Newly Installed Headers/exhaust... Sound Not What I Was Expecting?

[jpa99acr]

Well, I just installed a new exhaust on my 99 ACR. I picked up the headers from 1Tony1 (thanks Tony) and got the rest from a member here on the board.

The 02 sensor wires on the pass side melted somehow after the install (heat from merge collector??), causing the PCM fuse to blow and the car wouldn't start- would crank but not turn over. Took awhile to find the problem but now all is good!

The sound ended up sounding stock at idle, just an amplified version. Under WOT it sounds pretty good, but it has zero deceleration popping.
Here is what I put on:

B&B 1 3/4 headers
Random Tech High Flows
Borla Catback (the ones with the inner tips)

What to do? The system on my old ACR was a full belanger, and it sounded awesome. This just isn't loud enough and doesn't have lumpy, burbling sound I was looking for. More of a consistent, deep roar.

Should I just replace the catback or cut the cats off?

 

[uvbnbit]

Cut 'em off!.

 

[ViperTony]

Cut the cats off.

 

[dave6666]

Dave's previous system:

Stock headers
Stock cats
Corsa cat-back with rear mufflers deleted

New system:

Belanger headers
Parts Rack R/T cats
Belanger resonators in sills
Side exhaust outlet

Now I never really thought the previous system was loud, but being rear exit my vantage point was not accurate. The neighbors said it was loud, and I never get on it in the hood.

Fast forward to now. Still building my custom header heat shields, but I have ran the car in the garage. Goosed it too as would be expected... But anyway, same thoughts. ***??? Where's that loud business???

I agree with the previous assessments of yank the cats.

I also agree with a few that I've read about that say I'm tired of the noise.

I'm gonna keep my cats.

 

[chimazo]

On my '98, all I have is Roe's cats and the new style 3" Borla with the rear resonators (see pic) and you can easily hear the lope of the cam and it is plenty loud. Deep and as good as this engine's gonna sound without annoying everybody else. Any louder and I wouldn't like it.

Is the diameter of the old Borla's 3"?

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[johnk]

At age 53, I subscribe to the theory that things are going to be really, really quiet for me at some point soon, and for all eternity, therefore, I want to make all the noise I can while I'm above ground... If I can't set off car alarms in my cars and bike, it's not loud enough..... But that's just me.......

 

[Kenneth Krieger]

johnk......I just had to chuckle when you talked about setting off car alarms......not trying to puke on your thread.....while on a cruise to Scottsdale last month, stopped for lunch and then went through the parking lot to exit the complex......set off at least 10 car alarms (I have Belanger headers, high flow cats, and Dynomax racing mufflers)......it was so funny watching 3 people come running to see about their cars! By the way, I'm 59, and agree.....the sound (noise) is GREAT....and the results are awesome!!!

 

[jpa99acr]

On my '98, all I have is Roe's cats and the new style 3" Borla with the rear resonators (see pic) and you can easily hear the lope of the cam and it is plenty loud. Deep and as good as this engine's gonna sound without annoying everybody else. Any louder and I wouldn't like it.

Is the diameter of the old Borla's 3"?

You must be registered for see images attach

Yeah, it's 3" from headers to tips. I will video the car with the engine running and post the youtube link on here this evening. I know this issue is subjective, but perhaps it will help for everyone to actually hear what it sounds like.

My tips look different than yours, they have some sort of inner tip as well.

 

[Camfab]

Well, I just installed a new exhaust on my 99 ACR. I picked up the headers from 1Tony1 (thanks Tony) and got the rest from a member here on the board.

The 02 sensor wires on the pass side melted somehow after the install (heat from merge collector??), causing the PCM fuse to blow and the car wouldn't start- would crank but not turn over. Took awhile to find the problem but now all is good!

The sound ended up sounding stock at idle, just an amplified version. Under WOT it sounds pretty good, but it has zero deceleration popping.
Here is what I put on:

B&B 1 3/4 headers
Random Tech High Flows
Borla Catback (the ones with the inner tips)

What to do? The system on my old ACR was a full belanger, and it sounded awesome. This just isn't loud enough and doesn't have lumpy, burbling sound I was looking for. More of a consistent, deep roar.

