Front Lower A Arm just snaped how does that happen?

[Martin2000GTS]

thanks tom didnt think of that, but why would i even need a lower shock bracket.....but then again why would i ever need a lower control arm.....hahaa

 

[99 R/T 10]

Exactly

 

[GTS Dean]

Save that black metal shock bracket. It can be mounted on the forward or rearward side to make the lower arm a left or right a-arm.

Negative. The pic with the parts tag thru the bolt hole shows that the bracket is clearly marked "R" because of anti-dive geometry. The a-arm itself can be installed on either side.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

OK, I'm looking at mine and except for the letter (which I did forget about) what is the difference between the L and the R?

 

[GTS Dean]

The A-arm, in side elevation view, is canted several degrees from horizontal to help generate anti-dive geometry. The shock basically sits vertical from the same viewpoint. The lower shock bracket ears are not the same length. The brackets are mirrored from side to side. If you use an R bracket on the L side, the angle mismatch is effectively doubled and you probably couldn't drive the bolt through the stock shock bushing with a 4# sledge.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Thanks. The "L" bracket I was looking at was off the arm because it was bent - so I couldn't see the difference from the "R".

What a great forum - where else would you get stuff like this?

 

[2000_Black_RT10]

2000 RT 10,

send me your address and i will ship you the parts that broke out this week. id like an explanation of why it broke!!!!

Thanks
Martin

You have my PM / addy.

If you send it out.. I'm going to toss it on a test machine and bust the other arm with a similar load path / direction at GTS Dean mentioned, and compare fractures. I'd post the results & some pics and the force it took to break the arm.
Mike

 

[dave6666]

You have my PM / addy.

If you send it out.. I'm going to toss it on a test machine and bust the other arm with a similar load path / direction at GTS Dean mentioned, and compare fractures. I'd post the results & some pics and the force it took to break the arm.
Mike

Yum! Destructive testing!!! I wanna see! I wanna see!

 

[Paul S Lacey]

What worries me is coincidence which I have trouble in believing, two cars about the same age with the same problem.

So one question for the design guru's could this be a manufacturing problem or a design problem, I would rather change both bottom arms than have one fail at high speed??

One wonders if the 998 recall puts extra pressure on the A arms by reducing the flex in the chassis???

 

[GTS Dean]

This car is an '00, the UK car was a '99. Both of them show a fair amount of rust on the bolts & cams, but this one is extremely mild in comparison. The UK car pics showed SEVERE corrosion and badly dry-rotted bushings. In addition to the lower wishbone, the upper front arm was cracked at the pivot bar bushing too.

Unsettling to say the least.

 

[Paul S Lacey]

Check out Woodhouse I hear they have changed a few of these before, be interested to know the year.

I have had 150 on the clock of the GT2 and would hate to lose her.

 

[InjectTheVenom]

Could it be that a dry-rotted bushing caused a change in dynamics versus a bushing in as-good-as-new condition?

 

[Paul S Lacey]

Possibly but if that happens should your suspension shear!!!!!

 

[OPENRUP]

My 2001 GTS had its right upper control arm replaced at 2,000 miles in 2004 under warranty. The car has never had any damage done to it ever. When Chuck ran the VIN # for me he also questioned why it had been changed? The car has never been on the track or driven in rain. The underside is like new and it did come from Woodhouse also.

 

[dave6666]

My 2001 GTS had its right upper control arm replaced at 2,000 miles in 2004 under warranty. The car has never had any damage done to it ever. When Chuck ran the VIN # for me he also questioned why it had been changed? The car has never been on the track or driven in rain. The underside is like new and it did come from Woodhouse also.

Well, you've teased us for sure. Now can you tell us why it was changed?

 

[OPENRUP]

Well, you've teased us for sure. Now can you tell us why it was changed?

Actually no I can't.....I did not own the car when it was replaced because I'm not the original owner. When I bought the car I had Chuck run the VIN and found that a control arm was replaced. I guess mine could have been replaced for some other reason other than breaking?

