Insurance for high performance driving events

[Roland L-Ocala FL]

I just put my insurance back on for Saturday on the '94 Viper, and asked them if I am covered if I go to a high performance driving school, not a timed event or anything, and NO! I am not covered for such an event whatsoever! Yikes! Does anyone know if there is any insurance you can get for the track on a day by day basis? How expensive is it, geez, you can't go on a track to learn how to really drive your car without losing your coverage, this does not make sense to me. As a matter of fact, they told me if I did not state that I would not go on the track, they would refuse to even insure the car, because of the risk.
Is this happening more and more? I really enjoyed the high performance school last year at Gingerman, but you won't see me on the track this year or ever again, unless I can get coverage at a reasonable price. This is getting crazy, you can't even let loose a little bit anymore, without losing your insurance coverage. Be aware, check with your insurance carrier and know for sure what is covered and what isn't, or you may be very surprised!

 

[Janni]

Contact Skip at ViperDays. Jon Belinkie has put together a stated value track only insurance program for high speed driving events. Skip passed out a sheet of information on this. You can choose up to 30 days per year of covered track events. 10% deductible....

 

[Magicboy2]

There was a thread about this a while back... try a search.

 

[joe117]

"this does not make sense to me"
Why would an insurance company be interested in a high performance driving school. All of their rates are based on street driving and street conditions.
I'm sure you can buy day coverage for specific events and I'm sure it will be expensive. It won't be so expensive that you couldn't buy it.
Just remember, you might total your car and be out of pocket for that loss but that's not all that can happen. If you were to seriously injure someone, and their family had no choice but to come after you in court, there really isn't any limit to your possible loss.

We have had this discussion a few times in the past. Some guys seem to think that a regular insurance company should be happy to cover you while you are driving 130+ mph and learning how to go very fast around corners. Why they don't see this as a very special hazard well beyond what one would face on the road, is beyond me.

Call it a driving school if you like but I'll bet there are far more wrecks per mile than on any regular road.

Buy yourself a real dedicated race car and race it. You will have a ball. High performance driving on a track in your expensive street car is just asking for trouble.

 

[pdmracing]

(Call it a driving school if you like but I'll bet there are far more wrecks per mile than on any regular road.)

That just is not true. There are thousands of drivers education events across the country each year & the rate of accidents per mile is very small compared with he general public. We had a recent event that had 165 cars at one of the most difficult tracks in the world with not one accident. & most events have 0 car to car contact. This isnt race school but a closed course driving event. Look at it this way, you are paying for every cell phone user , make up artist,illegal alien,uninsured,teenager,newpaper reader,speeder,drunk, & tv watchin driver on the road. What is the diff? There is none . If your policy does NOT EXCLUDE closed course non timed events, then you have every right to track your car & get paid if a mishap happens. You stand a better chance on the track then you do on any public roadway. I had over 15 years of track driving (not race driving thats a story for another day) before I had bent any sheetmetal or had a mechanical breakdown for that matter. Lucky? maybe, but it made me a much better highway driver & I get out my need for speed on the track & not on your street!

In fact when I first started driving in the PCA Drivers ed series, my ins. co gave me a discount!


On the issue of on track insurance, there are many companies available & I have posted many times befor. Parish insurance & American International are just 2, search for Rockytops insurance post about 2 months ago for links.

 

[joe117]

Look guys, I wish your insurance companies would cover you, I'm on your side. What I say and think has nothing to do with what your insurance company covers. If it did I would say nothing but good things.

But my point is bolstered by your statement, "I had over 15 years of track driving (not race driving thats a story for another day) before I had bent any sheetmetal"

In those 15 years, how many miles did you drive in the performance driving school environment? 1000 miles, 2000 miles, 10,000 miles. My point is you probably drove hundreds of times that many miles on the street in 15 years without any bent sheetmetal. I know I did.

Anyone who says that "the rate of accidents per mile is very small compared with he general public", is just not doing the math. Even your example of your own experience would show my point.

