Well I am not sure what everyone else considers stock but a Vec 1/2, exhaust and drag radials has the makings of modified to me. Plus, I would think a similar level of mods on a Viper would net consistent mid to low 11's. So, what is the point.
Viper VS. Z06 - VIDEO!!
- Thread starter John_C
- Start date
Well I am not sure what everyone else considers stock but a Vec 1/2, exhaust and drag radials has the makings of modified to me. Plus, I would think a similar level of mods on a Viper would net consistent mid to low 11's. So, what is the point.
12.3 in the first video in the original post
12.25 in the 2nd video - 90* weather
and i have another one, again the same car, running a 12.1x with the same mods [ tires, cai, exhaust]in the same car. want me to post it?
This is my friends car. He dynoed at 337 rwhp bone stock, and dynoed a lousy 345 rwhp with cai and exhaust. Bone stock, with street tires, he ran a 12.4.
Whats my point? The Z06, in bone stock form, runs low 12's with a good driver. With some mods, like a cai, exhaust, and dr's, it can dip in the 11's. Thats my point.
So all you guys that keep on saying that you have never seen Z06's run low 12's stock, thats because the drivers in your area dont know how to drive.
As a matter of fact, he just ran a 12.02 the other night but i didnt manage to get that on video. But believe me, i will post one next week when he goes to the track again and hopefully runs an 11 sec pass with ONLY 345 rwhp
Peace.
12.25 in the 2nd video - 90* weather
and i have another one, again the same car, running a 12.1x with the same mods [ tires, cai, exhaust]in the same car. want me to post it?
This is my friends car. He dynoed at 337 rwhp bone stock, and dynoed a lousy 345 rwhp with cai and exhaust. Bone stock, with street tires, he ran a 12.4.
Whats my point? The Z06, in bone stock form, runs low 12's with a good driver. With some mods, like a cai, exhaust, and dr's, it can dip in the 11's. Thats my point.
So all you guys that keep on saying that you have never seen Z06's run low 12's stock, thats because the drivers in your area dont know how to drive.
As a matter of fact, he just ran a 12.02 the other night but i didnt manage to get that on video. But believe me, i will post one next week when he goes to the track again and hopefully runs an 11 sec pass with ONLY 345 rwhp
Peace.
You keep confusing 2 things. Every reference is to stock and yet then you list the modifications. You cannot have both. Stock means stock. No mods. That means no lids, no non-production tires (especially slicks or drag radials), no headers, no cat-back exhaust, etc. How many dead stock Z06's get under 12.5? under 12.0?
Even though you may think a high percentage of owners modify their cars, realistically only a small percentage do. So when I meet one on the street the odds are very high that it is bone stock.
Now on the other hand the Gen II Viper averages around 12.0-12.4 dead stock. Note the Z06 equivalent Viper, the ACR, comes with the K&N filter stock. Gen II Vipers, in the stock condition have recorded best 1/4 mile times around 11.7. Again that is stock, unmodified.
Modified Vipers, of the level you have mentioned, achieve more in the 11.5 to 11.8 range with most experienced drivers. Still about a half second faster than similarly modified Z06's. SO the point is it doesn'y matter how many videos you have of a poor Viper driver (especially in an unmodified Gen I) versus a modified Z06 trying to tout that the driver is the main difference. The driver can be a huge limiting factor, but seldom can a driver make a car go faster than it is capable of (Fred Flintstone not included). Once you start comparing experienced drivers the driver difference is more in the .1 to .2 second range. With the nominal difference between the Z06 and the Gen II Viper being about .5 second I think you can see the driver difference woould not affect the outcome.
Even though you may think a high percentage of owners modify their cars, realistically only a small percentage do. So when I meet one on the street the odds are very high that it is bone stock.
Now on the other hand the Gen II Viper averages around 12.0-12.4 dead stock. Note the Z06 equivalent Viper, the ACR, comes with the K&N filter stock. Gen II Vipers, in the stock condition have recorded best 1/4 mile times around 11.7. Again that is stock, unmodified.
Modified Vipers, of the level you have mentioned, achieve more in the 11.5 to 11.8 range with most experienced drivers. Still about a half second faster than similarly modified Z06's. SO the point is it doesn'y matter how many videos you have of a poor Viper driver (especially in an unmodified Gen I) versus a modified Z06 trying to tout that the driver is the main difference. The driver can be a huge limiting factor, but seldom can a driver make a car go faster than it is capable of (Fred Flintstone not included). Once you start comparing experienced drivers the driver difference is more in the .1 to .2 second range. With the nominal difference between the Z06 and the Gen II Viper being about .5 second I think you can see the driver difference woould not affect the outcome.
