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The Quest for 250 plus MPH

Discussion in 'General Viper Discussion' started by FST SNAKE, Sep 25, 2019.

  1. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    So I have been working toward building a Viper capable of breaking 250 MPH for some time now. I've had success with my Gen 4 convertible topping 235 MPH in the past and felt like the aero etc on a coupe was capable of higher speeds so on October 26 I will make an attempt at what would be a new speed record for a Viper. As I understand it the top speed in any distance any Viper has ever done was 246.742mph out at Bonneville Salt Flats. I know some monster Vipers have posted big numbers in half miles and mile events but I am more interested in speed vs the distance. I calculate it will take from 1.25 to 1.5 miles to get Blucifer ( a 2006 coupe ) past 250 MPH. The car is being prepped now by Jamie Kwiatek over in Lakeland FL. He's done some major modifications to the entire car from a custom built cage to numerous mechanical changes. The car is a twin turbo, heavily modified 522 CI G3 engine. There's probably not a stock mechanical component left besides the block and differential housing. Attached are a few pics of some of the progress and I will update as the build moves along. 2006 Viper 1.jpg Bulkhead Flange.jpg Roll Cage Welds.jpg Cage Paint 5.jpg
     
  2. MoparMap

    MoparMap VCA National President

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    That car is gorgeous. That's the not factory blue, is it? Looks like it's got some more candy on it or something.
     
  3. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Thanks but it is GTS Blue with silver stripes, it's probably the shop lights that make the color look so different.
     
  4. diamond head

    diamond head Enthusiast

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    That's a beautiful car. Do you have any videos of the previous runs?
     
  5. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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  6. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Top is installed back on the car. Coming together and will be either a 250 MPH Viper by this time a month from now or we will be looking for the next date to make another attempt.
    2006 Viper Top Installed 1.jpg 2006 Viper Top Installed 2.jpg
     
  7. Daniel SRT-10

    Daniel SRT-10 Enthusiast

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    I am vary interested to know if the aerodynamics of the exterior have been changed to go that fast, I’ve only been to 180MPG, it still had allot more left at 180 but I could tell the headers were about to glow red hot, but the water and oil temp were rock steady at 210F. I’m not sure if the car would catch on fire but I wasn’t taking any chances. Cooling system has a triple pass radiator so I know that’s not going to be an issue. What are your thoughts? I have a full Belanger exhaust by the way.
     
  8. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    We do some minor changes for better aero such as fog lamps are covered, all seams are taped off with helicopter tape, mirrors and wipers removed, we lower the car overall but the nose is lowered more than rear, that keeps a little more rake in the car as anything over 200 tends to push the rear of the car down to the point the tires will rub the wheel wells, the belly pan is one piece with no openings and we carry it all the way to the nose, the diffuser is modified and has more strakes that carry past rear bumper. This one always gets people as they never seem to believe it but we wax the car with a hydrophobic wax, it can make maybe 2 mph or more difference at the big end. There are other minor changes but that's the ones that help the most. As to temperature I'm only at WOT running thru the gears for about 41 seconds so I don't see a huge change in gauge temperatures although I'm sure the turbos/exhaust are glowing by the end of the run.
     
  9. nautoncall

    nautoncall Enthusiast

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    Updates please!!!
     
  10. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Updates: The attempt was scheduled for Oct 26th originally and after we got our badges to get on facility on the 25th we got a call cancelling the 26th and moving the date to Sunday the 27th which was better since it was suppose to rain Saturday anyway. That didn't last long as they called and cancelled Sunday shortly after that, they don't give any reasons, the next open date was Dec 7th. It turned out that some unmanned space plane which had been in orbit for about 2 years landed early Sunday, which explains why we got cancelled. I did go up to Wanna Go Fast in Ocala FL to do some shakedown runs and work out any issues. We loaded up and went there on Oct 20th. Our main purpose was to do a few shakedown runs, make sure all the changes didn't cause any issues. I just expected to maybe do a few 150 MPH passes as I didn't want to take any chance of breaking something before our 250 MPH attempt. We unloaded the car about 11 and got in line, I got a friend in a SC Camaro to stage beside me with the understanding he would leave first so if I got loose I would be behind him. I leave the line and it doesn't take long to realize I have no traction control, car is just spinning tires, I go to second, more of the same and that went on for 2 more gears. I think that run ended up at 173 MPH. Back to the trailer and we all are discussing what is wrong. We look at the traction control switch and realize it's in the off position and back I go for the second run with it switched on. This was going to be a 190-200 MPH run except for the fact it was a repeat of the first run, so we learned it's something else besides the switch. I think that run was 177 or so. At this point I'm second in manual class and 1.48 MPH out of first. I decide while the experts are discussing what is wrong I will go back out and run some more. It's actually a little fun to have a car on the edge, kind of forces you to drive it a little bit. I turn the HP down, go to position 3 in the tune and run a 183+ with the car still spinning as I crossed the line. That put's me in 1st of 32 cars. I decide if position 3 is faster than maybe position 2 is better with even less HP so I switch and go again. Turns out position 2 is set up for 93 and I'm running C16, it pulls a lot of timing and although the car spins less it also is slower. That run was my slowest of the day at 164. So what we learned from the day was we have to fix that traction control issue, everything else worked great, and the driver has little if any control of that right foot. I'm so use to NA and progressive nitrous cars which are very linear/predictable and this car is about as far from that as they come. I think once the traction control system is back and we program in some boost by speed I will not have any issues taking it to big speeds. AT this time we are just taking our time and going over every aspect of the car from tires to parachute and making sure it's ready. I'm putting it back on the dyno to do some more tuning adjustments at Larry Macedo's shop over the weekend. Then spend more time going thru every nut and bolt on the car, maybe do some normal every day street driving just to loosen up the new gears in transmission. If there are no mechanical issues on Dec 7th I should be able to break 250 hopefully. I will keep you advised of what happens.
     