These insurance companies are not stupid. They would cover you for these events if they thought it was a good idea. They want to make money and they are very competitive. They are not going to drive paying customers away for no reason.

How many times have you heard some young gentleman complain about his high insurance rates, just because he is single and under 25 and drives a Viper? They will say, "I'm a good driver, I never had an accident", and yet the insurance companies would be happy if they just went away. Do you think those insurers are missing out on easy money?

Again, I'm on your side. I wish they would cover you and I wish big boats were cheap and a new Viper was within the reach of anyone who wanted one and if they didn't want a Viper they could have a Ferrari for the same price.
But I'm a realist, and in the real world only an idiot would write a low cost policy on a guy learning to drive his 450 hp, $70k car in a hi performance driving school.

 

[onerareviper]

Joe,

I agree and disagree. Here's my viewpoint. Mr. Smith buys a 450 HP Viper. OK. You know, I know, and the insurance company knows he is going to exceed the speed limit on public roads. Being a 'realist', why else would you need/purchase a 450 HP car. Assuming this to be true, would you rather have Mr. Smith speeding on public highways, while having no training on how to handle a car of this caliber? Or would you encourage a few performance driving schools to enable Mr. Smith the knowledge and skills to handle and understand the mechanics of a 450 HP monster?

The way I see it, it is a double edged sword. Sure, you are going to have a few accidents at performance driving schools. Although, I feel the people that attend these schools are FAR, FAR, FAR less likely to have an accident on public highways. You learn the limits of your car, emergency manuvers, threshhold braking, and many, many other skills that can truly prevent an accident on the public roads. 90+% of accidents (I heard of) involving a Viper was either a new owner, or an unskilled driver.

Things that make you go Hmmmmm.....

 

[Roland L-Ocala FL]

The main reason I posted this information was to let everyone know that you really need to check with your insurance carrier, because you might just be really surprised to find out that you are not covered for any track events at all! Forewarned is forearmed, so just do a bit of checking. But be careful how you even ask the question, as your insurance may refuse to even insure you once you pop the question about high performance driving schools, etc. I thought they would be glad that you are wanting to learn more about how to handle your car better in emergency situations, but that does not seem to be the case at all. So, no more track time at all for me, not if my insurace won't cover it. Don't even go drag racing, that is not covered either! I have the number one rated insurance carrier in the US insuring my Viper, and I do not want to jeopardize my coverage. Be careful and ask some important questions regarding your Viper coverage, that's all I want to bring up!

 

[Elite1]

I wouldn't be using any statistics and figuring math for accident rates per mile based on info from insurance companies. That number is so far off its truly worthless. I've never been in an "accident", well last month I was in 2 or was I. Slow moving traffic during rush hour resulted in being rearended twice in a months time. Rear damage cost on the Durango, $2000 approx each time. Both parties paid for damage out of pocket. Why? You report a fault accident and your rates go way up or you get canceled all together and good luck finding new insurance. The insurance industry has the bets of all worlds. Take peoples money, make them so scared as to never report a claim, if you ever do 1) refuse to pay, 2) raise rates muchoness, 3) drop from service.

I would be willing to bet a rather huge number of "accidents" per normal street mile is much higher than any report would indicate.

Just some interesting ideas for thought!

 

[timz06]

To the first poster, I would bet you are covered by your insurance, even though they said you are not. If you are not covered why would they make you say you are not going to do de's or lose you policy? Why do they care if they don't have to pay anyway? I'll bet they have to insure you. Calling and asking is not the way to go.

I am doing de's as well and have been thinking about this. I have done 4 events now, and have not come close to having an off track excursion. You just have to use common sense. That said, things can happen like brake failure, or hitting oil on the track.

I don't know if I will be covered or not, probably would be a fight. If I call I'm sure they will say no. I think the best way to find out is to call and get a copy of your policy, and see what it says, everything should be spelled out. Then you have the info, this is what I am going to do.

Anyway, I know I am taking a calculated risk out there, and that I could loose the car, but life is all risks, you just have to decide if it is worth it. I like to mountain bike as well, and could hit a tree and die, so do I bike or sit at home?