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Let's try to help SRT save/sell the GEN V.

Discussion in 'General Viper Discussion' started by Ray W, Sep 28, 2013.

  1. Ray W

    Ray W Enthusiast

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    Ray Charles can see they aren't moving. If Fiat thought we were so loyal we would by whatever they decided to give us, they now know we won't. I have 5 very good friends who all were multiple Viper owners have owned an average of 3 new Vipers each. Only 1 still has one (2009 ACR). All are completely disappointed by the new car. We all agree it is probably the best Viper built to date. Unfortunately it is not enough to get them to buy another one. So here is the thought. If you could be lured into buying a new Viper. What is the "one" thing it would take ? Let's see if there is a common denominator that might help SRT build what will sell. For me 700-750hp. Just that simple. That one thing alone would make me get off my wallet. Now there are other things I want but I would overlook them all for the hp. So if it is the PDK, open PCM, Turbo or Supercharging let's hear it.
     
  2. Ray W

    Ray W Enthusiast

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    The one thing 700-750 factory hp. I would buy one tomorrow. These things are on my wish list but any one of them alone would not make me buy the car but are listed in order of preference. 2. PCM that would allow modifications. 3. Some type of automatic transmission. 4. Carbon ceramic brakes. 5. Dry sump oil system.
     
  3. balance

    balance Enthusiast

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    - Enough headroom so anyone 6'2" can fit wearing a helmet.

    - F1 paddle shift option.

    - base model with 15 - 20K price reduction. (Less creature comforts and/or carbon fiber if needed to accomplish this ... many of us could "personally" make up the weight difference.)
     
  4. GTS-R 001

    GTS-R 001 Enthusiast

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    I would bet that it is not the HP or the this or the that,

    it is the economy and the $$$$ the new car costs.

    If Fiat came out with a program where they said

    "Prove you were a purchaser of a new Viper before and we will sell you one of these for $0 down, 0% interest and financing for up to over 10 years"

    They would sell a bunch.

    Outside of that, They can see the economy affecting the sales, the sales have been flat since 2008, 300-400 cars per year... not quite the 2000 - 4000 they thought they would sell and HAD TO SELL to keep the Viper alive.
     
  5. Free2go

    Free2go Enthusiast

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    700 hp.....to the wheels N/A fully built, stroked, and sleeved with a redline around 7500 rpms. Upon pushing the ignition button a powerful externally mounted speaker belches out the sound of Godzilla roaring up to 150 decibels before the engine turns over. ZR1 style carbon ceramic brakes, all wheel drive at the push of a button, electronically adjustable ride height, rear mounted exhaust with a baffle that could electronically divert exhaust around catalytic converter, fat a$$ cam, heads up display, GTR style modifiable console display, only available in blue with white stripes with the stripes going through the liscence plate area, Sneaky Pete emblems, NO cup holders, NO glove compartment, adjustable seats with inflatable lumbar support, front and rear mounted cameras streaming live to Facebook along with push button Night Vision through the console display. I would shell out $140k for this.
     
  6. Ray W

    Ray W Enthusiast

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    Yes the economy sucks. All brands have high performance cars that are not moving. The car has to be great enough that you are willing to write that check. Whether it one check or 120. In the case of my friends the cheapest replacement car for their Viper 115K and the highest is 200K so they can and have spent their money on something else.
     
  7. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    More HP, yawn.

    The economy sucks. Look what happens when the Fed says they will pull back QE, the world goes into panic.

    Most people have no idea the Viper is back. The issue is selling a car that at a min costs 2x the price of any other vehicle on Dodges lot. SRT needs to do the advertising to get qualified buyers into show rooms, period. It has nothing to do with "only" 640HP. No one buying a dart is going to be up sold to a $110k-140k car.

    If SRT would have nailed down building, I think things would have been better. The customer experience of building the custom order was a disaster. You shouldn't struggled having to pay $110k+, nor wait 5 months after they tell you the car is due.
     
  8. Dom426h

    Dom426h Enthusiast

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    What are you basing this off of?
    Do you have any of the basic sales data like:
    1. What was SRT's expected 2013 customer pre-orders vs actual numbers?
    2. How many 2013's were built? How many have been sold?
    3. Ect...

