Spark plug recomendations?

[KenH]

KenH- While the popping can really never be completely eliminated due to cyl. 10 running richer than the rest at idle/cruise on the Roe S/C's, the difference when installing the RC10ECC's is HUGE. The current S/C car I am finishing this week went from "embarrassing to drive" to "certainly livable- just keeps bystanders on their toes." As a side benefit the car is smoother. The only time it really pops now is when you let off the pedal, which is not far from normal, its just a little louder.

I don't mind some closed throttle popping and snapping, but mine is on the embarrassing side when I am just idling along at part throttle. If you have a set left, I'll take them. If not, it looks like these plugs are popular in the marine industry. I might be able to find some through that channel.

 

[Schulmann]

I have done some testing with the RC12ECC and they are viable. I know that they are hotter but I had sever fooling problems before. Now all troubles seem to be elliminated. Anyhow 99% of the time I am driving on HWY under vacuum and maybe 1% of the time underboost. I will also test the FR5-1 and if I can get a set of these RC10ECC I will test them too. But definitely for daily driving these projected tip plugs are the perfect choice.

 

[SYNFULL]

This site seems to have the hard to find plugs
http://www.onlineoutboards.com/a_spark_plugs.html

 

[Bobpantax]

It is a given that the plug and/or gap requirements of a boosted Viper differ from the requirements of a normally aspirated Viper. For mildy modified, normally aspirated Viper engines, I defer to the Wizard's sage advice. Champions are the champion. For the Roe application, which I have, I have been using NGK iridium plugs (# BKR5EIX, stock number 6341, .028 gap) since May of this year and have found them to work well around town and at WOT. These are the plugs used in the Bentley Continental twin turbo luxury sports car. It seemed logical that they would provide good performance based on their use in the Bentley and the logic, at least in my Viper, proved corect.

 

[Viper Specialty]

I don't mind some closed throttle popping and snapping, but mine is on the embarrassing side when I am just idling along at part throttle. If you have a set left, I'll take them. If not, it looks like these plugs are popular in the marine industry. I might be able to find some through that channel.

Yep, I know exactly what you are talking about. The SC car I am finishing was the same way, embarassing to drive- you KNOW everyone is looking at you saying "That Viper is broken!"

The small shipment of plugs I have coming in this week are sold, these things have sold like crazy. I am expecting an additional 100 plugs next week to fulfill the new orders.

These plugs are found in the marine industry, but low-production will make them damn near impossible to find. Also, they will cost an arm and a leg to order through any marine retailers, as I found out.

 

[Viper Specialty]

I have done some testing with the RC12ECC and they are viable. I know that they are hotter but I had sever fooling problems before. Now all troubles seem to be elliminated. Anyhow 99% of the time I am driving on HWY under vacuum and maybe 1% of the time underboost. I will also test the FR5-1 and if I can get a set of these RC10ECC I will test them too. But definitely for daily driving these projected tip plugs are the perfect choice.

I would be careful with those OEM plugs under any boost... just a warning that I am sure you are already aware of.

 

[Viper Specialty]

This site seems to have the hard to find plugs
http://www.onlineoutboards.com/a_spark_plugs.html

WOW, I sell these plugs a lot cheaper than those guys! They want 80 bucks a set of 10, I sell them for $52.50 + ship for a set of 10. Good example of what I mean about the Marine industry though... "arm and a leg..."

 

[Viper Specialty]

Quick Note:

If anyone was interested in grabbing a set of the RC10ECC's outlined in this post, I have 100 plugs being shipped to me on September 6th. Between 30 and 50 are currently spoken for.

Thanks,

 

[Cal Cobra]

Sanity check on isle 13 please

When the headers and 3" B&B exhaust (cat del) went on, I installed Champion RC12ECC plugs (.035 gap) and MSD 8.5MM wires (part# 32259).

Personally I think the exhaust sounds fantastic (especially when really getting on it!), with one caveat - the popping sounds like gun fire! If I leave it in gear when de-accelerating, it pops like mad (just call me Machine Gun Kelly!). The stock exhaust also did it to an extent (the 96 RT/10 only has one muffler, no resonators), but definitely not as loud, and I don't recall quite as much.

It also does it a bit when changing gears with part throttle once and a while.

I just want to make sure something's not amiss?

Thanks,
Cal

 

[TOOOFST]

Jack i've used the stock plug for nitrous shots.If your A/F WOT is 10's:to 1 it's doesn't seem to hurt the plug for a quarter.
I've dyno'd better with a colder plug N/A than the stock plug.Figure that.
I'd use an NGK or quality substitute before using the stock champions.I've seen problems with the stock ones and the VISUAL quality of the plug looks BAD.

 

[Viper Specialty]

Cal- I would suspect your popping issue is simply the change to high-flow cats, nothing more. High-Flows pop and gurgle a LOT more than stock.