Y2K5SRT
Enthusiast
Three notes:
1. Although it flashes by fairly quickly, I believe the Gen I in the video did a 13.5. I am not positive, but I think that is pretty slow for a Gen I - as in missed a gear or something. As I recall, the Gen I is good for mid-high twelves with an average driver. Made the Vette look even better!
2. I have had the opportunity to run a couple different local Z06's in the SRT - one a 2002 and the other a 2003. No contest at any speed - the SRT pulled by a large margin. They were both stock, as am I. We chatted afterwards and it was a good time had by all. Oh, and I personally LOVE the Z06 - especially in black.
3. And while I respect Jamie's experience to no end (now THAT guy knows how to drag race), I would also think that he may have been a little predisposed to sell the SRT without giving it a fair shake. I am not in the same league with him as far as driving skills, however I can say without a doubt that the SRT is faster than my previous modded GTS. Perhaps not the exotic looks, but that isn't the point of this discussion either. I have drag raced them both and the SRT wins hands down.
Chris
1. Although it flashes by fairly quickly, I believe the Gen I in the video did a 13.5. I am not positive, but I think that is pretty slow for a Gen I - as in missed a gear or something. As I recall, the Gen I is good for mid-high twelves with an average driver. Made the Vette look even better!
2. I have had the opportunity to run a couple different local Z06's in the SRT - one a 2002 and the other a 2003. No contest at any speed - the SRT pulled by a large margin. They were both stock, as am I. We chatted afterwards and it was a good time had by all. Oh, and I personally LOVE the Z06 - especially in black.
3. And while I respect Jamie's experience to no end (now THAT guy knows how to drag race), I would also think that he may have been a little predisposed to sell the SRT without giving it a fair shake. I am not in the same league with him as far as driving skills, however I can say without a doubt that the SRT is faster than my previous modded GTS. Perhaps not the exotic looks, but that isn't the point of this discussion either. I have drag raced them both and the SRT wins hands down.
Chris
Guys, i am not arguing with you that a Z06 is faster then a Gen II Viper. I know a Gen II Viper is faster, and i admit it. But what i am saying is that there are a few people on here that keep on saying that a Z06 is a high 12 to low 13 sec car? That is ludicrous to say. Thats like saying a 03 Srt-10 is a mid 12 sec car.
In BONE stock form, a Z06 is capable of hitting a 12.0..I have seen it done so many times. Like i said, in BONE stock form to the air filter and tires, my friend in his SLOW 01 [ 385 hp, 337 rwhp ] hit 12.4 at 113 mph with a 1.9x 60' time. And he isnt the greatest driver either. Then with only Dr's, cai, and exhaust, he hit a 12.0x at 114.42 mph.
In conclusion, I would like for all of you guys to know that i am not arguing the fact that the Z06 is faster stock vs stock, it isnt, but, it is VERY close in the 1/4 mile and it DOES run low 12's STOCK given the right driver. That is something you guys arent willing to accpet and i dont know why.
Peace.
In BONE stock form, a Z06 is capable of hitting a 12.0..I have seen it done so many times. Like i said, in BONE stock form to the air filter and tires, my friend in his SLOW 01 [ 385 hp, 337 rwhp ] hit 12.4 at 113 mph with a 1.9x 60' time. And he isnt the greatest driver either. Then with only Dr's, cai, and exhaust, he hit a 12.0x at 114.42 mph.
In conclusion, I would like for all of you guys to know that i am not arguing the fact that the Z06 is faster stock vs stock, it isnt, but, it is VERY close in the 1/4 mile and it DOES run low 12's STOCK given the right driver. That is something you guys arent willing to accpet and i dont know why.
Peace.
b3rndtt0ast
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john C, time slips, and proof of a stock vette running it.
-dan
-dan
I dont have any vidoes of any BONE stock vet running anything at all..i only have videos of an 01 Z06 making LESS power [ 345 rwhp] then a BONE STOCK 02 Z06 [350 rwhp] running 12.1x, 12.2x, and 12.30. in hot and humid weather.
I do, however, have the time slip of that same Z06 running a second best of a 12.04 at 116 mph [ mph is high at this track ] and here it is..i wish i would have gotten this run on tape.
http://hometown.aol.com/fnadar/myhomepage/profile.html
I am not going to argue with you guys anymore..i showed you all i can and if you dont believe what you see then that is your problem.
Bottom line is: Z06's run low 12's stock all day with a good driver, and can dip in the 11's just dr's and an intake. Go to Z06vette.com and see what some guys are running with just tires and a cai.
