SRT, GTS or TA for street and track use... better brakes vs more comfort?

[Bruce H.]

Looking for some insight from those who track their current Vipers, and plan to track their new Gen V. The Motor Trend's initial Viper vs ZR1 testing at Laguna Seca had Randy Pobst commenting on the limitations of the stock brakes on the SRT and GTS (Stop Tech rotors), among other things. When they returned he found the cars much improved, but no comment on brakes, which I assume hadn't been changed anyways. He did however rave about the Track Attack model with the new Brembo rotors, and the whole car obviously performed extremely well.

I want to make sure that I order a Gen V that has brakes that are strong enough to handle 30 min track run sessions when driven aggressively on a track that is pretty ******* brakes. My home track is Mosport, and for comparison, I'd say it's not quite as demanding as Road Atlanta's T10a downhill brake zone and probably about the same as VIR's T1 brake zone. I'd like to be able to track it with either stock pads or a streetable track pad. I also want to be able to run the stock tires, either the P Zeros or Corsas, and don't want to swap pads and wheels for my track days any more.

Where the TA is obviously a great choice for brakes, I'd prefer to have some of the additional GTS features and more luxurious interior. Once you SRT and GTS guys who have one arriving soon get them on the track you will know for sure, but what is your sense based on experience with previous Viper brakes? While I wouldn't push as hard as a professional race driver trying to set a record, I am quite experienced and do threshold brake. I would not want to go the BBK route, but rather buy the model with brakes to match this sort of use. Two cars I track fade a bit with stock brakes, which I manage, and another has strong fade-free brakes but warped the rotors after 3 outings. What are Viper brakes like?

Bruce

 

[kdaviper]

If you want better braking performance, you can always get a hose for the front brakes. instead of dumping air into the wheel well, the hose directs air directly into the center of the brakes.

 

[Bruce H.]

If you want better braking performance, you can always get a hose for the front brakes. instead of dumping air into the wheel well, the hose directs air directly into the center of the brakes.

I have done that before. Is that a typical Viper mod that is required, or more of a general suggestion?

 

[Bill Pemberton Woodhouse]

Randy is a talented driver, but I still question the brake issue a bit. Never had my ACR brakes go ( wonderful Stoptech rotors ) and I hammer hard when on the track. Viper brakes , to me, can have a really strong pedal and after some hard laps it gets a bit softer, but then it seems to stay about there. I still kind of wonder if that was what Randy may have felt and that just didn't instill confidence for him? Just a guess, but I would say go for your comfort and don't worry about the brakes -- Stoptechs are fantastic. One of the other items is that with alot of the folks writing about the new Gen V , there are plenty of comments about how great the brakes are. Sure it could be one instance, but gut instinct tells me the brakes will be solid and more than sufficient for what you want.

The ride is fantastic in the GTS, but then I thought the SRT was an improvement over prior models also. Great bunch of Viper owners in Canada and with Chrysler the number one make in the Provinces , you will definitely garner more than your share of admiration!!

 

[Bruce H.]

Thank you Bill. Do you know if the brakes on the 3 models are the same except for the actual rotors?

 

[Paul Hawker]

I thought I read that the TA car came with THICKER pads. More for endurance racing, but also capable of handling more heat.

Maybe this was also part of the solution. Rarely see a racer who says their brakes could not use some improvement, even the ceramic guys want better brake feel.

Maybe we can get some feedback from the NARRA guys. They hammer those brakes more than most...

 

[kdaviper]

I have done that before. Is that a typical Viper mod that is required, or more of a general suggestion?

It should be for the Gen V. there's already a duct with a lip on it ready for the hose in the front fender well. The brake ducts are just dumping air into the wheel housing itself without it. surprised they haven't released a hose as a Mopar accessory...
Just seems like the simplest thing one could do to improve braking performance without having to sacrifice streetability.

 

[Mister Viper]

Randy is a talented driver, but I still question the brake issue a bit. Never had my ACR brakes go ( wonderful Stoptech rotors ) and I hammer hard when on the track. Viper brakes , to me, can have a really strong pedal and after some hard laps it gets a bit softer, but then it seems to stay about there. I still kind of wonder if that was what Randy may have felt and that just didn't instill confidence for him? Just a guess, but I would say go for your comfort and don't worry about the brakes -- Stoptechs are fantastic. One of the other items is that with alot of the folks writing about the new Gen V , there are plenty of comments about how great the brakes are. Sure it could be one instance, but gut instinct tells me the brakes will be solid and more than sufficient for what you want.

Thanks for weighing in on this Bill. Your perspective as an experienced track driver adds credibility (and truth) to the story. What MotorTrend didn't tell you, by the way, was that the ZR1 boiled it's brake fluid during their earlier comparison test, and suffered significant brake fade as well. Journalistic oversight, apparently. Seriously.

As you suggest, a driver's perception of how a braking system 'performs' depends tremendously on how we are using it. The StopTech rotor kit provides a great lightweight, high performance, and very affordable brake kit with outstanding stopping ability. Randy Pobst was very impressed with the stopping power of the StopTech package in the 2013 Track Pack. He found himself often braking too early. These brakes also performed very well in the Viper 24-hour Endurance Racing Test at Nelson Ledges last autumn, averaging over 100mph (1200+ laps) on a very rough track with no issues. For a typical street driver, or occasional Track Day driver, the StopTech rotor is your package.

But, if you are truly an extreme user (and very few of us are), you will note moderate fade over a long haul on a road racing course with the StopTechs. The brakes NEVER, EVER go away, but they will fade. This means you can ALWAYS pull an ABS limit braking stop, but you will have to push a little harder on the pedal. The new for 2014 TA uses a heavier rotor package evolved from the ACR-X development, and for very extreme users, it will reduce this fade. But it also weighs more, so the car is carrying more rotating and unsprung inertia. Due in part to the brakes, the TA weighs about 50 lbs more than a 2013 track pack SRT.

Just the facts (and thanks for listening).

 

[bluestreak]

Change your pads to racing ones that won't transmit as much heat to the fluid, then change your fluid to SRF or Endless, and maybe add some brake cooling ducts. This is a reasonable modification for ANY factory bought performance car that will be tracked hard. Do this and you won't have any issues.