06' Coupe... on air bags
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Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
V10SpeedLuvr
Enthusiast
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
I think shops who do installations like this should be fined and the owner should be jailed
I think shops who do installations like this should be fined and the owner should be jailed
ILLSMOQ
Enthusiast
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
I doesn't even look cool with the wheels shoved up in the wheel well like that.
There have been a few times that I wished I could push a button to raise the car up a couple inches to get up a drive way or over a monster speed bump. Don't Porsches have something like that?
I doesn't even look cool with the wheels shoved up in the wheel well like that.
There have been a few times that I wished I could push a button to raise the car up a couple inches to get up a drive way or over a monster speed bump. Don't Porsches have something like that?
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
No clue about porsche, but some ferrari's and lambos do. It's definitely not some hokey airbag chit though, usually a hydraulic acuator that doesn't have any adverse effect on the suspension.
No clue about porsche, but some ferrari's and lambos do. It's definitely not some hokey airbag chit though, usually a hydraulic acuator that doesn't have any adverse effect on the suspension.
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Hmm time to get bashed....I think its pretty cool if he wouldn't slam it all the way to the ground...going over speed bumps etc. wouldn't be a problem hit the switch it goes up go over the speed bump and you have it right on the ground again once your over
Hmm time to get bashed....I think its pretty cool if he wouldn't slam it all the way to the ground...going over speed bumps etc. wouldn't be a problem hit the switch it goes up go over the speed bump and you have it right on the ground again once your over
VIPER D
Viper Owner
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
makes my slammed moton car look like a 4x4.
vd..
makes my slammed moton car look like a 4x4.
vd..
Vic
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Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Silly, thats so the biatches can get in easier, after witnessing the awesome jumping display!
For the love of god WHY
Silly, thats so the biatches can get in easier, after witnessing the awesome jumping display!
SSSSE YA
Enthusiast
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Mike Dolan
Viper Owner
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Forgive my ignorance - but.....
I think the car sitting on the ground is silly, of course, but am not aware why an air suspension is inherently bad. It would seem that the ride height could be easily adjusted, and by varying the accumulator size, the rate of progression could be adjusted as well. Certainly if you were travelling through outer-earmuff at night a break in the system would be awkward to get parts for, but assuming the owner doesn't go far from home, or the system is not unreliable it would probably be OK.
Am I missing something?
Forgive my ignorance - but.....
I think the car sitting on the ground is silly, of course, but am not aware why an air suspension is inherently bad. It would seem that the ride height could be easily adjusted, and by varying the accumulator size, the rate of progression could be adjusted as well. Certainly if you were travelling through outer-earmuff at night a break in the system would be awkward to get parts for, but assuming the owner doesn't go far from home, or the system is not unreliable it would probably be OK.
Am I missing something?
Vic
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Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
hah hah, just kidding, Mike! An air suspension is not inherrently badder (?!) than say a set of well-seasoned Penskes. Just more complicated, no? And I'm not sure about the spring rate, like, is it progressively stiffer under compression, and can that be valved differently, or what? Does it have an adjustable rebound? Maybe it gives a Corvette-smooth ride!
Oh, great, thanks for putting the brakes on our "bash-fest"!
hah hah, just kidding, Mike! An air suspension is not inherrently badder (?!) than say a set of well-seasoned Penskes. Just more complicated, no? And I'm not sure about the spring rate, like, is it progressively stiffer under compression, and can that be valved differently, or what? Does it have an adjustable rebound? Maybe it gives a Corvette-smooth ride!
twinturbo3150
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Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
the enzo and S7 have something similiar but not that cheazy!!!!!
the enzo and S7 have something similiar but not that cheazy!!!!!
Mike Dolan
Viper Owner
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Vic, I have no direct experience with air suspensions, but to answer your questions generically, air suspension is progressive, and the amount of progression is directly related to the accumulator size. For example, if the accumulator was quite small, the rate of progression would be quite high. By applying Boyles law, you will see that if you compress the volume to one half it's original size, the pressure will double, 1/10 the volume = 10 X the pressure. If the accumulator is large fully compressing the strut won't cause as much pressure increase as if it was small. Imagine a pressure tank, partially filled with air & partially with liquid. If you increase the fluid volume the amount left for air is decreased, thus varying the rate of progression, whereas varying the starting air pressure would set the initial spring rate. By this way a suspension system would by highly tuneable.
As far as the complexity - yes of course it's much more complex than simple springs and therefore susectible to failure. This becomes more pronounced when considering the limited amount of engineering and testing resources that could be applied to a one-off design such as the one depicted above.
Regards,
Mike Dolan
Vic, I have no direct experience with air suspensions, but to answer your questions generically, air suspension is progressive, and the amount of progression is directly related to the accumulator size. For example, if the accumulator was quite small, the rate of progression would be quite high. By applying Boyles law, you will see that if you compress the volume to one half it's original size, the pressure will double, 1/10 the volume = 10 X the pressure. If the accumulator is large fully compressing the strut won't cause as much pressure increase as if it was small. Imagine a pressure tank, partially filled with air & partially with liquid. If you increase the fluid volume the amount left for air is decreased, thus varying the rate of progression, whereas varying the starting air pressure would set the initial spring rate. By this way a suspension system would by highly tuneable.