Peace
I do, however, have the time slip of that same Z06 running a second best of a 12.04 at 116 mph [ mph is high at this track ] and here it is..i wish i would have gotten this run on tape.
http://hometown.aol.com/fnadar/myhomepage/profile.html
I am not going to argue with you guys anymore..i showed you all i can and if you dont believe what you see then that is your problem.
Bottom line is: Z06's run low 12's stock all day with a good driver, and can dip in the 11's just dr's and an intake. Go to Z06vette.com and see what some guys are running with just tires and a cai.
Peace
I'll change the perspective for the moment. Why is it so imprortant to convince us that a Z06 is only a tick slower than a GenII?
The numbers you keep stating would beat most Gen II's on most days and drivers. I think if you did a survey of Vipers you would find most in stock form are around 12.2. That is the same as you state a stock z06 runs. But with lower mph. We know with optimum conditions and an expert driver that 11.7 has been done. But I do not think the majority of owners could come close to that.
So the point I keep hearing over and over is that a stock z06 is the SAME as a Viper. You came to the wrong place to make a convincing argument about that. With several Viper owners owning both, and publicly stating their Viper is indeed quicker than the z06, and more on the order of a half second quicker to boot, would you think that we would be convinced differently?
I have not run a Z06 directly at the strip. Reason why is I only go when it is a Viper event and NHRA rules are not applied. On the street I have only gone at it from a roll and I can state clearly that both my 95 RT/10 and 2003 SRT walk away from the Z06. Mind you the 95 is about 420 RWHP and the SRT 440 (dead stock - so far). So to quote a song "I am (not) a believer."
The numbers you keep stating would beat most Gen II's on most days and drivers. I think if you did a survey of Vipers you would find most in stock form are around 12.2. That is the same as you state a stock z06 runs. But with lower mph. We know with optimum conditions and an expert driver that 11.7 has been done. But I do not think the majority of owners could come close to that.
So the point I keep hearing over and over is that a stock z06 is the SAME as a Viper. You came to the wrong place to make a convincing argument about that. With several Viper owners owning both, and publicly stating their Viper is indeed quicker than the z06, and more on the order of a half second quicker to boot, would you think that we would be convinced differently?
I have not run a Z06 directly at the strip. Reason why is I only go when it is a Viper event and NHRA rules are not applied. On the street I have only gone at it from a roll and I can state clearly that both my 95 RT/10 and 2003 SRT walk away from the Z06. Mind you the 95 is about 420 RWHP and the SRT 440 (dead stock - so far). So to quote a song "I am (not) a believer."
Ok, you can believe whatever you would like. I think the main concern here is that i dont think you, in person, have seen a stock Z06 driven by a good driver.
Believe me man, i love Vipers, i think they are one mean mofos, and i respect them a lot. But unlike some people, i give credit where credit is due. And people telling me that a Gen II Viper is THAT much faster then a Z06 have to wake up, because they are VERY close, specially in the 1/4, and not necessarily from a roll. i am sure from a roll the Gen II will pull a good amount from the Z. but in the 1/4 mile, it is close [ but the gen II is faster - like i have been saying all along]
if you dont want to believe it, thats fine..you dont have to.
b3rndtt0ast
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why would you compare a pre 96 car with a 99 and up car? that doesnt work in my head....
-dan
-dan
Russ M
Enthusiast
John C,
So as stated earlier you are here just to troll up some support for your ZO6 is faster than a Viper argument.
Knowing that this is the case what do you consider an EDGE in term of 1/4 mile? A gen 2 Viper seems to be about 1/2 second faster than the fastest stock ZO6. So knowing that 1/2 second is only an EDGE according to you we can come to the following conclusions.
A ZO6 has a slight EDGE on these cars or much less on some
Cobra mustang
Normal Corvette
Acura NSX
Toyota Supra turbo
Evo 8
WRX STI
996 non turbo
Corvete ZR1
Skyline GTR
Camaro SS
Firebird ram air
On the other hand cars that have a slight EDGE on a Viper.
Mclaren f1
Ferrari Enzo
I am sure there are a few others but according to your argument the Viper can claim to be just an EDGE away from being the fastest production car ever built.
So at what point does the 1/2 second EDGE become loss?
Lets see 1/2 second @ 120mph translates into about 83 feet @ the 1/4 mile, which means about 6 car lengths.
Common wake up a Z06 is fast, fast enough to talk the talk, but NOT fast enough to walk the walk.
So as stated earlier you are here just to troll up some support for your ZO6 is faster than a Viper argument.
Knowing that this is the case what do you consider an EDGE in term of 1/4 mile? A gen 2 Viper seems to be about 1/2 second faster than the fastest stock ZO6. So knowing that 1/2 second is only an EDGE according to you we can come to the following conclusions.