 

[plumcrazy]

i had a buddy of mine look at the car this week for me, he didn't see anything like this going on. i hope this is a 99-00 thing. but doubt it.

id also love to see those test results of breaking it

 

[dave6666]

i had a buddy of mine look at the car this week for me, he didn't see anything like this going on. i hope this is a 99-00 thing. but doubt it.

id also love to see those test results of breaking it

I've ordered some crack dye for mine. We'll do the pics and cold beer thing and report back on the 2001 GTS.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

I've ordered some crack dye for mine. We'll do the pics and cold beer thing and report back on the 2001 GTS.

I hope nobody is bending over when you do this...

 

[2000_Black_RT10]

Just a blurb.. hoping to not sound like a forum bs'er at this.. just sharing a job that I completed in my career.. designed the first die cast aluminum steering wheel for Chrysler (at the supplier).. this CAD pic below is about 16 years old.. and some parts dug out from my box of junk.. for the 1996 NS Chrysler minivan redesign.. Extreme amount of testing for a steering wheel.. air bag deployment, push pull tests, torsion, etc.. surviving 100,000 cycles at minimum.. who wants to listen.. my wife heard enough.. It's why I enjoy hanging out on the VCA site..

CAD
http://www.wincom.net/mnllehti/NS_Steering_Wheela.jpg
Protoype part..
http://www.wincom.net/mnllehti/NS_Steering_Wheelb.jpg
Final production part..
http://www.wincom.net/mnllehti/NS_Steering_Wheelc.jpg
http://www.wincom.net/mnllehti/NS_Steering_Wheele.jpg

You must be registered for see images

 

[2000_Black_RT10]

Update.. I received the broken control arm at work today, a coworker (a very respected peer) noticed that the sway bar mount / ear is also cracked! It's split open a bit, and he quickly said it looks like a hit, he's a highly experienced fellow.. worked for Rahal in Indy, designed a LeMans winning Williams / BMW car, NASCAR, GTP, Audi LMP that won 24 hrs at LeMans, SCCA (driver was Paul Newman), etc.. and he even worked for Skip Barber in his early years..

He emphasized to tell you to inspect all of the other control arms.

I'll post some pics this weekend, it's on the list to see how much force the other end can take before failing.
Mike

PS - Thanks for sending the part Martin and making this contribution for us to share with other members on the VCA site.

 

[2000_Black_RT10]

PM sent to Martin.. pics to come after this weekend.. I was too excited to leave work on Friday.. and forgot.. doh!

 

[plumcrazy]

well last night MINE broke and it WAS inspected recently as my last post in this thread showed....ANOTHER broken control arm

mine looks exactly the same as martins. i have the small piece in my hand now and look identical.


MINE IS a 1998, 50k miles

this isnt a coincidence

MIKE ?....MIKE?....you there ? calling Mike....

 

[ViperGTS]

TIME FOR A RECALL?

25000 * 8 control arms = 200.000 plus labor = $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$h$o$l$y$s$h$i$t$!

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Wait until GM buys Chrysler... good luck.

 

[99 R/T 10]

My ears are burning................................................

 

[REDBLACK]

Any updates on this? What is the best way to inspect? Do you just check visually or use dye as previously mentioned? I this a design or material failure? TIA.

 

[plumcrazy]

wouldn't you need to take them off to do a dye inspection ?

 

[99 R/T 10]

i had a buddy of mine look at the car this week for me, he didn't see anything like this going on. i hope this is a 99-00 thing. but doubt it.

Just thinking about the point Phil brought up. Does anybody know if there was a change in the manufacture of the suspension components? Maybe the Grail Keeper might know, but using Chuck Babel(TVC) as an example, he has over 100K on his 98 with no breakage(that I know of). He has some hard track miles on his 97. Maybe there was a change in 99.

 

[dave6666]

wouldn't you need to take them off to do a dye inspection ?

I going to in-situ dye check mine this week. I'll post some pics when done.