TOOOFST- It does not surprise me that you dyno'd more with a colder plug, even stock. In my opinion, the OEM plug is just a hair too hot to begin with.

On the quality of the Champion plugs, While I do admit that the OEM Gen 1/2 Viper plug was not all that great, the ECC versions do appear to be much improved. the consistency is very close, all barrels are straight and true, etc. In all honestly, I have seen MUCH worse quality than Champions even amoung the best plugs, like Denso, NGK, and Bosch. I even had a set of 20 Denso Iridiums that IMHO only had 10 GOOD plugs in it- and those are 10$+ plugs...

 

[Cal Cobra]

Thanks Dan - actually the cats went bye bye, it's wide open now, so that probably contributes to it (once and a while there's a slight smell of raw fuel

Thanks,
Cal

 

[Jack B]

Dan:

The 10's run as well or better then the oem plugs. The idle has also picked up a bit over the FR5-1's. What does the double copper mean, if you look at the cutaway drawing it does not indicate double copper.

 

[Viper Specialty]

JACK- Double copper indicates that both the Center Electrode, and the Ground electrode, have a true copper core. All ECC's have this feature. LYC plugs from the gen-1/2 have only a copper center electrode, while ground remains plain steel. While the steel electrode can conduct spark energy away well enough, it plain ***** at extracting heat energy. the copper aids in extracting heat from the electrode much faster than plain steel. If you run accross an old ECC plug that is destined for the garbage, grab the ground with pliers and rip it apart. You will find a copper center sheathed in steel- quite cool I may add, checked it out myself.

 

[ViperJoe]

Always good reading on a cold winters night......from previous threads:

Champion “Regular Class” - Traditional #RC12LYC (what’s in there from Mopar)

Champion “Super Class” - Single Platinum #3034
Platinum center electrode, resistor plug, 14mm, 3/4" reach, 5/8" hex head, .290 core nose projection, copper core. **

Champion “Premium Class” - Premium Gold #2412
Gold Paladium performance plug, resistor plug, 18mm, .460" reach, taper seat, 13/16" hex head, extended electrode gap & core nose projection. **
Gold palladium - Gold is an excellent conductor of electricity, which makes it well suited for a performance plug. However gold is also a very soft metal, therefore the gold alloy is mixed with palladium, (a much harder metal), to form a premium fine wire performance plug with increased ignitability and durability.


Autolite Single Platinum #AP985 **

Autolite Double Platinum #APP985 **


Bosch PLATINUM #4203 **

Bosch PLATINUM+2 #4308 **

Bosch PLATINUM+4 #4428 **

Bosch SUPER PLUG #FR9HC **


Denso 5018 QJ16HR-U

GAP .035

** It is still not suggested that platinum plugs be used on vehicles with nitrous injection (from Champions website)
There have been instances where the platinum tip has lost its bond to either the center or ground electrode when they were used in a motor with nitrous.

The spark plug can help maintain the optimum combustion chamber temperature. The primary method used to do this is by altering the internal length of the core nose, in addition, the alloy compositions in the electrodes can be changed. This means you may not be able to visually tell a difference between heat ranges. When a spark plug is referred to as a “cold plug”, it is one that transfers heat rapidly from the firing tip into the engine head, which keeps the firing tip cooler. A “hot plug” has a much slower rate of heat transfer, which keeps the firing tip hotter.

An unaltered engine will run within the optimum operating range straight from the manufacturer, but if you make modifications such as a turbo, supercharger, increase compression, timing changes, use of alternate racing fuels, or sustained use of nitrous oxide, these can alter the plug tip temperature and may necessitate a colder plug. A rule of thumb is, one heat range colder per modification or one heat range colder for every 75–100hp you increase. In identical spark plug types, the difference from one full heat range to the next is the ability to remove 70°C to 100°C from the combustion chamber.

The heat range numbers used by spark plug manufacturers are not universal, by that we mean, a 10 heat range in Champion is not the same as a 10 heat range in NGK nor the same in Autolite. Some manufacturers numbering systems are opposite the other, for domestic manufacturers (Champion, Autolite, Splitfire), the higher the number, the hotter the plug.
For Japanese manufacturers (NGK, Denso), the higher the number, the colder the plug.


Remember, CHAMPION PLUGS GET HOTTER THE HIGHER THE NUMBER, COLDER THE LOWER THE NUMBER.

Say you are starting with a RCJ7Y
if you want a COLDER plug, you would use RCJ6Y
if you want a HOTTER plug, you would use RCJ8Y

Here is the breakdown for the Champion part number:

R= 14mm Thread, Gasket seat
C= 3/4 Inch Reach
12= Heat Range
E or LY= Projected Tip
C= Copper Core
CC= Double Copper (Copper core AND Copper Cored Ground Electrode)


http://www.championsparkplugs.com/sparkplug411_champion.asp