A ZO6 has a slight EDGE on these cars or much less on some
Cobra mustang
Normal Corvette
Acura NSX
Toyota Supra turbo
Evo 8
WRX STI
996 non turbo
Corvete ZR1
Skyline GTR
Camaro SS
Firebird ram air
On the other hand cars that have a slight EDGE on a Viper.
Mclaren f1
Ferrari Enzo
I am sure there are a few others but according to your argument the Viper can claim to be just an EDGE away from being the fastest production car ever built.
So at what point does the 1/2 second EDGE become loss?
Lets see 1/2 second @ 120mph translates into about 83 feet @ the 1/4 mile, which means about 6 car lengths.
Common wake up a Z06 is fast, fast enough to talk the talk, but NOT fast enough to walk the walk.
SnakeBitten
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What kills me about discussions like this is that the powershifting Z06 guys always run against guys that dont or cant powershift there Vipers. ..They are squeezing every last ounce out of the Z06 to BARELY beat,tie or lose to the conventional shifting Viper guy and then they say they are the same speed or faster....They say the gap is non existant......
I guess a Viper cant be powershifted in there minds...It can only be shifted conventionally therefore there is not much of a gap....They dont believe in mag numbers as it pertains to the Z06 consistant 12.4-12.8 showing but they believe the mag claims of the Viper being only 12.2-12.5...Eventhough only the Viper has numerous documented 11 second passes BONESTOCK in the truest sence of the word..
It takes a powershifter in a Z06 to get average skill GenII numbers..I love Vettes especially Z06's but its the Vette guys that gotta take there head out of the sand....Why dont one of you Vette powershifters go powershift a GTS/RT110 Gen II and come back and tell us that the Z06 is only .1-.2 behind...Driver is definately the key with cars makin this kind of power but with equal drivers its an easy win for the Viper everytime.....And thats fact not keyboard racing etc....BTW I recently purchased a C5 so Im not biased...
I guess a Viper cant be powershifted in there minds...It can only be shifted conventionally therefore there is not much of a gap....They dont believe in mag numbers as it pertains to the Z06 consistant 12.4-12.8 showing but they believe the mag claims of the Viper being only 12.2-12.5...Eventhough only the Viper has numerous documented 11 second passes BONESTOCK in the truest sence of the word..
It takes a powershifter in a Z06 to get average skill GenII numbers..I love Vettes especially Z06's but its the Vette guys that gotta take there head out of the sand....Why dont one of you Vette powershifters go powershift a GTS/RT110 Gen II and come back and tell us that the Z06 is only .1-.2 behind...Driver is definately the key with cars makin this kind of power but with equal drivers its an easy win for the Viper everytime.....And thats fact not keyboard racing etc....BTW I recently purchased a C5 so Im not biased...
NosLaser
Enthusiast
I never implied you were lying, perhaps mildly ********, most likely a geaser, but never a liar...Just when it was getting good, a submission...Your smack is as weak as your vette is slow...But thanks for stopping by!
It's always warming to see someone get owned on their own forum by a new guest. Z06Les's reply was eloquent, to the point, and non-attacking whereas your reply reminded me of a 16 year old kid trying to make up for his own inadequacies. Perhaps you get overly defensive when your maturity level is in question?
Regards,
Snakester
Enthusiast
John, you sound like an entirely reasonable guy, and I'll admit that a better driver in an '02 or newer Z06 "can" be quicker than a Viper. But similarly, a SVT Cobra with DRs "can" beat a Z06, if he is a better driver, even with mild mods.
My only face-off with a Z06 on the track with my Viper (not stock)was a couple weeks ago. The track was lousy and it was my 4th run ever with the Viper, and he ran 13.1@109 to my 12.4@119.
And before you jump on the numbers, I also ran a LS1 Firebird with H/C and supercharger who also a 13.1@113MPH.
I did have a intake, cam, DR, C5 coupe get a 12.49@114, to my 12.47@119 before the night was over, and he actually beat me, cutting a better light.
The difference is that people tend to compare numbers with different drivers (powershifting, etc), different tracks (with varying prep), and some folks have a differnt consideration of stock (intake, drag radials, exhaust).
The Z06 is definitely a worthy performance car, and a relative bargain. I'd say that it's going to be quicker than a stock GenI Viper, but not as quick as a Gen II, even with average drivers. But most people don't stay bone stock in either car, so you never know either way (with a SVT Cobra either).
-Dean.
My only face-off with a Z06 on the track with my Viper (not stock)was a couple weeks ago. The track was lousy and it was my 4th run ever with the Viper, and he ran 13.1@109 to my 12.4@119.
