TacDoc
Enthusiast
I definitely took it easy on launch, the GTS was the only way home. I was not going WOT until car was gently hooked up and moving.
Greg
96RT
00GTS
Greg
96RT
00GTS
2000 Vipers are no creampuffs
- Thread starter Toronto_ACR
- Start date
BWoodbury
Enthusiast
Creampuff is a term that those of us with the lumpier, mightier, cam (found in the '96 to '99 Vipers) bestowed on the 2000 and 2001 Vipers. Ther have been quite a few cases where 2000 and 2001 cars were shown down on power a bit on the dyno. These are most likely just cases of engines that have not been broken in yet. But since our cam sounds better, and since it does allow a bit more power (especially when the intake and exhaust are open up) we like to ride those who own these new creampuffs.
I would not hesitate to buy a 2000 or 2001. In fact I would gladly trade my 1996 for a 2001 with ABS in a heartbeat!
BUT THEY ARE STILL WIMPY ASSED CREAMPUFFS! That's my story and I'm sticking with it.
I would not hesitate to buy a 2000 or 2001. In fact I would gladly trade my 1996 for a 2001 with ABS in a heartbeat!
BUT THEY ARE STILL WIMPY ASSED CREAMPUFFS! That's my story and I'm sticking with it.
SneakyPete
Enthusiast
creampuffs are better on the track
genXgts
Enthusiast
what's up with the three year old pull up?
everyone knows that 96-98 Vipers are the best, move along now!
biased, you bet.
everyone knows that 96-98 Vipers are the best, move along now!
biased, you bet.
Matt PA is on the mark!
Many 2000's have run 11 second times at the track, and the lowest published time EVER in a completely stock Viper was when Evan Smith (freelance awesome test driver) ran an 11.76 in a stock 2000 RT/10. Evan paralleled that feat when he took my 2000 GTS, on a 92 degree day, with 90%+ humidity and ran a 11.98 against a Z06 in a comparison test that was published in GM High Tech Performance Magazine.
Creampuff = smooooooth, tasty treat!
Many 2000's have run 11 second times at the track, and the lowest published time EVER in a completely stock Viper was when Evan Smith (freelance awesome test driver) ran an 11.76 in a stock 2000 RT/10. Evan paralleled that feat when he took my 2000 GTS, on a 92 degree day, with 90%+ humidity and ran a 11.98 against a Z06 in a comparison test that was published in GM High Tech Performance Magazine.
Creampuff = smooooooth, tasty treat!
TomSlick
Viper Owner
The '02 car I have now is more civilized than the '96 and '98 cars I owned. It's got a smoother ride and shift, but doesn't have the power that the older cars had. For just street driving, I prefer the '02 (lightly modded), but the '96 was bone stock and it was the fastest car I'd ever owned. The '98 had light mods and was good and broke in. It would rev to 5500 rpm in neutral, but still not the car the '96 was. I do feel the newer cars are creampuff's, but they are still Vipers, and I like them no matter what. I can and might put a SC or TT on, but for now the '02 has plenty of power for me. Why are the '00 and '01 cars talked about, but the '02 cars are not?
Y2K5SRT
Enthusiast
Look at the dates on most of these posts - they are from early 2001. The 2002 wasn't even a glimmer in its father's eyes...
Fast Freddy
Enthusiast
take a look at my sig to see how my creampuff dyno'd with exhaust mods only. when she was bone stock i pulled 421 horse to the rear wheel. my next mod will be heads and 1.7 ratio rockers. should be over 500 rwhp then. does anybody know what the lift and duration and LSA specs are on the comp coupe cam?
fuelman
VCA Venom Member
My creampuffer went 12.17 @ 117 mph bone stock. With roller rockers (to get a little of the cam action of the 96-99 cars) and a catback the car went 11.89 at 121 mph. With a 5 PSI Roe blower and tuning by Macedo the car went 11.03 at 128 mph, no headers at this point. The car has gone 10.8 on Drag radials and I have seen over 130 mph on the Michelins with a low 11 second pass. Nothing changed internally in the motor, stock creampuff. I have run with and beaten many 96-99 cars with Roe Blowers and 8 psi pulleys. The Puffers will run, you just have to watch how much pressure you put on those Mexican made cast pistons.