  11. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Here is a video from Wanna Go Fast in Ocala of my first run ( 177 MPH I think ), I definitely didn't know what to expect and I'm sure my lack of finesse shows. The clutch is a quad carbon and very much like a light switch, either on or off and no in-between, then add the boost on top of that which is also similar to the clutch, on or off and when it's on it's amazing how quickly it produces big power. I'm in and out of the throttle constantly trying to keep it moving straight and also forward but not overly successful with either. One thing I'm convinced of is that once all those issues are resolved this thing will be brutal.


    20191020_115715_1.mp4
     
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  12. steve e

    steve e Enthusiast

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    Very cool please keep us posted
     
  13. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Had the car on Larry Macedo's dyno on Saturday and he has started making tuning adjustments. At 15 lbs of boost it made 1027 HP, at 16 lbs of boost it was 1097 HP, we need to work it thru the 5 positions eventually have the top position at approx. 22 lbs of boost. We still need to fine tune the AFR as the car is running very rich but that will come as we get the boost levels set. I don't really need huge amount of HP/torque as I'm not trying to break 250 in half mile or even 1 mile distance. I have 2.3 miles if I need it but if it goes as planned I should only need 1.25 to 1.5 miles at the most. I expect anything north of 1300 to 1350 RWHP will be enough to get the car past 250 with the weight, aero, gears, differential and tires we are running with, at 22 lbs of boost we should make more than that. Less than 3 weeks to go, I'm hoping it all goes as planned and I don't have to go back for round 2 at some later date.
     
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  14. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Well we are down to 4 days before we have to load up trailer sometime Thursday so on Friday we can get our badges, get the car thru tech inspection and do our prep work at the runway. We have multiple tunes in the car, each a little more aggressive than the previous one. We set up the boost by speed from zero to 240 MPH and increased it based on where each gear tops out. What we have left to do in next few days to fine tune the traction control, install scramble boost button ( my just in case I'm at 249 and the timing lights are coming up ), install a body pan under the engine with oil absorbent pads ( this is just in case engine goes boom ) to keep oil from reaching the rear tires...……….I really hope this was a total waste of time, fasten the fire suppression lines to the cage, mount the revised diffuser, mount the new shift light, remove the wipers/mirrors, pack the chute and then wash/wax it because anything that makes the car slicker makes it faster. After that it's loaded up, along with all the C16, generator, fans, spare parts and tires etc. Once Saturday arrives we will run the half mile, maybe a few times to gather data, I won't push the car hard at all, maybe a 190 MPH run as the whole goal here to break 250 and I won't risk breaking the car in a distance I know it can't reach 250. After the half mile runs are over we will set up for the mile and make a few passes again probably just gathering data in various tunes. I will probably run it hard in at least 1 of the mile runs but I suspect in reality I need 1.25 miles min to make the 250 MPH. After the day is over I will post an update, hopefully that we set the record but good, bad or ugly I will let you know. We will have a lot of pics and videos of the runs and will post those as the editing is completed. This has been a long time in the making and lots of people put some serious effort into making this attempt possible. I hope it all comes together and by late afternoon Dec 7th we have reached our goal.
     