And before you jump on the numbers, I also ran a LS1 Firebird with H/C and supercharger who also a 13.1@113MPH.
I did have a intake, cam, DR, C5 coupe get a 12.49@114, to my 12.47@119 before the night was over, and he actually beat me, cutting a better light.
The difference is that people tend to compare numbers with different drivers (powershifting, etc), different tracks (with varying prep), and some folks have a differnt consideration of stock (intake, drag radials, exhaust).
The Z06 is definitely a worthy performance car, and a relative bargain. I'd say that it's going to be quicker than a stock GenI Viper, but not as quick as a Gen II, even with average drivers. But most people don't stay bone stock in either car, so you never know either way (with a SVT Cobra either).
-Dean.
Hi Dean,
You seem very reasonable with your post, and I don't see a lot to disagree with. Many here have agreed that a bone stock GenII, depending on track prep, density altitude, and driver skill runs 12.2 - 12.6, with exceptions on both sides of that number. Bone stock Z06's run 12.4 - 12.8, and a very few EXCEPTIONAL racers (yes powershifting) have managed high 11's, but you can count the 11's on a few fingers of one hand. I have never seen an average driver on an average track on a hot day ever do worse than a 12.8, so with due respect the guy who ran a 13.1 wasn't average.
I have said, still say, and will continue to say that stock for stock the edge goes to the Viper GenII, and yes I call a .2 difference an edge, not walking it like a Civic as one here has said. I also believe that there is usually more than a .2 variance between driver skill so that is why a slightly more experienced Z06 drag racer can beat a slightly less experienced Viper, I have - many times, as I said in my earlier post (not bragging, just fact. Just like I said that I have never beaten a Viper at an Auto-X or Road Race event yet, but I am improving). I honestly believe the Viper is harder to drive fast at a drag strip, having driven one at the request of an owner to see if I could squeeze a better E/T out of his car.
Stay safe guys, and I hope to see more of you at a track soon
Les
PS: Aslan, thanks for the kind words, but not necessary. People who use childish personal insults don't impress me, and I suspect most others here either.
You seem very reasonable with your post, and I don't see a lot to disagree with. Many here have agreed that a bone stock GenII, depending on track prep, density altitude, and driver skill runs 12.2 - 12.6, with exceptions on both sides of that number. Bone stock Z06's run 12.4 - 12.8, and a very few EXCEPTIONAL racers (yes powershifting) have managed high 11's, but you can count the 11's on a few fingers of one hand. I have never seen an average driver on an average track on a hot day ever do worse than a 12.8, so with due respect the guy who ran a 13.1 wasn't average.
I have said, still say, and will continue to say that stock for stock the edge goes to the Viper GenII, and yes I call a .2 difference an edge, not walking it like a Civic as one here has said. I also believe that there is usually more than a .2 variance between driver skill so that is why a slightly more experienced Z06 drag racer can beat a slightly less experienced Viper, I have - many times, as I said in my earlier post (not bragging, just fact. Just like I said that I have never beaten a Viper at an Auto-X or Road Race event yet, but I am improving). I honestly believe the Viper is harder to drive fast at a drag strip, having driven one at the request of an owner to see if I could squeeze a better E/T out of his car.
Stay safe guys, and I hope to see more of you at a track soon
Les
PS: Aslan, thanks for the kind words, but not necessary. People who use childish personal insults don't impress me, and I suspect most others here either.
Russ M
Enthusiast
Les,
I totally agree with you on the driver part of the equation, no doubt a poor Viper driver will get spanked by even a normal c5 vette.
But 2 tenths of a second is not even close to reality.
I am tired of this pointless Internet debate, at no time has a zo6 even managed to keep up with my car past 1st gear. And I am sure at least some of the drivers had enough skill to make use of the car.
Next time you are in LA look me up I would be more than willing to do some testing to show you what an average driver can do in a viper. And yes I do consider my self average with 6 speed non sequential gear boxes, I have forgotten how to use them properly .
I totally agree with you on the driver part of the equation, no doubt a poor Viper driver will get spanked by even a normal c5 vette.
But 2 tenths of a second is not even close to reality.
I am tired of this pointless Internet debate, at no time has a zo6 even managed to keep up with my car past 1st gear. And I am sure at least some of the drivers had enough skill to make use of the car.