I've owned both a '95 and now an '00, but I can't compare dyno numbers yet (haven't had the '00 on the dyno, yet). However, the big difference I percieve between the cars is the throttle response - the '95 would react *instantly* to throttle input (which could be a bad thing, if you weren't used to it), while the '00 is a bit more relaxed about its response. However, under full throttle, it feels like the '00 is pulling harder - expected with 50 more horsepower, I would assume. Now, I once heard some uncofirmed rumour that Dodge intentionally changed the throttle response to lessen the number of people trying to kill themselves by stabbing the throttle, but I'd like my old throttle response back.
BTW: the '95 ran a max of 357hp with no mods at all, then I put the K&N's on while it was strapped to the dyno (i.e., ran the dyno again about 30 minutes later), and the max hp was 368 hp - so, a confirmed 11 hp for $90. Turns out I had the best hp/$$ ratio for the people running the dyno that day.
BTW: the '95 ran a max of 357hp with no mods at all, then I put the K&N's on while it was strapped to the dyno (i.e., ran the dyno again about 30 minutes later), and the max hp was 368 hp - so, a confirmed 11 hp for $90. Turns out I had the best hp/$$ ratio for the people running the dyno that day.
kgrif
Viper Owner
Yea but owners of 2000 Vipers "DO IT" more often and are CHICK MAGNETS!!!!!!!!
Gerald
Enthusiast
I hear ya'.. My 98 feels strong as hell after 4 years.
Pre-2000 cars just feel faster because they shake around and sound lumpy, it's all in the head. Most who have owned both seem to agree the so-called creampuff has the stronger engine. It makes sense, they are the newer models. I think we should name the pre 2000 vipers marshmallows.
orlandov10
Enthusiast
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WOW! My 1999 GTS made 430RWHP Stock! I was told it was a strong one.
Adam
Casey
Enthusiast
I just figured it out!
It just came to me like a Bolt or Lightning out of the Clear Blue Sky!
MY VIPER IS THE BEST AND EVERY OTHER ONE IS A CREAMPUFF!!
It just came to me like a Bolt or Lightning out of the Clear Blue Sky!
MY VIPER IS THE BEST AND EVERY OTHER ONE IS A CREAMPUFF!!
Jeff-00-ACR
Enthusiast
You pre-2000 Dyno Queens are just haters. Try taking your pre-2000 stock Viper to the track and post up some numbers. I couldn't give a sheit what the Dyno says. How about some 1/4 times...
2000 Viper ACR 11.852 1/4 Mile in-car video
2000 Viper ACR 11.852 bone stock in-car video...
2000 Viper ACR 11.852 1/4 Mile in-car video
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2000 Viper ACR 11.852 bone stock in-car video...
2002_Viper_GTS_ACR
Enthusiast
I have done 11.50's @ 124 in my 02.. with just bolt ons, and its consistent as hell.
Jon
Jon
LETHAL GTS
Viper Owner
Eat your hearts out you pre-creampuff *******!
My car just had some of the basic mods done for this dyno at Viper Days at Brainerd MN. For example: Vec1 S&B filters, Smooth tubes, B&B 3in exhaust and no cats.
You must be registered for see images
You must be registered for see images
My car just had some of the basic mods done for this dyno at Viper Days at Brainerd MN. For example: Vec1 S&B filters, Smooth tubes, B&B 3in exhaust and no cats.
2002_Viper_GTS_ACR
Enthusiast
I have done 11.50's @ 124 in my 02.. with just bolt ons, and its consistent as hell.
Jon
I would like to see a vid or some slips, do you have any?
Got tons of slips, no video though.
But I must warn you, my cream puff has a solid center. Fully under warranty.. but solid center.. no creme on the inside.
;-)
Jon
YELL03
Viper Owner
My 2001 GTS ran 11.67@120+ with just Roe smooth tubes, Roe filters, and Kumho Ecsta V700s on the rear.
I remember one bad track day in the winter (30moh head winds) before I had Kumhos, I was running [email protected] (1.89 60') with no traction anywhere on the track, I couldn't even shift 1-2 without heading towards the wall, a 2003 Viper was only trapping 113-114.
The cam specs are not all that different between the pre-2000 and post 2000, it is only a difference of 6 degrees of overlap.
I am usually not occky, but I'll line up from a dig or roll with any 96-99 with the same mods as my car on the track - I'll bet I beat 95% of them.
I drove my buddy's 99 GTS, at idle I did not notice that HUGE CAM making much of a difference, in fact I think my car sounded the same or louder. I also drove his car, and it did not feel any faster.
Not trying to start a war, but.....
THE NUMBERS ON THE TRACK STATE MY CASE....
However - I still believe our WIMPY CAST PISTONS still rightfully earn us the CREAMPUFF NAME and that I agree with!!!