    I only ask because I havnt seen any actual data, just a few people saying that their dealer has one on the lot that isn't sold yet. This leads some people to the conclusion that they arnt selling at all. If that was the case than Chevy must be doing real bad because my local dealer still has a LINE of 2012 Corvettes sitting out front, and just behind that is a LINE of Camaros.....

    One point of a dealership is too maintain an Inventory so that the consumer can see the cars in person, sit in them, feel em, smell em, test drive em, and make a decision. Sure the Viper is not evaluated by most consumers like a typical car but i don't see anything wrong with keeping one in the showroom for the entire year at a marked up price then lowering the price gradually towards the end of the year until it sells. This keeps the HALO car in the showroom making potential Chyrsler customers feel good about the brand as a whole and may lead to more purchases and an overall higher profit for the dealership even if they end up selling the Viper under invoice at the end of the year.
     
  9. robiferretti

    robiferretti Enthusiast

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    Just think the new cars are priced to high.

    Viper is meant to compete in the $75-$90k price category. At $100k+ I'm buying a 430 / gallardo/ or slew of other great cars.

    Everyone knows vipers depreciate to $50k Makes the line shorter for those willing to drop $150k.

    Big factor in new car sales on cars like this is people who watch the secondary market. Mclaren, SLR, Carrera GT, ford GT all had this problem when new.
     
  10. JeffInDFW

    JeffInDFW Viper Owner

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    I'm one of the people you are looking for. I've owned my 96 GTS since it was 6 months old. I was very much waiting for the new Viper with plans to trade up to it. I've been waiting a long time to buy my next Viper. I strongly disliked the styling of the Gen IV cars (except the ACR), and was thrilled that the 2013 looked a lot like my GTS. SO.....Why have "I" not purchased one? I've been trying to figure it out. The car has just left me -cold-.

    A big part of it is, I feel the 2013 Viper is more or less, a Gen IV with a DRASTICALLY improved interior, and MUCH better exterior styling. So, basically, they fixed the two things I hated about the Gen IV Vipers. I would have loved this car if it had been what was released in 2003. But, 10 years later it feels outdated to me on arrival.

    The Vipers "cockpit adjustable shocks" can not compare to the technology and performance of GMs magnetorheological dampers that were in the OLD ZR1. GM has already come out with the next generation of them in their ZL1 Camaro and they are superior. The Vipers brake rotors can not compare to the insane Carbon Ceramic rotors on the OLD ZR1. GM's in house designed electronic rear differential found on the new C7 base Corvette is superior to the Vipers rear diff. GM's in house designed Performance Traction Management system is IMO the best in the world, and superior to the Vipers traction control. The new C7 Corvette Base model has technology where it adjusts performance based on the temperature of the tires. I just feel that from 2003 to now, the Viper has only seen the big hp jump in 2008. Beyond that, yes, I know there have been a LOT of other improvements, but nothing like the leaps and bounds that Corvette has seen. So much so, that I feel the Corvette has caught up to Viper with the ZR1 and even bested it in a few areas. What I fear is, with this new generation, the 2013 Viper has not moved forward and the new ZR1 will.

    Secondly, the price. The SRT should be priced at $80,000 and the GTS should be priced at $100,000. As mentioned above, once you get above $100,000 a LOT of exotics become an option.

    The biggest thing that sucks about owning a Corvette ZR1 is having people come up to you and say, "Ah, A Corvette. Man, I had one of those back in 1981. Bought it brand new, and MAN, that V8 was CRAZY FAST!". It makes you want to gouge out your own eyes because you just paid $115,000 for a 640hp killer, and the average person thinks it is the same car as his 185hp 1981 Corvette. That does not happen when you own a Viper. However......I admit that I am now waiting to see what GM comes out with for their new Z06/ZR1 for this new generation. Or....I may just keep my 96GTS and buy a Z51 base model C7 Corvette to park next to it.
     
  11. JeffInDFW

    JeffInDFW Viper Owner

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    Sorry. For some reason, forum double posted. Deleted.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2013
  12. plumcrazy

    plumcrazy Enthusiast

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    for me, 700-750HP and the ability to tune the PCM.
     
  13. shine

    shine Viper Owner

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    I'm in the market for another Viper. Biggest hurdle for me isn't the power, options, or styling. I have no problem with "only" 640 hp and love the looks of the new body. I sat in one at a dealership and thought is was comfortable and that it had room for a helmet on my 6'3" frame.