Next time you are in LA look me up I would be more than willing to do some testing to show you what an average driver can do in a viper. And yes I do consider my self average with 6 speed non sequential gear boxes, I have forgotten how to use them properly
.Russ,
Where do you race in Cal? Are you bone stock including tires? Let me know what mods, if any, you are running and tires. I haven't seen you post any times, but that may be I am not looking hard enough. I'll poke some of my Z06 brothers and see if we can come up with someone, with comparable mods, who can show you what a Z06 can do. Obviously being a coast apart we'll never see each other. You don't say if you disagree with the times that I KNOW Z06's are running or what I have SEEN Vipers run at tracks here, which car is it that you feel .2 is not representative? I assume you also don't believe my 12.0@120 MPH on stock tires with headers and CAI either. I assume you also don't believe I will take ANY bone stock 2002 or 03 Z06 and run 12.3 - 12.4 all day long. I am slightly above average, but I have guys here in 01's running 12.5 - 12.6 all day long their first time at the track (well, by the end of the day anyway), but you probably don't believe that either.
The gear box in the Viper I drove (GenI)was definitely not something I would attempt a powershift with, but I still could row it pretty fast and managed a 12.5 in a bone stock GenI on stock tires. That GenI was running within a .1 - .3 of the GenII's that day, but you probably don't believe that either.
So, let me know what track is near you and what city it is in, and I'll see if I can't find you some competition. Unfortunately most Z06 owners don't track their cars - what a waste IMO.
Les
Where do you race in Cal? Are you bone stock including tires? Let me know what mods, if any, you are running and tires. I haven't seen you post any times, but that may be I am not looking hard enough. I'll poke some of my Z06 brothers and see if we can come up with someone, with comparable mods, who can show you what a Z06 can do. Obviously being a coast apart we'll never see each other. You don't say if you disagree with the times that I KNOW Z06's are running or what I have SEEN Vipers run at tracks here, which car is it that you feel .2 is not representative? I assume you also don't believe my 12.0@120 MPH on stock tires with headers and CAI either. I assume you also don't believe I will take ANY bone stock 2002 or 03 Z06 and run 12.3 - 12.4 all day long. I am slightly above average, but I have guys here in 01's running 12.5 - 12.6 all day long their first time at the track (well, by the end of the day anyway), but you probably don't believe that either.
The gear box in the Viper I drove (GenI)was definitely not something I would attempt a powershift with, but I still could row it pretty fast and managed a 12.5 in a bone stock GenI on stock tires. That GenI was running within a .1 - .3 of the GenII's that day, but you probably don't believe that either.
So, let me know what track is near you and what city it is in, and I'll see if I can't find you some competition. Unfortunately most Z06 owners don't track their cars - what a waste IMO.
Les
Russ M
Enthusiast
ZO6Less,
You can ask any of the So Cal Zo6 peeps to look me up. My car is your basic rt/10 with an exhaust.
What kind of tires were you on during the 12.0 run? CAI? Cold air intake? Headers/exhaust?
A Zo6 will NOT run 12.3-12.4 all day long stock, no way no how.
2001 Zo6's only make 5-10hp less at the wheels so dont expect them to be 2 tenths slower than an 02.
A gen 1 Viper can run low 12s stock, and yes its faster than any stock zo6 also, just do the math. They have better hp/weight even being heavier than the vette. Stock Gen1 vipers are very under rated they pull 380-390hp at the wheels and 470 torque at the wheels.
PS. Loose the attitude you are the one making the ridiculous claims on the VIPER forum. The burden of proof is on your head not ours,
PSS. What is it with you Vette guys, you all have Viper on the brain. Are Vipers all you think about when you are driving your zo6? If so perhaps its time to just put one in your garage and stop with the drooling. I never see viper guys trolling up posts on the vette forums. But you guys cant even get enough Viper vs. Zo6 posts over there you come over here and start them. What gives?
You can ask any of the So Cal Zo6 peeps to look me up. My car is your basic rt/10 with an exhaust.
What kind of tires were you on during the 12.0 run? CAI? Cold air intake? Headers/exhaust?
A Zo6 will NOT run 12.3-12.4 all day long stock, no way no how.
2001 Zo6's only make 5-10hp less at the wheels so dont expect them to be 2 tenths slower than an 02.
A gen 1 Viper can run low 12s stock, and yes its faster than any stock zo6 also, just do the math. They have better hp/weight even being heavier than the vette. Stock Gen1 vipers are very under rated they pull 380-390hp at the wheels and 470 torque at the wheels.
PS. Loose the attitude you are the one making the ridiculous claims on the VIPER forum. The burden of proof is on your head not ours,
PSS. What is it with you Vette guys, you all have Viper on the brain. Are Vipers all you think about when you are driving your zo6? If so perhaps its time to just put one in your garage and stop with the drooling. I never see viper guys trolling up posts on the vette forums. But you guys cant even get enough Viper vs. Zo6 posts over there you come over here and start them. What gives?
