Losing Interest

Milksnake

Viper Owner
Joined
Sep 21, 2002
Posts
56
Reaction score
0
Location
Redwood City, CA
Has anyone noticed or is it my imagination, based upon the pictures from the auto shows, that Dodge seems to have lost interest in promoting the viper? I would like to hear what other people think. By the way, when we were at the SF auto show in Nov. the viper did not even have a sign, and we were told that it was a last minute job. We have 2 Vipers, - GTS and SRT-10 and love them both, but are concerned that we are going to soom be orphans or relics.
 

RavenFan_94

Viper Owner
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
Posts
1,280
Reaction score
0
Location
Stevensville, MD
I think that when DC 'softened' the harshness of the prior Gens, they expected the market to expand. Consequently, they built way too many cars and sales lagged. Lagging sales are the quickest way for a car company to divest themselves of a product.

With the Viper only in its third year post redesign, they will need to figure out how to build one less than everyone wants to buy or spend a few bucks marketing the car.

The new coupe is a good sign. They did something. Lack of auto show support could be a leading indicator. I hope not.
 

Finally got it !

Viper Owner
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Posts
1,094
Reaction score
0
I think we may be reading into the lack of publicity too much.. I think D.C. is way hot right now with alot of new product hitting the market. They are capitalizing on the "Hemi hysteria" and that is where the marketing dough is going. D.C. still has a interest in their Halo car or there would be no coupe.Give it time. When The new Coupe comes out I think D.C. will show a renewed interest in our beloved Viper..
 

Bobpantax

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 2, 2000
Posts
6,957
Reaction score
3
Location
Miami
The Viper was Lutz's car. Lutz is now at GM. The quad turbo Chrysler prototype was Wolfgang's car. He is now at Volkswagon and the quad turbo went the way of all flesh. The SRT-8 with the 425 HP hemi is coming out this Spring. The "Firepower" which will have a different name when made, has the 425 HP hemi engine. My prediction: The current Viper will be gone in three model years or less. The Firepower will replace it as the halo car, be renamed, and eventually be made with a supercharged version of the current 425 HP engine putting out about 550 Hp. Alternative prediction: The Viper will continue with a supercharged version of the current 425 HP hemi engine putting out about 550HP. I also predict it will be a roots type supercharger based on an analysis of Ford's success with the Eaton supercharger on the Lightning and, possibly, feedback on the success of the Roe system.
 

Y2K5SRT

Enthusiast
Joined
Apr 26, 1999
Posts
7,891
Reaction score
0
Location
Overland Park, KS
My prediction: The Firepower will be released as a Chrysler sports car to compete with the entry level Vette. The Viper will be reinvented and moved up market with a more exotic style (much), more horsepower (much), and a basket of improvements including weight reduction, traction control, etc. And a $100,000.00 price tag.

In a nutshell, the Viper will attempt a Ford GT approach and give up the short-lived and poorly planned Corvette approach. Just my opinion.
 

Finally got it !

Viper Owner
Joined
Mar 18, 2001
Posts
1,094
Reaction score
0
My prediction: The Firepower will be released as a Chrysler sports car to compete with the entry level Vette. The Viper will be reinvented and moved up market with a more exotic style (much), more horsepower (much), and a basket of improvements including weight reduction, traction control, etc. And a $100,000.00 price tag.

In a nutshell, the Viper will attempt a Ford GT approach and give up the short-lived and poorly planned Corvette approach. Just my opinion.

I for one would not mind that prediction. BUT, is Dodge ready to cater to a more upscale market. 100k price tag, you Damn well better not let my car sit outside next to a Chrysler k-car while waiting for service...
 

Jay Herbert

Enthusiast
Joined
Dec 7, 1997
Posts
3,111
Reaction score
0
Location
Sunnyvale, CA
The Viper was Lutz's car. Lutz is now at GM. The quad turbo Chrysler prototype was Wolfgang's car. He is now at Volkswagon and the quad turbo went the way of all flesh. The SRT-8 with the 425 HP hemi is coming out this Spring. The "Firepower" which will have a different name when made, has the 425 HP hemi engine. My prediction: The current Viper will be gone in three model years or less. The Firepower will replace it as the halo car, be renamed, and eventually be made with a supercharged version of the current 425 HP engine putting out about 550 Hp. Alternative prediction: The Viper will continue with a supercharged version of the current 425 HP hemi engine putting out about 550HP. I also predict it will be a roots type supercharger based on an analysis of Ford's success with the Eaton supercharger on the Lightning and, possibly, feedback on the success of the Roe system.

After talking with Dan Knott (PVO boss) in January, I have to disagree. The Viper may have solid competition right now in Bob Lutz's new toy, but it is only temporary.