I will always be afraid to BOOST my car with those in there.
I think my car might be so fast because it is YELLOW!
Howard
I remember one bad track day in the winter (30moh head winds) before I had Kumhos, I was running [email protected] (1.89 60') with no traction anywhere on the track, I couldn't even shift 1-2 without heading towards the wall, a 2003 Viper was only trapping 113-114.
The cam specs are not all that different between the pre-2000 and post 2000, it is only a difference of 6 degrees of overlap.
I am usually not occky, but I'll line up from a dig or roll with any 96-99 with the same mods as my car on the track - I'll bet I beat 95% of them.
I drove my buddy's 99 GTS, at idle I did not notice that HUGE CAM making much of a difference, in fact I think my car sounded the same or louder. I also drove his car, and it did not feel any faster.
Not trying to start a war, but.....
THE NUMBERS ON THE TRACK STATE MY CASE....
However - I still believe our WIMPY CAST PISTONS still rightfully earn us the CREAMPUFF NAME and that I agree with!!!
I will always be afraid to BOOST my car with those in there.
I think my car might be so fast because it is YELLOW!
Howard
2000gtsgsxr1000
Enthusiast
My creampuff pulled 429RWH with tubes,catback and fiters.I beat several new ones at the track.I think I'll keep my puff.Moto on.I gotta agree with the big guy here. When we did our local dyno day I don't remember a single 2000 / 2001 that pulled anything in the 400's.<P>Compare my numbers to SloCal's. If I only gained 5 rwHP from a set of Belanger headers I would not be happy.<P>The '96's kick ***!!! (and it you're Big Jim they get more too)<P>
Actually I believe the term "Creampuff" refers to the cast pistons that the engines came with after '99. When supercharging the pistons limit the power output of the supercharged engine (because of reliablility). 8# boost requires forged pistons and the '00 and up need to upgrade the pistons, the '99 and easlier don't.
My '98 had stock pistons and dyno'd 598rwhp. My '01 dyno'd 700rwhp, but it has aftermarket pistons. "Creampuff" only pertains to pistons and modifications performance.
My experience is that the Gen2's have far superior tires with the PS1's and the 3rd Gen can't surpass the Gen2, even with extra hp because they come with "run-flats". My '98 had Gen3 wheels and tires and NO Traction. My '01 has PS1's with over an extra 100hp and it has twice the traction. The Gen3 tires made the '98 unsafe to drive at that power level, the 01 is lots safer because of the better traction.
Ted
My '98 had stock pistons and dyno'd 598rwhp. My '01 dyno'd 700rwhp, but it has aftermarket pistons. "Creampuff" only pertains to pistons and modifications performance.
My experience is that the Gen2's have far superior tires with the PS1's and the 3rd Gen can't surpass the Gen2, even with extra hp because they come with "run-flats". My '98 had Gen3 wheels and tires and NO Traction. My '01 has PS1's with over an extra 100hp and it has twice the traction. The Gen3 tires made the '98 unsafe to drive at that power level, the 01 is lots safer because of the better traction.
Ted
TrainerDave
Enthusiast
Jon was that before or after you put the NON- creampuff cam in your carI have done 11.50's @ 124 in my 02.. with just bolt ons, and its consistent as hell.
Jon
, we all know that the Black/sliver 99 ACRS's are the fastest cars in the world. Actually all Joking aside werent you telling me about some of the details of the cam specs that were different for 708 cam 98-99 cars? something about the degree of something, that spits out raw fuel to keep the cylinders charged. I erased that PM can you go over that one again? Also what lope separation were these cams? Also I read the 96 cam had the least amount of lift as compared to the 97-99's To all the guys with "creampuffs" , I dont think anything that can run 11's stock and dyno over 400hp is a creampuff.TrainerDave
Enthusiast
I raise another question, how many gen 3 cars run in the 11's so for I havent seen many(except the magazine time for the new 600hp coupe. where did all that 50 hp go?
Boxer12
Enthusiast
Who cares about dynos? I have NEVER been beaten around any track (roadcourse) by an equivalent (meaning zero drive train mods or aero mods) Gen 1 car. Smoother power delivery equals faster times. Nuff said. In my opinion, creampuffs are cars with ABS!
kcobean
Enthusiast
The Gen-I cars had less power than the Gen-II....considerably less, like 400 vs. 450. Makes sense that you would be faster.
And the 2000, while not an ABS car, is definitely still in the 'creampuff' realm by the common definition...cast pistons.
And WOW this thread smells like rotting corpse...I mean this thing is OLD!