Personal experience ahead. Everytime I have been to the strip the z06's were lucky to turn 12.7 - 12.9. Could have been the driver don't know. My car is not lightning fast, but I have not been beat by a z06 to date. I am not saying there are not some quick ones out there, but stock v. stock it is no contest if you have equal drivers. As Russ stated there is no substitute for torque and that is what gets a car down the track.
John
John
Russ,
I came in to have an intelligent discussion with fellow car guys about the Z06 since most of you (yourself included) are as ignorant about Z06's as we are about Vipers. You learn when you keep your mouth (and keyboard) quiet and listen.
My mods were CAI (cold air - Vararam) and headers (stock exhaust), bone stock (and worn)tires, when I ran not one but two 12.0's at 120 MPH that day, and it was hot and humid. Two weeks on a higher elevation track I ran a [email protected], so the car is very consistent.
I stand by my statements about what 01 and 02 Z06's run here, I don't need a lesson from you any more from you on a Z than you need one from me on a Viper.
I will post this thread to some of the socal Z06 guys, I hope they will hook up with you and see what you've got, I see you still don't post YOUR times for all to see BTW there are a number of Viper guys who post in the Z06 section, we treat them with respect as they do us. Only a troll makes personal attacks and calls names, regardless of what type of car they drive. An attitude check is needed, I will leave it to others to decide who has been civil here.
Les
PS: It is Les, not Less, but you knew that didn't you
PPS: I save my attitude for people I care about, you are not one - good-bye
I came in to have an intelligent discussion with fellow car guys about the Z06 since most of you (yourself included) are as ignorant about Z06's as we are about Vipers. You learn when you keep your mouth (and keyboard) quiet and listen.
My mods were CAI (cold air - Vararam) and headers (stock exhaust), bone stock (and worn)tires, when I ran not one but two 12.0's at 120 MPH that day, and it was hot and humid. Two weeks on a higher elevation track I ran a [email protected], so the car is very consistent.
I stand by my statements about what 01 and 02 Z06's run here, I don't need a lesson from you any more from you on a Z than you need one from me on a Viper.
I will post this thread to some of the socal Z06 guys, I hope they will hook up with you and see what you've got, I see you still don't post YOUR times for all to see
BTW there are a number of Viper guys who post in the Z06 section, we treat them with respect as they do us. Only a troll makes personal attacks and calls names, regardless of what type of car they drive. An attitude check is needed, I will leave it to others to decide who has been civil here.Les
PS: It is Les, not Less, but you knew that didn't you
PPS: I save my attitude for people I care about, you are not one - good-bye
I just think it is so funny when people say stock Z06 run 12.7's..haha
I saw a guy in an 01 Z06, his first time ever to the track, his first pass ever at a track, his car is bone stock to the filter and tires and ran a 12.7. Of course, as the day went on and he got a feeling for the track, he was running 12.5's at a 600' elevation. Then another guy, aka as "holedgr" on the Z06 forums, ran a 12.3 in a BONE STOCK [tires, filter] in his 02 Z06 at the same track - 600' elevation.
Ahh well, i guess i am wasting my time here because you guys are so uneducated about the Z06's.
As I leave, i just want to make 2 quick points.
1. Dont talk smack when you have no idea what you are saying/typing. instead, find some1 that can drive the car properly then come back and tell us what you think.
2. The Gen II+ is quicker, but, a bad lauunch on the Vipers part and a good launch for the Z06 and it is all over for the Viper.
Peace
I saw a guy in an 01 Z06, his first time ever to the track, his first pass ever at a track, his car is bone stock to the filter and tires and ran a 12.7. Of course, as the day went on and he got a feeling for the track, he was running 12.5's at a 600' elevation. Then another guy, aka as "holedgr" on the Z06 forums, ran a 12.3 in a BONE STOCK [tires, filter] in his 02 Z06 at the same track - 600' elevation.
Ahh well, i guess i am wasting my time here because you guys are so uneducated about the Z06's.
As I leave, i just want to make 2 quick points.
1. Dont talk smack when you have no idea what you are saying/typing. instead, find some1 that can drive the car properly then come back and tell us what you think.
2. The Gen II+ is quicker, but, a bad lauunch on the Vipers part and a good launch for the Z06 and it is all over for the Viper.
Peace
JohnC: First, Don't lump all Viper guys in with Russ, most aren't like him. Some Vette owners are socially ******** as well, we don't like to be compared to them either
Russ: I have someone with a Z06 in so cal who will meet you at Carlisbad Raceway any time. He has a few minor bolt-on's, no engine work at all, no more mods than you have on the Viper. His name is Pat, and he has accepted the challemge to school you on what a Z06 can do. After he is finished his wife says she can beat your big bad Viper as well, so you have (so far) two who have accepted the challenge. There may be more, Sunday is a slow day on the forums.
