Can we verify sequence of 1992 Vipers?

HasCars

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Hello everyone. Owner of 1992 Viper #207, 3300 miles. I have listed it on BringATrailer.com but they refuse to call it Viper #207 because they do not feel they can verify the sequences. My serial number is 1B3BR65E3NV100207 and its a 1992, but they say:

" Thank you for sending over your change requests, and I hope the following will adequately address them. Our formatting will not accommodate your request to add “#207” to the headline, as we need to keep those as concise as possible, and the number 207 doesn’t really distinguish the car from the other 1992 Vipers. As for the number 207 in the VIN, we still cannot know with utmost certainty that this car was the 207th built. Even with limited-production vehicles, they were often produced in batches and then tagged/numbered/stamped with their VINs. All we know for certain is that your car is one of the first-year examples and it was tagged with the number 207. We try to avoid making specific claims about production sequence mainly because it can lead to tangential discussions and debates in the comments when an auction goes live. This approach and format have been developed and proven over the course of 110k+ auctions and our community understands and appreciates it. If you look back at the car's listing when you won the auction, you will note that we did not include the #207 inline or in the title, showing the consistency of our format.

to which I wrote:
"I strongly disagree that it would be detrimental to call the car Viper #207, but will yield to your decision. I show the car often, and that is what the Viper people refer to their 1992s as, regardless of your comment about the batches

and they came back with:

"Hi Yancy, Thank you for your message. I know you are frustrated, and I can see where our position can be perceived as obstinate. Historically, we haven't mentioned production numbers in Viper listings because of the difficulty in proving sequential production numbers. But, before we leave the topic completely, do you have any documentation (other than the VIN) that could prove the production sequence and that your car is actually the 207th built? If so, please send our way, and we will review."

Can anyone help me document this, or at least tell me that their position is reasonable?

Thanks in advance
 

Ramtuff

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Vin#s do not correlate to build sequence. When there is an order for a vehicle (this is simplified) it gets a vin then the scheduler decides when the car gets built and receives a sequence # and is built in that order. Cars can be held back if they don’t have certain options available or they want to run a bunch of colors in a row etc. Therefore a car with a higher vin can be built before a car with a lower # vin.
 

daveg

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The above responses are spot on, they were built in batches. However, you can find out if its close to 207 by looking at when they started production of the 92's and then looking at your build date. That's what I did with my 96 GTS because I am VIN 33 and my cars build date is 2 weeks after they started building them, thus I know my car was one of the first built.
Hope this helps.

PS, one other thing I thought of is look for differences between the early and later cars. For instance, my car has the oil fill on the drivers side valve cover which is rare because they moved it to the passenger side fairly early in the run.
 
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GTS Dean

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As an example, my GTS was also very early production - starting on 05/29 and is VIN 98. It also came with the D.S. rear oil fill. It wasn't delivered to me until mid-July due to their regional delivery schedule with Reliable Carriers. I'm curious as to what your MDH is Dave?

Edit: (MonthDayHour)
 
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daveg

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Hey Dean,
so the very first 96 production car rolled off on 5/6/96
My Build is MDH: 051708
So my car was built 11 days after the first production car that came off the line.

Dean, do you have the document written by Chris Green?
 

GTS Dean

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Yes. He's local and I collaborated with him on parts of his document..

My car started down the line right after Indy and VOI 3
 

TEALLIFE

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Unless you have Viper #1 (or maybe the first 5-10 even, or the last of a production run)....#207 is meaningless even if it was accurate. The year, early production and 3300 miles and everything else matter way more than whatever number way after the first. I wouldn't even sweat it.
 

ViperJeff

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@HasCars BAT is correct. Vipers never really had an assigned sequence number. Over many moons of collecting data, I found as many as seven different dates attached to the building of a Viper and of course there may be more and some provided to me could be bogus. The only public way of knowing the build sequence was noted prior. The Date of MFR and MDH. Even with that, when was it assigned in the process. I could never get a straight answer. People have provided me with pictures showing their Viper being one of the last few off the line, and their MDH shows it was built a month prior. Even the numbered Vipers are a crap shoot, the assigned number seems to be counter to the build order (based on MDH) almost like they assigned the town drunk to go put stickers on the Vipers. (and oh yea, people who requested a particular #)

For what it's worth, people that I know that have called the Viper Historical Society (if it still exists) or some other department within whatever was the Parent Company at the time, could not get a good answer or an answer at all. Most of the people I know that started registries all gave up, to include, the original creators of the International Viper Registry and I gave up on mine. All the reasons are different whether that be good or bad.

Good luck with the sale, in most books it would be a gem as a lot of guessers have the 92 production year to lest than 50% still remaining (I don't share that assessment).

Humbly
Vj
 
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