    The TA, when it comes out, may not be an ACR but wow, that's the one I have to have.

    Biggest thing for me is simply cost. I'm not where I was 3 years ago when I bought my last one. $105k base sticker is not easy to finance. $95k, believe it or not, would be much better. So many things have changed and are continuing to change to get a car loan, it's terribly difficult for someone in my position.

    Since I've resigned myself to the fact that my next one will likely be used, and not new, it's a tough sell for me.

    I want to see the brand survive, and I want to see them flying off dealer floors. Since I started making my plans to get back in one about 3 months ago, the ones I've seen at dealers are largely still in place, and I've gotten some very sweet offers to get me to take them off their hands.
     
  14. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    The Viper had always been a $90-99k car, the price has been always about the same for getting into it.

    The reason they are sitting on dealer lots is, dealers saw a cash grab and checked every option on them.

    Priced at an avg of $110, they would have flown off floors. At an avg of $140, that's not happening.

    I think that's the biggest issue, nothing else. Dealers simply priced the car out of the market with greed.
     
  15. Voodoo Rob

    Voodoo Rob Enthusiast

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    Best thing they can do is let the Viper program go. The Gen V is not the car that would bring Viper into the forefront like 1992 or 1996 when Chevy was content and exotics were not near as cool. The car needs complete new technology and design from front to back top to bottom. People are now very informed and research purchases like has never been done before. The Gen V would have been a class leader in 06 or even 08, in 2013 its just lost among the choices. I don't want to be the guy on here causing trouble, just a point of view. The cars introduction and marketing has been mildly luke warm at best, the car has not splashed. Now interest and the apparent lagging sales show it. To answer the question, wind the Gen V program down and put the Viper on hiatus. Do the right R&D, build the right car and release it at the right time.
     
  16. Ray W

    Ray W Enthusiast

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    I understand the thoughts and theories as to why they are/aren't selling. I want to know , can you be persuaded to buy one with one or two changes ? Or is SRT so far off the mark even the no top/ no windows diehards no longer will buy one.
     
  17. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    With all but kristopherbush's experience, all the Gen V owners seem to be quite happy with the cars. If anything, SRT should be leveraging the buyers to build new owner stories to advertise with.

    There is a lot of "the car should have XYZ" - which isn't going to change what the car has for a few years. Instead of wishing the car had some magic feature, leverage the happy owners.

    SRT dealers should let people test drive the cars. There is no way that someone can be on the fence, drive the car, and not buy it. It is simply fantastic.
     
  18. GTSPOWERED

    GTSPOWERED Enthusiast

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    Well here is my two cent's. I think that the car is great but yes the price is on the high side but the marketing is so poor people still say to me that the Viper is not being produced anymore. Yes more horse power would be great but I think that making it lighter is needed.


    Lets take a look at the Corvette and how GM has made some very drastic design changes through the model's.
    The design needs a total new look something that will be as drastic as from the Corvette C3 to the C4 or the C4 to the C5. I do not thing the interior should go back to being cheap like my 97 GTS what SRT has done with the new Viper is nothing shy of being great.

    Patrick.
     
  19. tbsviper

    tbsviper Enthusiast

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    quite a list you offered. Could you point me to the Godzilla sound audio you noted so I can determine if that option would turn me from a looker to a buyer?
     
  20. shine

    shine Viper Owner

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    Yes, yes, yes. I hear this every time I talk to anyone about the Viper. Of course civilians you'd maybe expect it, but car people don't know it either.
     
  21. Free2go

    Free2go Enthusiast

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  22. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    A big "WTF" to me has also been SRT sponsored races. There are two near me, Baltimore and VIR.

    As a Gen V owner, why didn't SRT comp me tickets to come? I counted 0 gen v's from BPG photos.

    I wasn't going to cough up $300 to go - call me entitled, but they should be inviting owners to come. He'll, comp owners of older gens too, who else would buy a Gen V besides an owner of a previous generation?

    SRT can eat $300 a head if it gets Gen V's to events with other viper owners, how else will they drum up interest.

    Having no Gen V at the car corrals is a big bunch of stupid by SRT.
     
  23. viper vince

    viper vince Enthusiast

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    Has anyone gone on cars.com and looked how many new 2013's the dealers still have about 400 new ones.
     