As soon as I have Pat's permission to post his email address I will post it here and leave the thread as promised. Pat will post the results, assuming you have the stones to show up.
Les
Russ: I have someone with a Z06 in so cal who will meet you at Carlisbad Raceway any time. He has a few minor bolt-on's, no engine work at all, no more mods than you have on the Viper. His name is Pat, and he has accepted the challemge to school you on what a Z06 can do. After he is finished his wife says she can beat your big bad Viper as well, so you have (so far) two who have accepted the challenge. There may be more, Sunday is a slow day on the forums.
As soon as I have Pat's permission to post his email address I will post it here and leave the thread as promised. Pat will post the results, assuming you have the stones to show up.
Les
Russ,
Here is the post from Pat (and his wife). He accepts the challenge and has listed his mods. His email is included, you two agree a time and place and Pat will video the event for ALL to see. More may accept the challenge, so I will have Pat let the Vette forums know so that we can have more "samples".
From Pat:
My email is [email protected]
"My mod list:
Aftermarket muffler, stock cats and manifold in place. 6hp increase.
Top of aircleaner removed
Tuned for running in summer heat
DOT-legal street tires.
Red Fuzzy Dice on mirror - 100hp increase using G-Tech.
Carlsbad is good, will video tape it, win or lose."
Pat
So there it is Russ, you have been talking a lot about how fast you are and how slow we are. Time to walk the walk. Play safe, but make sure you are on your "A" game, even racing a lowly near stock Z
Les
Here is the post from Pat (and his wife). He accepts the challenge and has listed his mods. His email is included, you two agree a time and place and Pat will video the event for ALL to see. More may accept the challenge, so I will have Pat let the Vette forums know so that we can have more "samples".
From Pat:
My email is [email protected]
"My mod list:
Aftermarket muffler, stock cats and manifold in place. 6hp increase.
Top of aircleaner removed
Tuned for running in summer heat
DOT-legal street tires.
Red Fuzzy Dice on mirror - 100hp increase using G-Tech.
Carlsbad is good, will video tape it, win or lose."
Pat
So there it is Russ, you have been talking a lot about how fast you are and how slow we are. Time to walk the walk. Play safe, but make sure you are on your "A" game, even racing a lowly near stock Z
Les
Gerald
Enthusiast
120 mph in an almost stock z06 with 360 or so RWHP??? huh?
SnakeBitten
Enthusiast
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I guess its a foregone conclusion for you that the Viper will lose? The race is only gonna show whos the better driver of there car....We already know which car is faster......
Greetings,
I was debating whether I should post in here, as it might seem to some as trolling. But since there is an open challenge posted, I decided to introduce myself.
I'm Pat. I'd love to race you, and my wife would like to give it a shot also. I'm not a professional, just an enthusiast. I'm good, not great. I do not powershift, as it's my daily driver. The car has 12,000mi on it, and pretty close to stock. No bottle, no headers, no internals, no weight reduction, no gears. Plus I weigh 275lbs, and barely fit in the car.
Any car that can run over 100 mph in the quarter is VERY driver dependent. Yes, the Viper has a better power to weight, but the Z06 has certain advantages as well:
It's lighter
It plants well
1st, 2nd, and 3rd gears are lower than the T-56 in the Viper.
It's more aerodynamic.
I've never lost to a Viper yet (4-0), so here's your opportunity revenge my indiscretions against the Dodge Banner.
Yours Truly,
Pat "McRat" McSwain
2002 Z-06 "Blue Meanie"
I was debating whether I should post in here, as it might seem to some as trolling. But since there is an open challenge posted, I decided to introduce myself.
I'm Pat. I'd love to race you, and my wife would like to give it a shot also. I'm not a professional, just an enthusiast. I'm good, not great. I do not powershift, as it's my daily driver. The car has 12,000mi on it, and pretty close to stock. No bottle, no headers, no internals, no weight reduction, no gears. Plus I weigh 275lbs, and barely fit in the car.
Any car that can run over 100 mph in the quarter is VERY driver dependent. Yes, the Viper has a better power to weight, but the Z06 has certain advantages as well:
It's lighter
It plants well
1st, 2nd, and 3rd gears are lower than the T-56 in the Viper.
It's more aerodynamic.
I've never lost to a Viper yet (4-0), so here's your opportunity revenge my indiscretions against the Dodge Banner.
Yours Truly,
Pat "McRat" McSwain
2002 Z-06 "Blue Meanie"
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