Dangerous Gen III Suspension?

[WanaGTO]

So, my ‘05 is new to me but is in need of some suspension work.

Of particular concern is adding the knuckle support for the toe links, and new toe end links to avoid a catastrophic failure that I’ve become aware of recently.

I found this kit but it seems very pricey: https://www.viperpartsusa.com/product/rear-toe-link-kit-1992-2010/

And these toe link supports: https://www.viperpartsusa.com/product/toe-link-support-2003-2017-steel/

I’ve searched the forums but can’t find anything up-to-date to source these parts at a better price. I can’t do the work myself so labor is a factor in the overall cost so I’d love to find parts at a more reasonable cost, if possible.

 

[Steve M]

I've seen this topic pop up over the years...some are convinced it is an accident waiting to happen, but I'm not one of them.

I could see a failure happening if you do something like fishtail into a curb - it may not break immediately, but it could weaken it to the point where it is more likely to happen in the future. But will a catastrophic failure happen under normal driving conditions on an otherwise undamaged car? That's where I'm not convinced.

Who made you aware of the problem? The people selling the parts? They clearly have something to gain by telling people it is a big problem (and then conveniently pointing you to their solution). Was it someone that bought the part? Choice-supportive bias/post-purchase rationalization is a real thing...I've been guilty of it many times myself.

They need to provide proof that it actually is a problem, and that proof can't be pictures of a car that's been in an accident where the knuckle was broken in that spot. They'll say the knuckle broke and caused the accident; it is equally plausible that the car smacked into a curb due to driver error, and that's where the knuckle broke (as you'd expect).

Maybe folks with road racing experience can chime in here...there are plenty that "hit" the apex. Is that enough to cause this type of damage? @GTS Dean ?

Either way, that support isn't going to magically save your car if the knuckle lets go at speed.

And yes, that particular company sells a lot of overpriced parts...I try to avoid them if at all possible. You can sometimes find the same stuff on Ebay for substantially less.

 

[WanaGTO]

I've seen this topic pop up over the years...some are convinced it is an accident waiting to happen, but I'm not one of them.

I could see a failure happening if you do something like fishtail into a curb - it may not break immediately, but it could weaken it to the point where it is more likely to happen in the future. But will a catastrophic failure happen under normal driving conditions on an otherwise undamaged car? That's where I'm not convinced.

Who made you aware of the problem? The people selling the parts? They clearly have something to gain by telling people it is a big problem (and then conveniently pointing you to their solution). Was it someone that bought the part? Choice-supportive bias/post-purchase rationalization is a real thing...I've been guilty of it many times myself.

They need to provide proof that it actually is a problem, and that proof can't be pictures of a car that's been in an accident where the knuckle was broken in that spot. They'll say the knuckle broke and caused the accident; it is equally plausible that the car smacked into a curb due to driver error, and that's where the knuckle broke (as you'd expect).

Maybe folks with road racing experience can chime in here...there are plenty that "hit" the apex. Is that enough to cause this type of damage? @GTS Dean ?

Either way, that support isn't going to magically save your car if the knuckle lets go at speed.

And yes, that particular company sells a lot of overpriced parts...I try to avoid them if at all possible. You can sometimes find the same stuff on Ebay for substantially less.

Thank you for the very thorough reply. My motivation for the part came from some digging though NHTSA and other reports and the fact that the vehicle’s history is largely unknown although the title is clean.

It makes sense to me knowing that aluminum does fatigue and I’ve read the part is cast aluminum. I was doing it as cheap insurance and peace of mind. But admittedly am not aware of its prevalence or to what degree the support reduces deflection.

I will check on eBay, as well for the toe kit.

Thanks again!

 

[Heysie]

I've the toe link supports. But did use my car for road racing with slick tires.
It's very easy to bolt on yourself, just remove your rear tire and loosen 2 bolts and 1 nut.
Don't remember if I bought them at the site you show.

 

[WanaGTO]

I've the toe link supports. But did use my car for road racing with slick tires.
It's very easy to bolt on yourself, just remove your rear tire and loosen 2 bolts and 1 nut.
Don't remember if I bought them at the site you show.

Are you selling?
Did you ever have any issues with the problem described?

 

[GTS Dean]

I agree with Steve. The knuckle support strut is unnecessary except for frequent track driving. Knuckles fail when they sustain sudden, extreme overloadings in abnormal directions of travel.

 

[WanaGTO]

I agree with Steve. The knuckle support strut is unnecessary except for frequent track driving. Knuckles fail when they sustain sudden, extreme overloadings in abnormal directions of travel.

Thanks for the feedback. Is the general consensus that the few failures were likely factory defects in the casting?

The descriptions of said failures were certainly concerning — not regarding those that were likely caused by accidents/impacts before failure.

 

[GTS Dean]

After 25 years of regular and pretty heavy track driving in my '96 GTS, I finally added external support. I couldn't tell any difference from the way it drove from when I had the INBOARD toe link strut for 21 years.

 

[Heysie]

Are you selling?
Did you ever have any issues with the problem described?

No I keep them on the car. Once in a while I do a trackway.
I bought them because of what I once read about the "problem" of driving with slick tires.
Thought it was cheap insurance if things went wrong.