I can't pass emissions in Denver!

John Johns

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I would appreciate any input on this. I have a 2000 Roe ACR which came from Florida. Details are in my sig. I've unplugged the battery early on to reset the pcm as the car was running very rich having been at sea level. After failing emissions the first time for high HC and NOx, Sean made me an emissions card for the VEC-2 which runs the injectors at stock flow. He suggested the 6 year old high flow ceramic cats might need replacement too. I had new Roe high flows installed, put in stock plugs at Sean's suggestion and loaded the emissions program and still failed although the numbers inproved a bit. HC standard here is 1.2, I'm at 4.47, NOx standard is 1.5 and I'm at 1.93. Both readings indicate rich mixtures and unburned fuel per the inspection report. My tech tells me oxy sensors are probably not the issue as no codes are shown. Ideas?
 

EllowViper

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I wonder what your STFT and LTFTs are at this point. If it is a sniff test at idle and your ODB LTFT/STFTs are around -20-30%, that tells me your computer is trying to dump ALOT of fuel due to an overly rich condition. I assume rear 02's are still in? I'd really lean out the base injector offsets due to how the ROE manifold does not fill each cylinder evenly below 2000 RPM (incredably short runners...OK no runners) and your front 02 sensors are chasing a rich condition. At idle the ROE will be so rich on some cylinders that you will have to significanty vary the fuel trims to get an even "burn" as to pass a sniff test and get your LTFT/STFTs to stop fighting their offsets. With stock plugs, i'd get the injectors set lean (with green tops I would try about 55% as a point of departure), individual trims dialed in (set probably -50 to -80ms on # 9,10 cyiinders. Driveability and off-idle accelleration will be really bad..but at idle your LTFT/STFTs should be adding a lot of fuel vice dumping...since it will be really lean. If that doesn't get you over the ****...then I'm at a loss. You could try an even hotter RC14---plug just for the smog test...
Send me your tune at: [email protected] and I'll take a look at it.
 

Coloviper

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Ah.... the fun of CO Emissions. I cringe everytime I go in to test the cars as I will have always performed some mods that make me ride on one cheek to the testing station. My 95' S351R Saleen with the 408 Stroker and Vortech is always fun, but just passes every two years.

Not sure what to do on the Viper but from your readings you need to lean out the car to pass. If you have changed out all four O2 sensors and put new plugs in already, the easiest trick I can think of is to add three or four bottles of Methanol to your 1/4 full 91 Octane gas tank. The Methanol in the gas will help it pass emissions much, much easier. It worked on my blown S351R the past six years. Pep Boys sells it as "guaranteed to pass emissions".

If you are failing on the idle test, then you might way to come down south during the week and run the car past the mobile Emissions Testing stations. They are usually at an on ramp at Quebec and C-470. I believe you just need to drive by it two or three times in a day or over a couple of days (please check first). I am not sure how they test all that, but it would make sense if it eliminates the idle test because the car is not idling. It will register as pass or fail at that point. If it passes, it is already in the system and nothing more to do but pay an extra $25 at registration. There is a Pep Boys right there and you can load up on the Methanol right there. With hot cats, it might just work. Just work is all you need.

If that does not work, the I suggest putting in a stock tune for the computer and see if that helps to lean it out as it is clearly running rich to protect against knock and to keep it running cooler. It might get you through the test, then you can tune it back to run right. Just don't push it on stock tune.

Finally if that does not work, find a friend in the mountains in a non-testing area and work it out with him so you can stage the car being stored there. Emissions testing in Colorado is per where the car is stored and resides, NOT where you physically live. If you can make that work, then no more emissions testing for you. Pueblo is the same thing. It is good to have friends, though I have never gone that route with my cars, I know people who have. Might want to clean your injectors as well beforehand.

Hope that helps! BTW How old is the gas in your car?
 

Dom426h

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if you get an inspection tech that is understanding to your situation he will let you hold her around 1-2K rpms to pass the test.
My viper with no cats was 4times the HC limit at idle, and 50% of the limit when running at 1.5Krpms

Or you could just adjust your "idle" to BE 1.5K rmps with the VEC... although, i'd start at 1K so it isnt that obvious and see what kind of #'rs she produces then increase from there untill PASS.:2tu:

-Goodluck
 

PatentLaw

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You have a big HC problem. I think you are running too rich. You need to back it down for the test. You are not even close.

Your NOx is fairly close, indicating that you are running a little warm. The other idea above about backing it down and running the test at a lower RPM will get you by the NOx problem.

How long after "unplugging" did you run the tests? Do any driving or significant driving after you rehooked?

Was your car warm when you ran the test? Brought up to operating temperature?
 

Martin

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The above suggestions are all good ones, and here's one more. Most states will accept the smog test results from another state as long as the data is clearly listed. I've had cars housed in other states and had to submit smog results when renewing registrations - and I just had to go to a local licensed smog station, get the test done, and sumbit them with a letter saying that I was out of state on business and can't bring the car back to have it smogged locally. That would allow you to bring the car someplace at sea-level and that would likely solve your rich-burn problems. Have a look at your local Dept. of Motor Vehicles rules and regulations to see if they'll let you do that.

Also, running a tank of E85 might get you across the line. Not recommended for long-term use, but I've seen E85 cut the HC numbers by 75% before. Car drives like crap, though...
 

Coloviper

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Martin;

Unfortunately Colorado is not one of those states. If he was close to the mark, on all readings and maybe under on a few of the other ones they test for, he could walk to the office beside most testing stations and apply for an "Enhanced Exception" and would probably get it, but at those HC levels, they would just usher him right out the door.

Colorado is right behind California for emissions testing toughness, though they can be fair at times. Depends on who comes to work that day!
 

RTTTTed

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I like the idea of running the Methanol added to the gas. **** runs 6parts air to 1 part fuel whereas gas runs 14.7 part air to 1 part air. Since alcohol run twice as much fuel for the same air as gas, a low tank of fuel and add some methanol might work?

But, in emmissions states there are tuners that specialize in cheating the smog testers. I am assuming that you did read all the plugs and they were all properly and equally colored? 1 dribbly injecort could easily cause your problem and no tune would fix the injector.

Ted
 

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