you out. HOWEVER - that's why I say to drive smoothly. Let the clutch out slowly enough and be ready to put it right back in should you start to feel the hesitation of 2nd gear. You CAN save it - but not if you are power shifting and popping the clutch (i.e. driving like an idiot) I will contend that most of these issues happen during certain contests started by the green light.....

The SRT is a fine car and based on my experience driving both cars, it should be a non-issue for you to go to this car. The GTSs and RTs were a bit more tail happy and required an even lighter touch / more seat time to get it right. The SRT, IMO is an easy car to drive - handles great, stays planted, stops well enough to remove your eyeballs from your head and does it all without a fuss. Just gradually build up to full throttle activity - get used to the torque - drive for a while in a higher gear than you think you need. Don't goose it going around a corner. Basic stuff.

And get to an autocross. I've had some fast times in the car and it's not easy to induce a spin, IMO, but then again, I always concentrate on being smooth first and fast second.......

Enjoy - and WELCOME!

 

[TedK]

Janni makes some excellent points. The car will not be the problem.....can you restrain yourself? If you constantly beat on it, you will acquire problems. My RT/10 made 522 HP at the wheels, and I never had a problem, but at my age, I drive more conservatively than some. I never raced that car, no hard launches even, just occasional onramp blasts, etc., these cars are pure fun. The 2002 was the only car I owned for less than 5 years. I thought I was over the Viper bug, that lasted about a month.

 

[redsrt03]

29Outlaw,

Your right about the lemon law dates. In Colorado, its 30 business days within the first 12 months. Trouble is, I really do like the car and want to give it one more chance.

Fred(Driving School)
I agree that anything can be broken. I also have put over half a million miles on cars/trucks with manaul trannys and have never had a clutch disk wear out (170k miles on one truck). But if you are completely off of the clutch pedal at speed and notice the pedal pulsing in and out by itself and the smell of the clutch disk burning, that kind of tells you that the car has a problem. BTW The new clutch is exhibiting the same symptoms, pedal pulsing in and out by itself, slight smell of something burning, etc.

Let's face it, Dodge is not a Sigma Six company and never will be!

 

[dirk989]

Turbo63 don't be scared at all.

With the torque and power available the car can do
silly things if you drive without sense or respect.

But, if you respect it and drive like you've passed
a driving test then there aren't any of these problems.

I drive mine everyday. I bought it for a weekend toy
and parked it next to my twin turbo Lotus Esprit. I
quickly sold the Lotus. It is hard to imagine a better
weekend toy, especially when you consider the convertible
top. But, the thing is so much fun to drive it is hard
to restrain yourself to weekends or sunny days. It is 19
degrees today and we have sleet. I'm driving the Viper.
Driven with some sense I've not yet experienced any scary
moments. I have comfortable cars. I have 4 wheel drive
for snow. I have motorcycles for playing in the summer.
All of these are parked in my building, covered and
waiting for me to become bored with my Viper.

Heavy snow will park the Viper, but I doubt that anything
else will.

The first few hours of seat time, you may think it is
uncomfortable. I'm about 6'2 and about 215lbs. The car
fits me like a glove. I'd think that anyone taller or
wider would definitely have some comfort issues. For me,
a few hours in the seat and I now believe the car is
extremely comfortable.

I have an 8 year old son who hates to go anywhere without
demanding that we go in the Viper. My brother in law is
a vette freak. I've owned several and really liked them.
My brother in law parked the Vette next to my 04 SRT-10 and
my 8 year old, who is sweet and very well mannered, took
one look at the Vette and said, "Daddy why are there so
many Corvettes and only 1 Viper?"

If you want one, buy it. I can't see you regretting it.

And for the record, I wouldn't put my 8 yr old in any car
unless I thought it was safe. With a safe driver, the
Viper is a safe car.

Dirk

 

[Turbo63]

Thanks to all -- I am convinced the SRT 10 is for me!! Sure appreciate all of the feedback and advice. I am not scared of the car just want to know what to expect and if there are involuntary things that the car does without the drivers direction -- does not seem to be that at all. I figured a lot of the more aggressive posts were fueled by Viper testosterone anyway -- the mod'ed Vette guys do the same thing. Thanks again to all!! Folks on the Vette side tend to say the Viper guys are a bit cold, you have demonstrated anything but that -- feels good to be in such great company!! Thanks!

Tony

 

[madman]

Dirk, you're mine kind of a guy. I drive mine daily too, dry or wet, who cares. I found myself to make my commute longer just to drive the beast

 

[Fred(DrivingSchool)Kinder]

MSN Owner rating 9+ of 10, for most model years.
http://autos.msn.com/advice/article.aspx?contentid=4019411&src=windowshopping&GT1=5965