  15. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    I'm sorry to report that Dec 7th just wasn't our day to do 250+. A few seconds into the half mile shakedown I knew something was going wrong as the car wasn't making the power it should have. I'm not the most knowledgeable on tuning or those magic voodoo boxes that make all the decisions for the car but from what I understand the new tune and the old firmware didn't merge properly. It's tough for all of us who spent better part of the year prepping the car for this one moment only to have it fall apart on the day of but we will regroup, make a plan, come back and bring a better effort to the game. It's not suppose to be easy so I expected some obstacles along the way. This will give us some more time to prep, maybe make a few more mods we didn't get to the first time around. I will keep posting the progress and let you all know what happens at the next attempt. I will say it may not have been fast but even sitting still it looks fast, lol. Dec 7th 2019.jpg
     
  16. MoparMap

    MoparMap VCA National President

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    That's unfortunate, though at least you didn't blow something up. A lot nicer when you don't have to replace parts, only code.
     
  17. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Very true, we will fix the issue and be back out there with a fresh attitude and a working tune. I will get it to 250 plus MPH at some point.
     
  18. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Today it's official.......252.588 MPH
     
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  19. ViperJeff

    ViperJeff VCA Legacy Member - UT/AZ Staff Member

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    Congratulations
     
  20. JANEY

    JANEY VCA Member-Director MW Zone & Great Lakes Region Venom Member

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    Congratulations!
     
  21. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Thanks Viper Jeff and Janey, it was a big goal of mine and I am still on a high days later. I will take some time soon and write up how the day went and post it.
     
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  22. steve e

    steve e Enthusiast

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    That is awesome.
     
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  23. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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  24. MoparMap

    MoparMap VCA National President

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    Very cool. Glad everything finally worked out for you!
     
  25. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    It took a lot of support from a lot of people and I definately give them all the credit. I feel like I had the easy job, push the pedal down and steer straight. I appreciate all the support from you guys also and looking forward to seeing what comes next. David
     
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  26. WHY U TRY

    WHY U TRY Enthusiast

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    That's amazing. That 100-200mph range is lightning fast.

    Congrats!
     