The real question that should be on everyone's minds is just how far can the HP wars go, we are reliving the 60's/early 70's.... and remember what happened back then, the insurance industry (and an oil crisis) killed the muscle car. There are boat loads of 500 HP cars out now, Ford is about to introduce a 550 HP Mustang for crying out loud. So if a Viper came in at say 600 HP.... how long would it be before someone else tried to knock it off it's pedestal?? and maybe of more concern, how long before State Farm (or whoever) would say "Sorry, we no longer insure (600 HP?, 650 HP??, 700 HP???) Vipers, ZO6's, Cobra Mustang's, etc.)

The next Gen of Viper should be more in line with the "Viper style" we all love. I personally feel the Firepower is the car that will help us get to the next Viper by spreading out the Viper's overhead over a larger run of cars, like the Caddy and grocery getter Vette's do for the ZO6.

When all were asked "What if there was a V-8 Viper.... all said "A Viper is a V-10".... well, that made it impossible for Dodge to have a lower priced entry Viper produced at higher volumes to cover the overhead.... like the Vette has.

Remember, Dodge spread out the overhead on the Viper's V-10 by putting it in a higher volume SRT Ram.....

The Firepower is a nice option to do the same for the Viper chassis W/O diluting the Vipers rarity by selling a bunch of lower powered V-8 look alikes....

Is that a Z06?... nah, it's just a "regular" Vette!

We won't ever hear that said about the Viper.
 

DSR207

Enthusiast
Joined
Feb 7, 2005
Posts
1,214
Reaction score
0
Location
Gulfport, MS
Quote:
"We have 2 Vipers,GTS and SRT-10 and love them both, but are concerned that we are going to soom be orphans or relics."
"Lack of auto show support could be a leading indicator"



"along with the opinions on this forum."


Lets assume D.C came back with the baddest viper ever..600hp hemi GTS, would that make the ones we own now WORTHLESS !! The way I feel about my viper is not decided by D.C,it's decided by the smile it puts on my face every time I drive it.
 

Early93Viper

Enthusiast
Joined
Sep 18, 2004
Posts
1,799
Reaction score
0
Location
Kansas
My prediction: The Viper will move in the direction of the everyday supercar that Porches, and even to an extent Ferrari's and Lamborghini's have leaned towards. It will have traction control, more comfort, gadgets, etc. It will have more and more compromises to be a can do anything car the market is looking for right now. It will then die out slowly as it will have lost its niche and blended in with every other supercar. :(

For some reason I don't think the Firepower will be built.

I hope I am wrong on both counts.
 

Fast Freddy

Enthusiast
Joined
Dec 7, 2001
Posts
1,312
Reaction score
0
Location
TUCSON, AZ - USA
i believe that the viper will no longer be made within 5 years as a result of less than desireable stlying on the new coupe and the fact that daimler cares more about mercedes than viper.

also the new vette Z06 is a better performance car than the new viper for less $$$. this has pretty much sealed the vipers fate even if they do pump the horse on the viper to 600 hp. pumping the horse will just drive the price up and since the sales will be down as a result of bad styling on the coupe the germans are just gonna let the viper die a slow painful death. whoever came up with the new styling for the viper coupe should be shot. i think the new srt-10 viper roadster looks great though. its just the coupe looks like crap. dodge has committed total treason by merging with mercedes.
 

ledfoot

Viper Owner
Joined
Jun 21, 2002
Posts
698
Reaction score
0
Location
bay area ca.
Fast Freddy...Me personally I'm a Roadster guy...Just wondering if you have seen the Coupe in person?.....
 

rschiltz

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 5, 2000
Posts
311
Reaction score
2
Location
Houston, TX
I don't know if DC has lost interest or not, but they are doing a lousy job of promoting the Viper at the local auto shows. I went to the Houston auto show a few weeks ago and unless you were really looking, you wouldn't have known a Viper was at the show.

They had a Black SRT-10 in the very back of the display sitting by itself in the corner. It was dirty and had lots of hand prints and smudges. No press, no materials or marketing effort. It was not what the car deserved. You would think they would promote the performance and excitement.
 

ViperInBlack

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 5, 2004
Posts
973
Reaction score
0
It is not important to any of us that D-C promote the Viper/Comp Coupe. We are not seeking public approval of the vehicle, and it needs no introduction to racers. I do not need to see it on television, in magazine or on T-shirts at Walmart (those are the venues for lesser cars).

What is needed, however, is a wider and deeper sense that there is an allocated budget, an engineering team and a specific evolutionary plan. I am quite certain that this exists.