Should I just replace the catback or cut the cats off?

Aside from the sound factor, did you track your car or get any zero-sixty figures when your car was stock? I've heard from numerous people that the 1 3/4" primary coupled with a non merge style collector results in a substantial decrease in low to mid range torque on a non supercharged application. What are your thoughts or your seat of the pants impressions. Pulling the cats will increase noise levels quite a bit, though drone may become a factor with the Borla system.

 

[plumcrazy]

i thought the decel popping was from running RICH.

 

[MacManInfi]

I say replace the Borla cat-back. Borlas are always moderate on the volume scale, no matter what car they're in. If you had Belanger on your old car and loved it, you're not gonna be happy with anything else I don't think.

If you cut off the cats, I don't think it'll be that much louder, it'll just stink like rotten eggs.

 

[CROM]

I have the old style Borla. It's loud as hell. Granted I do not have cats. I do believe the new Borla systems are more "tame" but it sounds like you have the old system (inner tips) like I do.

Maybe you are just hard of hearing? My car sounds absolutely insane.

 

[johnk]

johnk......I just had to chuckle when you talked about setting off car alarms......not trying to puke on your thread.....while on a cruise to Scottsdale last month, stopped for lunch and then went through the parking lot to exit the complex......set off at least 10 car alarms (I have Belanger headers, high flow cats, and Dynomax racing mufflers)......it was so funny watching 3 people come running to see about their cars! By the way, I'm 59, and agree.....the sound (noise) is GREAT....and the results are awesome!!!

LOL, that's GREAT!!!!!

 

[cyaford]

Should I just replace the catback or cut the cats off?

Neither!! Replace the headers with stock manifolds from a '97 GTS!! Data has shown both power and noise levels increase substantially when using manifolds from a '97 GTS. I'll be happy to help you out on the swap, as I have a mint set on my '97 GTS. I'll do a straight up swap, but only because I know you. We have a deal?

I agree with Chip, cut those cats!

 

[jpa99acr]

Aside from the sound factor, did you track your car or get any zero-sixty figures when your car was stock? I've heard from numerous people that the 1 3/4" primary coupled with a non merge style collector results in a substantial decrease in low to mid range torque on a non supercharged application. What are your thoughts or your seat of the pants impressions. Pulling the cats will increase noise levels quite a bit, though drone may become a factor with the Borla system.

no can't tell any difference really. I had heard the same that the 1 3/4 5 into 1 header style was better suited for FI setups, but I figured heck it can't be worse than the stock headers.

Also what do you mean by non-merge style collector? I thought the B&B collectors were merge style. This particular set came off a Hennessey 500 car (they were installed by Hennessey back in 96- don't know if that helps or hurts

I do really hate that there is no decel popping, sounds silly but that was one of the things I really liked about my old car's setup. Of course the overall sound was much, much louder.

Have a lot going on this weekend (wife is 2 days past due date for 2nd child, inlaws in town etc), so haven't had time to video the exhaust. Kinda taken a backseat to the delivery deal I will do that tomorrow if she still hasn't gone in labor!

I guess I'm trying to figure out if I should just say to heck with the Borla, or just replace the cats with 3" of piping first? Probably try the straight pipes first I guess...

 

[jpa99acr]

Neither!! Replace the headers with stock manifolds from a '97 GTS!! Data has shown both power and noise levels increase substantially when using manifolds from a '97 GTS. I'll be happy to help you out on the swap, as I have a mint set on my '97 GTS. I'll do a straight up swap, but only because I know you. We have a deal?

I agree with Chip, cut those cats!

Hehe. Do I sound that dumb? JK. The headers I will keep I guess, although I may have a Borla catback for sale soon if the straight pipes don't make the V10 sound like it should

 

[cyaford]

Have a lot going on this weekend (wife is 2 days past due date for 2nd child, inlaws in town etc), so haven't had time to video the exhaust. Kinda taken a backseat to the delivery deal I will do that tomorrow if she still hasn't gone in labor!