As far as the complexity - yes of course it's much more complex than simple springs and therefore susectible to failure. This becomes more pronounced when considering the limited amount of engineering and testing resources that could be applied to a one-off design such as the one depicted above.
Regards,
Mike Dolan
LETHAL GTS
Viper Owner
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
My ol man's Merc SL55 AMG has air ride from factory. Kinda nice to be able to switch from performance to cushy with the flick of a switch.
But not for my Viper!!
My ol man's Merc SL55 AMG has air ride from factory. Kinda nice to be able to switch from performance to cushy with the flick of a switch.
But not for my Viper!!
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
ok guys.... We had one of your fellow Viper enthusiasts call with questions about this stuff. (Those images were originally posted over on protour.com) and told me that these were posted over here and there was alot of questions and speculation. I am not here to sound like a 2 bit sales guy... I cant stand that kind of junk.... so if you have any questions direclty related to pricing availablity or anything along those lines try to contact me via e-mail or call. I just want to shed a little light on what you guys are looking at....and everyone is definitely entitled to your own opinions and like beer...you either love it or hate it.
I believe one of the first questions was along the lines of why did the guy do that? It was brought to us to put an air suspension on it because this was not his first Rodeo with a Viper and he wanted to drive it without the impact harshness and they wanted to get a better ride quality without the impact harshness of the original suspension. He also wanted the ability to raise the car to clearance speed bumps, driveways, ... ect. When we engineered the kit for this car we intended it to be a one off because we honestly did not think the interest was going to be there so we did not get any back-to-back track comparison data. I personally did not drive the car before or after we completed the install but the few here that did as well as the owner were very pleased with the performance it maintained and more than pleased with the overall ride quality and adjustability.
As far as the "cheezy" comment... I dont think it is really all that "cheezy". We used our double adjustable Shockwaves on that car which are a modular unit and employ the use of a 16 position double adjustable hydraulic Alston Varishock (double adjustable meaning that we can change the shock resistance rate on both bound and rebound)that are running through the center of Firestone airpsrings. The compressor system that we used is state of the art RideProe2 electronics which not only monitor pressure with voltage based sending units but it also uses rotary holofect sensors which adjust suspension height.
ok guys.... We had one of your fellow Viper enthusiasts call with questions about this stuff. (Those images were originally posted over on protour.com) and told me that these were posted over here and there was alot of questions and speculation. I am not here to sound like a 2 bit sales guy... I cant stand that kind of junk.... so if you have any questions direclty related to pricing availablity or anything along those lines try to contact me via e-mail or call. I just want to shed a little light on what you guys are looking at....and everyone is definitely entitled to your own opinions and like beer...you either love it or hate it.
I believe one of the first questions was along the lines of why did the guy do that? It was brought to us to put an air suspension on it because this was not his first Rodeo with a Viper and he wanted to drive it without the impact harshness and they wanted to get a better ride quality without the impact harshness of the original suspension. He also wanted the ability to raise the car to clearance speed bumps, driveways, ... ect. When we engineered the kit for this car we intended it to be a one off because we honestly did not think the interest was going to be there so we did not get any back-to-back track comparison data. I personally did not drive the car before or after we completed the install but the few here that did as well as the owner were very pleased with the performance it maintained and more than pleased with the overall ride quality and adjustability.
As far as the "cheezy" comment... I dont think it is really all that "cheezy". We used our double adjustable Shockwaves on that car which are a modular unit and employ the use of a 16 position double adjustable hydraulic Alston Varishock (double adjustable meaning that we can change the shock resistance rate on both bound and rebound)that are running through the center of Firestone airpsrings. The compressor system that we used is state of the art RideProe2 electronics which not only monitor pressure with voltage based sending units but it also uses rotary holofect sensors which adjust suspension height.
Newport Viper
Enthusiast
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Ban him.
Ban him.
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
61FlatTop said: "When we engineered the kit for this car we intended it to be a one off because we honestly did not think the interest was going to be there so we did not get any back-to-back track comparison data. I personally did not drive the car before or after we completed the install but the few here that did as well as the owner were very pleased with the performance it maintained and more than pleased with the overall ride quality and adjustability."
Very interesting. Please correct me if I am wrong but it appears that you put a "one off" untested, novel system on a very high performance vehicle without testing it yourself under high performance conditions. Am I missing something? Also, a question. I assume that the controls to adjust the ride are in the vehicle - correct? Have there ever been any control failures for this type of system causing the front of the car to drop at speed? Rise at speed? Oh. Never mind. I forgot. This is a "one off" system.
61FlatTop said: "When we engineered the kit for this car we intended it to be a one off because we honestly did not think the interest was going to be there so we did not get any back-to-back track comparison data. I personally did not drive the car before or after we completed the install but the few here that did as well as the owner were very pleased with the performance it maintained and more than pleased with the overall ride quality and adjustability."