  27. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Thought I would take some time to explain the day and how we managed to get Blucifer over the 250 number. We had spent the day before unloading the car and going thru tech inspection, they spent time reviewing everything from the open long studs, cage, fire suppression etc and even watched as we torqued the lugnuts and checked air pressures in the tires, very in depth inspection but I completely understand the need for it. After that we checked all fluids and started taping up the seams on the car, mirrors and wipers removed already. Alpha checked and double checked all the various tunes and made some adjustments as Jamie and Dillon went over the mechanical aspects of the car. Once all that work was done we loaded the car back in the trailer and headed to dinner and got some rest for the big day to come. We were up early on Saturday and headed over to the runway even before the sun had come up. Got the car unloaded and once again started going over the tune and mechanical components getting ready for our chance to see what Blucifer was capable of. I have this tradition of putting M&Ms in the console of every Viper I have raced and this one wasn’t any exception as 3 bags of peanut butter M&Ms are in there still. At some point I will eat my 250 MPH M&Ms just like I did my 200 and 235 ones. Johnny Bohmer’s crew is getting things organized for us to head out on runway, pictures taken, videos done, safety briefing and introductions of his team members and safety crew. We eventually get onto the runway and Johnny Bohmer takes everyone thru a low speed trip down the runway to show us the ropes and explain how it all will work. After that we have driver’s meeting and start to set up for the half mile shakedown runs. IMRA ( International Mile Racing Association ) is handling the timing/speed for the event and they are set up at half mile already. I get suited up for the run which is a job to get all that gear on and then crawl into the cage and get strapped in, but I’m big on safety and push it on everyone I talk to, spend the money first on safety and then next on making the car fast. Strapped in so tight it actually hurts a little bit along with HANs, helmet, fire suit, shoes, gloves etc. but that’s the way it should be. First run of the day and I plan on just an easy run, half mile isn’t what we are there for and I don’t want to break anything. On the line, easy launch and row thru a few gears, timing lights come quick in a half mile and first run was 174.168 MPH. Not bad, car felt solid although Alpha showed me afterwards that the clutch was slipping and that we needed to get some heat in it. More adjustments to the tune and decided to heat clutch up with a quick burn out. I switched off the traction control, went out a few car lengths to get away from others and forgot that this car has a lot more power than my orange Viper, WOT and nano seconds later I’m finishing that circle that I never planned, was a bit embarrassed but back to line. Second half mile was slightly better and clutch felt better, ran a 177.329 so we were done in half mile and were moving to 1 mile. Again I don’t want to break anything as I calculated I need 1.25 to 1.5 miles to break 250 I don’t want to lean on the car too hard in the mile. I launch it like grandma going to the grocery store, row thru the gears and the car does an easy 228.414 MPH run. Alpha checks data and this is where we started having some issues and honestly we were concerned for our chances to make any bigger numbers. I won’t get into the problems as we were doing some experimenting and want to keep that to ourselves for now. We were unable to run another mile and started prepping for the 2.3 mile runs, I want to give Alpha, Jamie and Dillon credit for jumping on the issues and doing everything possible to allow me to run some more. I line up for 2.3 mile run and I know I’m now going to have to time the moment I go WOT as the car will reach top speed well before the timing lights if I just jump on it from starting line. I roll out to that point that I’ve decided in my head is the GO moment and run hard to the timing lights. Car hits 248.077 which is new world record for a Viper, I’m super excited but also realize I screwed up, mistimed that run badly and we have a car that isn’t 100% so every run could be our last for the day. Another hour plus and we go back to the line for our last run at 2.3 miles as they are moving to 2.7 afterwards. Same plan in my head except I’ve picked a new point on the runway to go WOT. Everything goes as planned except for the fact the run is slower than the previous run at 246. 372 MPH, and I’m thinking that may have been our last run of the day. I’m really bummed about it but the guys are still working on the car trying to get ready for one more. Alpha checks data and learns we did that run on pos 1, lowest HP/torque and the 93 tune, we are running C16. Turns out the driver was to blame, I turned the can bus display mounted off the windshield and with my gloves on I didn’t feel the switch turning as I did that. I’m starting to feel like this isn’t going to happen today with everything going on between the car and the driver. No one is giving up, those guys are steady working on the car determined to get it back out there for a big number. Minutes, hours click by and they keep after it, never giving up. It’s getting late in the day, we have to be off the runway at 5 pm at the latest. It’s 4:30 and we decide to make one last attempt, I get strapped in, get the car over to the starter, line up, GO………….and I leave, first gear and car is breaking up, go to 2nd and more of the same, $%#*%@ I feel crushed as I make a quick left turn and roll back to the start, our last chance just went away. Alpha quickly plugs in to that magic box, some keystrokes, and says ok go. Now I’m back on line, it’s like 4:50, lol nothing like a little pressure. I’ve been here before, I generally don’t get worked up or panic cause I know that doesn’t help but this is my last run so I do feel some. Johnny Bohmer walks up, last minute advice from him which I listen to everything he says, he knows his stuff, quick fist bump, he walks out a little ways and turns around and not sure why I even did it, not like I had any confidence in what was about to happen but I lift my left hand up and hold up 2 fingers, then 5 fingers and then 2 again…..I see him grin, thumbs up. I roll up windows, drop my face shield, thumbs up to starter and it’s on…………I ease out, I know where I need to get on it and I do. I quickly run the gears and I’m watching the tach, oil pressure, speed on the GPS and mostly over the hood. I see the speed climbing quickly and I’m really feeling good about this run. Car is feeling solid…..200 turns into 210…..220……..230……..240 and I feel it beginning to struggle a little bit but it’s still creeping up…….245……..finally 250! I’m sure I’ve got a smile ear to ear at that point and I see it settle in at 252.5 on the GPS. At this point I realize I can't see the timing light cones/flags and my car is going static. I know if I lift any at all I will never get it back so I decide to stay in it. It never drops below that 252.5 and that segment of the run feels like it lasted forever, we later calculate it was at 252.5 MPH for .77 miles. I finally see the cones, I know now I’m going to make it, I cross the first timing light, then second one and it’s hard on the brakes. Now my concern is stopping it, I’m running stock Viper calipers/rotors and Racetech pads. I move toward right half of runway and am just standing on the brakes, the car is slowing but not fast enough for me. I downshift a gear and then another trying to help slow the car. The last bit of the runway the brakes lock up and all four tires are making that noise that actually sounds really good in that moment. I get it stopped, window down, arm out and thumbs up so safety crew knows all is good. I get over to taxi/travel lanes and I head back to starting line. I already think I broke 250 but you never know how accurate the GPS is. Everyone is heading over as I approach, I’m sitting in the car as they tell me the number…….252.588 MPH………I don’t know how to describe the moment so I’m not going to try. It’s been over a week and I’m still not sure how, but I do know this never would have happened without the support from my wife, family and the entire crew involved in this experiment. I appreciate everyone’s support on this and hope you guys enjoyed it as much as I did. Now I have learned that my wife does read the posts on the forum so no one mention what comes after 250………….
     
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  28. Mollin

    Mollin Enthusiast

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    That is awesome .Congratulations on 250 plus MPH.Don't know who built your cage for you but as an old TIG, MIG, and SMAW welder i can tell you they did one beautiful job fitting and welding it.
     
  29. David McSeveny

    David McSeveny Enthusiast

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    Awesome effort
    Well done
     
  30. FST SNAKE

    FST SNAKE VCA Venom Member Venom Member

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    Thank you and the cage was built over in Lakeland FL by Jamie Kwiatek, I have had so many people comment on that cage, he does amazing work.
     

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