There is repeated reference to "keep the faith," and that is critically important. The coupe, unquestionably, was a disappointment, not in terms of looks (since it was somewhat budgetarily predictable), but the disappointment arose because a Comp Coupe style and/or carbon fiber style was anticipated (almost solely because we want it...it was never promised or even hinted).

They sell only 800 coupes next year. Fine by me. They sell 1200 `verts...fine by me. They make 50 VCAs, 200 Copperheads within the 1200. Ideal.

Surplus cars in inventory? Well, there are several factors, chief among which has been the economy. While many are not impacted by the post-9/11 market (job and stock) devastation, it did cut into the dreams of many. Vacation homes went on the market, Mercedes inventories were quite high even at the end of the past two years, and looking out my office window where there were once Jags, Porsches, BMWs, I now see the docs in Honda, Toyota, and Nissan SUVs.

Baby boomers are heading toward retirement and looking at investments. The middle class is taxed to death and job security is quite low. Education does not guarantee employment. And whining is not a treasured commodity.

If a Viper owner or owner-wannabe is driven toward another make because of its launch of a new model, so be it. To many of us, there is simply no comparison; you can make your Viper as fast as you like.

Would it be nice if the factory understood our needs and dreams? They do. (It would be better if we could express these expectancies without hostility toward the company...the Germans are already frustrated because Iraq held free elections... thankfully it is not a French company).

Bottomline: Do people miss the glory days of uncontested supremecy? Without doubt. Does D-C have a specific plan and timeframe for the car called Viper? Without question.

Always remember how the flow of information occurs in America...currently terrorists are on-trial in Spain for conspiring 9/11. How many know that? The prosecutor is asking for 30 years on each count of ******. How many know that? The Spanish judicial system, however, permits a maximum of 40 years. Knew that? Michael Jackson has an upset tummy. Bet you knew that.

All will be revealed in the future. Again, keep the faith.

Alice
 

Chuck 98 RT/10

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 15, 2000
Posts
17,923
Reaction score
0
Location
tampa, fl USA
I've never seen much Viper promo. Their logic has always been to spend ad dollars on other models and let the Viper speak for itself. It has worked well while the performance was so far out of reach for the competition.
 

Chuck 98 RT/10

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 15, 2000
Posts
17,923
Reaction score
0
Location
tampa, fl USA
Always remember how the flow of information occurs in America...currently terrorists are on-trial in Spain for conspiring 9/11. How many know that? The prosecutor is asking for 30 years on each count of ******. How many know that? The Spanish judicial system, however, permits a maximum of 40 years. Knew that? Michael Jackson has an upset tummy. Bet you knew that.

LOL. Must've been someone he ate.
 

PaViper

Enthusiast
Joined
Jan 21, 2004
Posts
2,316
Reaction score
0
Always remember how the flow of information occurs in America...currently terrorists are on-trial in Spain for conspiring 9/11. How many know that? The prosecutor is asking for 30 years on each count of ******. How many know that? The Spanish judicial system, however, permits a maximum of 40 years. Knew that? Michael Jackson has an upset tummy. Bet you knew that.

All will be revealed in the future. Again, keep the faith.

Alice


Somebody was listening to Rush this morning...
 

BLUESNAKE367

Enthusiast
Joined
Nov 1, 2004
Posts
500
Reaction score
0
Location
VIRGINIA BEACH, VIRGINIA
Alice, I must admit after reading many of your posts that you have a eloquent way of getting to the guts of the conversation.
I do not intend to offend, but, do you write for Rush Limbaugh? or are you some kind of an attorney?
I look forward to your next post, to me, they serve as Viper justice to those who are quick for the so called "grass is greener on the other side" syndrome..
 

RavenFan_94

Viper Owner
Joined
Jul 27, 2003
Posts
1,280
Reaction score
0
Location
Stevensville, MD
Great posts on this thread. I may or may not speak for most on this thread, but I am always looking forward to my next car. Reading, learning, enjoying this great time in automotive history.

Those of us fortunate enough to afford this luxury, have options. I hope that DC keeps their option top of mind.

I really want that next toy to be a Viper. If it dies, my VCA banner flies at half mast.
 

ViperInBlack

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 5, 2004
Posts
973
Reaction score
0
Tom:

No, I fear that I am little more than a ********* conservative who contemplates this great nation that tolerates so much from its citizens and demands so little from them.

I once posted that D-C owes me nothing more than a warranteed car for which I paid. It is a free market, and they determine what they build, but ideally, they accept my input, and I strongly feel that they do.

However, it has become a nation that demands rather than requests, disparages rather than admires, and demeans rather than supports.

As a health care practice, we work closely with attorneys (no choice there), but I am always struck by opinions that spontaneously emerge without a database foundation... just sheer emotionality.

Want to complain that this is no longer the 90's? Well, aside from the Viper, there was little to recommend that decade, better off forgotten.