I guess I'm trying to figure out if I should just say to heck with the Borla, or just replace the cats with 3" of piping first? Probably try the straight pipes first I guess...

Keep us posted. You do know that most hospitals have wi-fi now, right?

 

[LiquoRT/10]

I have RT cats (I think) and an X pipe muffler delete on my car and it has a deep roar sound. I have the decel popping. I think the easiest thing for you to try is delete the muffler and see how it sounds.

 

[uvbnbit]

If you're not going to be able to change anything before Tony's BBQ in a few weeks, we'll go for a ride and you can hear what mine sounds like from the interior. I've never smelled "rotten eggs" in mine, but you do occassionally get the exhaust smell from unburnt fuel. (hence, some "gurgling" and minor back-firing)
Chip

 

[JUCD VPR]

I have B&B headers, NO CATS, and B&B full exhaust back. It rumbles and lopes like crazy at idle, loud as heck at WOT, and pops on the decel all the time. Sounds like you like what I do.

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

Cut 'em off!.

Chip, as a fellow VCA President, I am concerned you would recommend one of your members break the law and remove his catalytic converters. Please reexamine your opinions before posting them in a public forum.

Signed,

Quietest and most legalist Viper in the southeast

 

[uvbnbit]

Chip, as a fellow VCA President, I am concerned you would recommend one of your members break the law and remove his catalytic converters. Please reexamine your opinions before posting them in a public forum.

Signed,

Quietest and most legalist Viper in the southeast

Thanks for catching that Chad! When I posted that, I got side-tracked and didn't get to finish. What I meant was, cut 'em off...and replace them with super-duper emission-efficient, noiseless, odorless catalytic converters (Just like yours)
Chip

 

[Matt]

Hehe. Do I sound that dumb? JK. The headers I will keep I guess, although I may have a Borla catback for sale soon if the straight pipes don't make the V10 sound like it should

Just pull the cats. I can guarantee if you have the early Borla cat-back without the rear mufflers it can give you the sound you are after. I ran Edelbrock headers, no cats, and a Borla on my RT/10 and it was perfect. Loud, raspy, and popped on decel. The popping is unburned fuel igniting in the exhaust. With cats, you're really not going to get that as their function is to catalize that unburn fuel.

I actually have a set of the B&B headers and another Borla cat-back waiting to go in my current GTS. Catless, of course.

 

[sirhc76]

anyone not running cats notice pitting on the rear panel clear coat? In reading posts from the previous owner of my car it appears this is how the marks on my car came about. Would hate to see someone unknowingly do this.

Chris

 

[VIPER GTSR 91]

Hi flo cats and NO mufflers. No UPS machines please!! Yes it pops on decel but your in a Viper and not a Lexus. No stereo either please. 2 cents and to each their own.

 

[1Need4Speed]

I have 4 inch side exhaust no mufflers and no cats...It makes pedestrians run for cover

Loud and proud

 

[dave6666]

Well, the snake is back out of the snake den as of last night. Post #4 lists what I did.

It is way louder than I initially thought it was playing with the throttle in the garage. And I even Dynamatted the entire passenger area. I can't imagine how loud it would be without cats.

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[uvbnbit]

That looks awesome! Any audio to go with it? BTW, do you use any special polish (not Lone Star long necks) for your wheels? they look awesome too!

-Chip

 

[jpa99acr]

anyone not running cats notice pitting on the rear panel clear coat? In reading posts from the previous owner of my car it appears this is how the marks on my car came about. Would hate to see someone unknowingly do this.

Chris

good question... anyone??

btw the car is looking nice Dave!

 

[GeneralLee]

I have B&B headers, NO CATS, and B&B full exhaust back. It rumbles and lopes like crazy at idle, loud as heck at WOT, and pops on the decel all the time. Sounds like you like what I do.

+1 on this setup....I love it.

Here is a vid of it on the road course in Memphis...

http://www.chicagolandsrtclub.com/generalleepics/viperroadcourse.wmv

And yes, it shoots flames.