Viper: Lease or Buy?

[Mike Brunton]

Malachi,

Welcome to the club - you will love driving a Viper. Have you driven one before? The difference between a Z28 and a Viper is like night and day - be prepared for the permanent grin on your face.

As for the buy-or-lease decision, I guess it depends on you, your cash situation, your state of residence and your tax situation. For me, buying the Viper was the way I wanted to go. I leased other cars before, and the benefit was negligible in MA, and there were some hidden costs. Also, I knew I wanted to modify the car, and do some work on it myself, both of which are no-no's on a lease.

I think you will find that the price difference of monthly payments between a lease and a purchase isn't THAT much. The residual on a Viper is set pretty low, which (IMO) makes the lease payments pretty high. If you excercise the buyout option at the end, you'll either take a fleecing on the cost if you keep it (meaning you'll pay a lot more than if you just bought it the 1st time around), or you'll have to deal with selling it to recoup the difference between the residual and the end of lease buyout.

What state are you in? If you're in TX, I've heard some legislation was passed recently making it quite UNattractive to put a lease car in the company name, although I couldn't elaborate since I don't live there.

Welcome to the Viper nation!

 

[BigsViper]

The problem in Texas is, when you lease you must pay taxes on the entire acquisition cost, not just the difference between the cost and the residual. Then it gets worse, in a closed end lease (better than open-end) like mine you have the three options of walking away, buying it for the residual or getting another. But in Texas, if you walk away you get no value or credit for the tax you paid on the residual, if you buy it YOU HAVE TO PAY TAX ON THAT AMOUNT AGAIN!!

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and the only way you can get credit for that amount is to get another from that same leasing company, then they will call the residual amount the "trade in".

We are talking about $2,100 here which may be significant to some and not to others. I ran back through all the numbers and net to net the out of pocket on lease vs. purchase will be about the same, here in Texas.

In my personal situation I disagree with those that say pay cash (earlier thread), even though I could (can). When you think about using after-tax money you have to take the purchase price divided by (100 minus your tax rate) to see how much it will really cost, for me it would have been about $123,000 before tax. I like leasing or purchasing for cash flow reasons, then invest the rest to make a greater return than the finance costs (tough lately) and you come out ahead. Paying cash is great for peace of mind, just poor money management IMO.

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[NoPistons]

Is anyone leasing their Viper?

I was looking to put 20k down and pay 700/month for a '01
according to Dodge's website. I have a '93 RX-7, a wrecked one(20k from insurance coming soon), and tow vehicle(chevy).

i wanted to do this because i want to drive the car daily and put 15k/miles on it a year. I'd also make it a company car and leases are able to be written off. but, i will have to talk to my accountant for full details. The lease would be for three years. I wouldnt want to buy it at the end of the lease. Hopefully by then i could afford a 2003 model

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I'm in south carolina. So, the weather isnt too much of a factor for daily driving. The demand for sports cars are down now. So, i thought it'd be a good time to buy

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Thanks, Brian

'93 RX-7s

 

[luc]

I also live in California and leased my 2000 Gts for 2 reasons.
What is important is how much the Viper cost in after taxes $.In my 50% bracket even if the Viper cost more to lease than to buy it cash or even on credit,it is still cheaper for me to lease it and paid with my before tx $.
The 2nd point is on a cash buy or credit, you have to depreciate the value of the car on many years, with a lease you take it as a straight expense.
So if my 3 years lease cost me $ 15,000.00 a year, my net cost (50% tx bracket)is only $ 7,500.00 a year.
Of course that only work if you can claim the expense as a business related cost.
Luc.

 

[Brad04Mamba]

This is to NoPistons. If you are planning on walking away from in in three years don't put $20K down. If you did this then in three years you would be walking away from $20K in equity (Vipers hold there value better than most cars). The best thing if you don't plan on buying it after the lease is to put the minimum down and make larger payments. The thing to remember that a lease is just like a purchase, ie interest rate, payoff amount etc, the only difference is you only pay for the car that you use and you can walk away from, if you have any equity in it at the end the lease you don't want to just give it to the bank.