Want to complain that D-C does not assume the R&D to create a whole new chasis, suspension, and drive train wrapped in an exotic shell, only designed to sell less than 2500 per annum? OK, then I would like to complain about rock music dying in the late 70s. (I may wear an egg ****** around my neck and call it bling-bling, come to think of it).

"Can't we all just get along?" (LOL) No, that is unlikely, but...we can respect each other, and each can take responsibility for not regurgitating what D-C should have done, what GM has done, and how painful it is to have to drive this damned 500 HP car that gives thrills to the driver and salivation to the onlookers.

I am absolutely certain that D-C does not plan to abandon us. Patience will always remain a virtue. Children are impatient; adults find ways of making things occur.

Alice
 

DSR207

Enthusiast
Joined
Feb 7, 2005
Posts
1,214
Reaction score
0
Location
Gulfport, MS
QUOTE :
"I am absolutely certain that D-C does not plan to abandon us. Patience will always remain a virtue. <font color="red">Children are impatient; adults find ways of making things occur"
</font>

:2tu: :2tu: :2tu:
 

quick2tr

Enthusiast
Joined
Aug 24, 2004
Posts
143
Reaction score
0
Location
Illinois
I went to the Chicago auto show on Sunday to see the Viper coupe and the C6-Z06. There was a crowd at both cars, but more at the Z06. The Z06 was up on a spinning stand with 2 girls doing a non-stop presentation loaded with performance stats. The Viper coupe was on the floor like ordinary cars, no presentation but very approachable. Agreed that Dodge did not make the same effort as GM promoting their new coupe. However I remain optimistic that Dodge is still supporting the Viper.

Now that I have seen the coupe in person here is my impression:

I immediately noticed that the rear wheels do not have an enormous gap from the fender (something earlier pictures portrayed). The dimensions and ride-height are proportioned correctly. In my opinion, the bubble roof does not flow with the newer body style. The back looks good, solid and tough looking.

And the power issue:

I would be fine with Dodge sticking with the same 500hp engine as long as they start offering mature dealer installable performance upgrade packages. Using the same approach the SRT-4 (aka "skittle") is really establishing a reputation with their latest DC Stage III performance upgrade kit on the streets/strip.
 

Joseph Houss

Former VCA National President
VCA Officer
Joined
Jul 19, 2000
Posts
3,330
Reaction score
0
Location
NJ USA
Chris is right on the money..... except for one item ....

I'll keep you in suspense for now! ;)

My prediction: The Firepower will be released as a Chrysler sports car to compete with the entry level Vette. The Viper will be reinvented and moved up market with a more exotic style (much), more horsepower (much), and a basket of improvements including weight reduction, traction control, etc. And a $100,000.00 price tag.

In a nutshell, the Viper will attempt a Ford GT approach and give up the short-lived and poorly planned Corvette approach. Just my opinion.
 

Y2K5SRT

Enthusiast
Joined
Apr 26, 1999
Posts
7,891
Reaction score
0
Location
Overland Park, KS
Chris is right on the money..... except for one item ....

I'll keep you in suspense for now! ;)

Hmmmm..... (!) I hope that where I missed the mark is on the price. Otherwise it would certainly be a plan I would embrace with open arms.

For those that are worried about the German influence (Mercedes), be sure to check the latest financials on DC and who is carrying the company: Chrysler (Dodge, etc.). Mercedes is LOSING money. Say what you like about the Germans (and I am one by heritage), but they are not stupid. I suspect they will support the money-making platform VERY strongly, including the Viper.
 

Bill Pemberton Woodhouse

VCA Member
Supporting Vendor
Joined
Jul 25, 2000
Posts
5,212
Reaction score
6
Location
Blair,Nebraska,USA
Chris is right, Chris is wrong, and Chris is right again.

DC is making money. I don't believe the Viper will go to the 100K price. The Germans approved one car immmediately upon the merger, and it was the Viper. They see it in a better light than we sometimes do -- the marque car for the entire US Division, and a vehicle that is deeply admired and revered on the European Stage.

The impact of the Firepower as a alternative to the Standard Vette, with a price tag of 50K or so, would be HUGE!! The use of the chassis, along with sharing the motor with the SRT-10 Ram trucks, shows forward thinking about our baby, not the demise.
 

quick2tr

Enthusiast
Joined
Aug 24, 2004
Posts
143
Reaction score
0
Location
Illinois
The Z06 was up on a spinning stand with 2 girls doing a non-stop presentation

Makes sense. It's the only way I would have bothered looking at another Vette.

Actually I made a mistake about the spinning part, it was elevated. Ford had spinning displays (and the highest energy/spectators).
 
Top