  24. Nine Ball

    Nine Ball Enthusiast

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    SRT marketing gets a D- from me. Only those of us actually interested in buying the car knew they were coming out, when they could be ordered, and when they hit the dealerships first. Coupled with that, is all the negative press the magazines like Motor Trend spewed forth. So, we get lame marketing to promote, and even worse negative press to demote.

    Adding more hp isn't the answer.

    Incorrect quotes of "$150K pricetag" are also not doing any justice. That statement is simply false, yet many people (including current Viper owners) keep saying that. My car was MSRP $110K, and it has upgrades. There are some others at MSRP $99K that are still nicer than any previous gen built before it. People seem to forget there is a base price, they like to quote one with every single (overpriced) option. People were paying over $100K for new Gen 4 cars back in 2008-10. So, the cars have not gone up in price. Even the most base model no-option SRT Gen 5 has more features and is nicer than a fully loaded Gen 4, at similar pricing.

    Agreed that test drives or track dates like Cadillac does with the CTS-V line should happen. Schedule monthly events around the country, invite your target demographics to attend, and presto. Let the car do the talking, and the guest drivers rave about them on the internet and to their buddies at work. This doesn't happen now.

    And the final thing? The Viper community allowing trolls on this site who do nothing but badmouth any Viper, regardless of generation. I visit the Corvette sites too, and those guys talk less trash about the Vipers than the Viper members do. That needs to stop.
     
  25. tbsviper

    tbsviper Enthusiast

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    there is much I agree with in your post but this really stands out, I was surprised by all of the negative posts, comments about the new Gen V as they ran counter to the unveil, factory tour, new owner feedback, etc. No doubt SRT marketing made some mistakes and big ones at that but the bashing of the new Gen V was wildly overblown in my humble opinion. affordability is an issue in a weak economy but that is not SRT's fault it is an economy wide problem of consumer confidence.
     
  26. FLL-B/W-GTS

    FLL-B/W-GTS Enthusiast

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    Local dealer here in Palm Beach has 2 2013s and 6 2014 Brand new Vipers in stock. Within 2 weeks,6 additional Gen 5.s.All sitting their with no one buying them, all the 14s outside in the rain and heat. Sad...I may buy a 2014 Black GTS because the deal is so good with 8000.00 off MSRP on 14s/10,000 on 13s.,but the car will still cost me 130,000.00.Money not a issue for me, but that is a lot for a Viper. The new Gen.5 is just so out dated in performance and is over priced. Especially now having Porsche 911 Turbo S/I know the difference first hand.For me,more horsepower(700 ish.),and a real launch control system that actually works,like on the Turbo Porsches..

    I hope SRT makes some big improvement so I will not be hesitating on buying my 4 th Viper..
     
  27. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    Tony, again my biggest WTF is SRT marketing.

    If SRT dumped all their advertising into sponsoring the races - again, pray tell, why on earth haven't they leveraged them? Why didn't they comp new and existing owners?

    Why didn't they drag along 3-4 Gen V vipers and allow people to give them a go at the events?

    I just don't understand what they are doing. If they get people into the cars, they will move. Just, why aren't they doing ANYTHING to get peoples butts in seats?

    I am giving a local former owner a go in my Gen V, because he is looking. It is a shame that those curious must reach out to other owners instead of headed to dealers (I have no issue doing it).
    SRT is already investing in going around the country advertising with ALMS, why aren't they doing a dog and pony show where qualified buyers can get behind the wheel?!
     
  28. Ray W

    Ray W Enthusiast

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    In the early years Viper buyers sold their friends on the car, The mags hated it and trashed it whenever possible. The opportunity was lost on this generation because Viper lovers weren't given their cars first. Vipers need to be sold by other owners. Dealers do not have a clue. So you have 600 cars sitting around not bought with no happy new owners to help sell them. Now with the higher price, disappointing reviews and cars sitting discounted. People are afraid of making a purchasing mistake.
     
  29. Bobpantax

    Bobpantax Enthusiast

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    I agree with the posts above that state that the economy and the price of the car are the principal causes of the slow sales. And that effect is amplified by the fact that the Viper is no longer viewed as the 800 pound gorilla that it once was in its category.
     
  30. Gustfront

    Gustfront Viper Owner

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    I thought the 60 or so red Gen V's were supposed to be demo's or something. What happened to them. Can't people drive them?
     

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