Very interesting. Please correct me if I am wrong but it appears that you put a "one off" untested, novel system on a very high performance vehicle without testing it yourself under high performance conditions. Am I missing something? Also, a question. I assume that the controls to adjust the ride are in the vehicle - correct? Have there ever been any control failures for this type of system causing the front of the car to drop at speed? Rise at speed? Oh. Never mind. I forgot. This is a "one off" system.
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
The car was driven and tested here.... by saying "me" I meant me personally ( I wanted to drive it but I think they were smart enough to not let me in it ) Also by refering to "one off" This is in refernce to the bracketry and fitting. The electronics and the Shockwaves are off the shelf components other than dyno testing and tuning the shocks to each other.... And no, no electronic widgets causing the vehicle to react conversely. To alter ride height, it requires you to manually hit a button, either a pre programed function or a manual control button.
The car was driven and tested here.... by saying "me" I meant me personally ( I wanted to drive it but I think they were smart enough to not let me in it
) Also by refering to "one off" This is in refernce to the bracketry and fitting. The electronics and the Shockwaves are off the shelf components other than dyno testing and tuning the shocks to each other.... And no, no electronic widgets causing the vehicle to react conversely. To alter ride height, it requires you to manually hit a button, either a pre programed function or a manual control button.Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Thank you 61FlatTop for the clarification. Sounds interesting. However, one more question. Is there a lock out feature on the controls so that the ride height cannot be adjusted while the vehicle is moving? If not, an accidental hit of the button, at speed, could prove catastrophic - especially in a Viper. By the way, did you serve on CVA 61, the Forrestal Class Carrier named Ranger? Just curious.
Thank you 61FlatTop for the clarification. Sounds interesting. However, one more question. Is there a lock out feature on the controls so that the ride height cannot be adjusted while the vehicle is moving? If not, an accidental hit of the button, at speed, could prove catastrophic - especially in a Viper. By the way, did you serve on CVA 61, the Forrestal Class Carrier named Ranger? Just curious.
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
There is not a lockout so to speak but it would be easy enough to get that to happen. The ECU and ride height on start is activated by the "key hot". All you would theoretically need to do is toggle the key hot switch on and off. With it off, it would essentially shut the control panel down. Now in reality, when the car is completely deflated it should be resting on bump stops and still be able to roll and maneuver. Even though the car in the images appear to be flat on the deck, knowing how we do things around here... that car is resting on the factory stops and can actually still roll at that height. Or B, if the factory stops didnt catch it then we would install bumpstops here to keep it from hitting the ground. For us... safety is paramount. We are not your hack shop and we engineer air suspensions for performance, safety, and reliability. My intentions are not to come in here and sound like a 70's used car salesman but I did not want an internet thread to get carried away without having some legitimate background info. We obviously realize that this is not for everyone and that there will always be your ******** tuner guys that will live and die by a set of high quality coil overs... I have no problems with that.
By the way, I did not on that boat or in the Navy.... why do you ask?
There is not a lockout so to speak but it would be easy enough to get that to happen. The ECU and ride height on start is activated by the "key hot". All you would theoretically need to do is toggle the key hot switch on and off. With it off, it would essentially shut the control panel down. Now in reality, when the car is completely deflated it should be resting on bump stops and still be able to roll and maneuver. Even though the car in the images appear to be flat on the deck, knowing how we do things around here... that car is resting on the factory stops and can actually still roll at that height. Or B, if the factory stops didnt catch it then we would install bumpstops here to keep it from hitting the ground. For us... safety is paramount. We are not your hack shop and we engineer air suspensions for performance, safety, and reliability. My intentions are not to come in here and sound like a 70's used car salesman but I did not want an internet thread to get carried away without having some legitimate background info. We obviously realize that this is not for everyone and that there will always be your ******** tuner guys that will live and die by a set of high quality coil overs... I have no problems with that.
By the way, I did not on that boat or in the Navy.... why do you ask?
Jerome Sparich
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Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Flat top = carrier
Flat top = carrier
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
I have gotten that from my screen name before and I thought that is what it was from but no it is in reference to the 61 Bel Air post car that I am building. They also referred to that car as a shelfback, or flattop. I am building this thing for double duty as a driver and will be seeing some track time. Here are some images so far...By the way, no those are not the wheels and tires going on the car those are to just move it around. I am going to run a 19 front and rear.
I have gotten that from my screen name before and I thought that is what it was from but no it is in reference to the 61 Bel Air post car that I am building. They also referred to that car as a shelfback, or flattop. I am building this thing for double duty as a driver and will be seeing some track time. Here are some images so far...By the way, no those are not the wheels and tires going on the car
those are to just move it around. I am going to run a 19 front and rear.
You must be registered for see images
You must be registered for see images
You must be registered for see images
You must be registered for see images
99 R/T 10
Enthusiast
Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Just curious, what is th ecost of the system installed?
Just curious, what is th ecost of the system installed?
darren@ridetech
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Re: 06\' Coupe... on air bags
Looking at about $3000-4200 depending on the options.
Looking at about $3000-4200 depending on the options.
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