 

[NoPistons]

good point brad. i will look into that option

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i was looking into the big down payment because im self employed and im 23. i bought brooks' rx7 in march of 2000. i tried to get a 5k loan then but i couldnt. so, i had to pay for the car in cash.

my MAIN reason for leasing is this...i was thinking that there are not many people out there that would want a 3 year old viper with 40k+ miles on it. most of the vipers i see for sale have minimal miles.

ie. '98 red w. stripe gts with 5k is a good deal at 58k

im not an expert, but i think they were about 75k new
so, thats about $3.40 per mile driven. if i leased it and drove it for 3 years at 15k miles/year i would only be paying around a dollar a mile.

this is just in dodge theory. i know it will be hard for me to find a dealer willing to lease according to dodge's website. if anyone has had a good experience leasing their viper, please let me know either on the board or privately

thanks, brian
Piston-less since 1996 (i had a '88 civic in high school

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)

 

[Mike Brunton]

Malachi,

How big are you? I am 6'3" and a good 240lbs, and I fit just fine. There is a bit of a trick to getting the seat all the way back (tilt it forward, push the sliders to the fully-aft position, then tilt the seat back where it rests on the bulkhead). I have no problems fitting in my GTS after this procedure. I even have a good 2" of room between my knees and the kickpanel.

I've found that the Viper is quite small inside, however you will notice that with all the critical dimensions - headroom, legroom, shoulder room, width - you have plenty of room, it's just that you only have 1-2" to spare, whereas in a larger car, you have more inches to spare. Know what I mean, or maybe I'm confusing ya?

 

[Joseph Houss]

It'll work until you get audited! Auditors will look for clear intent. In other words, if you actually got written license from Dodge to use the Viper in your campaign (as was done with a pharmaceutical company last year), and your advertising budget was such that you could logically explain why purchasing the vehicle would be less expensive than renting it for the photo or photo shoots, I think you'd have a good case...

but, to just say "I bought it for this one $750.00 ad that I placed in a trade publication".....I don't think that'll fly.

 

[FikseGTS]

Hey Brian....

so USAA is giving you 20k for my old RX-7?, not bad.....

how about a 1996 GTS with a new motor and 9k miles??

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j/k

my friend leased his 1998 RT/10 for minimal down (prettty sure), 48 month lease for $975/month.....

I can get the specifics....

Brooks

http://viper.miamisci.org

 

[BigsViper]

JTV, This revelation might cause me to get flamed by some of our Viper brethren, but my businesses involve manufacturing and service in..... (Hold Your Breath...) THE EVIL OIL INDUSTRY!!
Actually I hope no one in this group maintains that incorrect view of our industry, I wouldn't think so since we all cherish internal combustion and most of us have paid our gas guzzler tax.

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Seeing a high performance vehicle that loves fuel brings a smile to the face of my customers and colleagues. I think the Viper perfectly fits my company's image as being the best at what we do, not the biggest, and (most importantly) being the best high performance value for the dollar!!!

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I think I'll delete my earlier post, don't want to upset the auditors, DC and Mr. Houss!!

 

[Joseph Houss]

My intentions were good...and I'm definitely NOT an auditor...just a businessman in the same dilemma. Tax "loopholes" are few and far between, and I've researched many...they ALL work until you get audited.

 

[NoPistons]

Brooks-
i got 20 and the car

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im looking for full fiberglass panels.
if you know anyone that sells them, email me
i have found the panels for GT2/3 but i kinda need doors that open

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my friends' stock r1 weighed in at 2700 even with a roll bar. all that was taken out were the rear speakers, spare tire, and he had an upgraded catback. so, im hoping to gut the car, and have a machine weighing about 2550 with 450/rwhp
and yeah, im putting in a full cage because the a-pillar was bent
let me know about the PS2, too

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-brian
viperless in south carolina