Gen 4 engine upgrade for Gen 3?

[jimsmyth1]

Did I hear correctly at VOI that there was or was going to be an upgrade available that essentially made a Gen 4 engine out of your Gen 3?

 

[alpine7822]

Where do I sign up for that? I asked the guys at CAAP when there if the Gen 3 would support a Gen 4 engine...they said the only physical change to the body was the hood so it would accommodate the new engine...so I'm guessing with a Gen 4 hood, you could do it.

 

[Fast1]

Yeah, I think the KIT includes new piston return springs and reverse chrome muffler bearings!!!!!!
Seriously now, a kit to upgrade the GEN 3 motor would have an instruction list like this......

1. Disconnect battery
2. Remove GEN 3 motor and wiring harness
3. Install supplied GEN 4 motor and wiring harness
4. Connect battery

Now I may get a little egg on my face for this one, but I believe that the block and everything is different so there is no way that a KIT can be made for it. The cam-in cam setup has to require some specific oil cavities and machining and the controls and sensors are all different. I am going out on a limb here and saying that.......um......there will never be a KIT to upgrade a GEN 3 to a GEN 4 motor.

 

[1BADGTS]

I believe the short block assembly is the same ,EVERYTHING from the heads up is different including the computer and of coarse drive by wire.

 

[Shandon]

Yeah, I think the KIT includes new piston return springs and reverse chrome muffler bearings!!!!!!
Seriously now, a kit to upgrade the GEN 3 motor would have an instruction list like this......

1. Disconnect battery
2. Remove GEN 3 motor and wiring harness
3. Install supplied GEN 4 motor and wiring harness
4. Connect battery

Now I may get a little egg on my face for this one, but I believe that the block and everything is different so there is no way that a KIT can be made for it. The cam-in cam setup has to require some specific oil cavities and machining and the controls and sensors are all different. I am going out on a limb here and saying that.......um......there will never be a KIT to upgrade a GEN 3 to a GEN 4 motor.

Yes there is a kit! . It is an upgrade that will take your Gen3 ABOVE a Gen 4. They (Arrow)are showing 625-650 or more HP. The Kit includes the new Gen 4 heads with the correct bolt pattern to fit Gen 3. Also a new Air intake plennum to fit the heads using the current throttle body. The power of the Gen4 comes from the heads, they flow like a mother! There are a few other things in the kit but no major engine rebuild stuff or anything. Now with this Kit comes a price try $14,000.00 clams! Now unless you are avid about staying NA I think a supercharger is a better option IMHO at that proce. Now if it comes down I would be interested.

Ask John B. about it. I got the brochure from him on it

 

[jimsmyth1]

"Yes there is a kit! . It is an upgrade that will take your Gen3 ABOVE a Gen 4. They (Arrow)are showing 625-650 or more HP. The Kit includes the new Gen 4 heads with the correct bolt pattern to fit Gen 3. Also a new Air intake plennum to fit the heads using the current throttle body. The power of the Gen4 comes from the heads, they flow like a mother! There are a few other things in the kit but no major engine rebuild stuff or anything. Now with this Kit comes a price try $14,000.00 clams! Now unless you are avid about staying NA I think a supercharger is a better option IMHO at that proce. Now if it comes down I would be interested."

Thanks for the info. I'm in no hurry as I just shelled out about $20,000 for Street Serpent package and a few other goodies but who knows, maybe Santa will bring me something.

 

[Shandon]

"Yes there is a kit! . It is an upgrade that will take your Gen3 ABOVE a Gen 4. They (Arrow)are showing 625-650 or more HP. The Kit includes the new Gen 4 heads with the correct bolt pattern to fit Gen 3. Also a new Air intake plennum to fit the heads using the current throttle body. The power of the Gen4 comes from the heads, they flow like a mother! There are a few other things in the kit but no major engine rebuild stuff or anything. Now with this Kit comes a price try $14,000.00 clams! Now unless you are avid about staying NA I think a supercharger is a better option IMHO at that proce. Now if it comes down I would be interested."

Thanks for the info. I'm in no hurry as I just shelled out about $20,000 for Street Serpent package and a few other goodies but who knows, maybe Santa will bring me something.

I think if you are a good boy like me Santa will have a new name "Sean Clause" that is Sean Roe and his twin screw supercharger for the Gen3. Yup thats all I want for Christmas this year come on Mr. Clause

 

[RTTTTed]

Gen 4 uses a different bore and stroke. They were changed to use the SRT connecting rods and pistons in the Viper engine. The MP performance intake has an extra 20hp for the Gen 4 and is supposed to come on the 09s.

Ted

 

[Nader]

Shandon is right - In one of the recent Engineer forums someoone asked this very question. Their response was their was a Mopar kit in the works to match the 04 heads to the 03 engine.

 

[1fastviper]

Id buy them But for that price forget it.

 

[gb66gth]

Don't forget the swing arm oil pick-up on the Gen IV

 

[1BADGTS]

Gen 4 uses a different bore and stroke. They were changed to use the SRT connecting rods and pistons in the Viper engine. The MP performance intake has an extra 20hp for the Gen 4 and is supposed to come on the 09s.

Ted

It is not supposed to come on the 09s.There is ABSOLUTELY NO horsepower differences between an 08 and an 09 (to do this would require the engine to be recertifyed and that costs millions of dollars )The part,parts you keep referring (other posts as well )MAY be available(sold over the counter) soon and are strictly to be installed by the customer.The installation of such parts MAY also void the factory warranty.

 

[hightest]

Don't forget the new variable timing camshaft that creates a much more linear torque curve!

 

[pteam]

Either go out and buy an 08 (theyre getting kinda cheap) or supercharge your car (700-800 hp, who needs a measly 600?)

 

[RTTTTed]

Basic Roe 5psi will dyno about 550rwhp or over 600hp. Torque will be much higher than the 08s. BUT the 08s and 09s are new with better trans, clutches and posi unit.

Advantages either way.

Ted

 

[1BADGTS]

The reason i went with an 08 rather than supercharging my 06 was i wanted a full warranty if somethinhg happened and no matter how much you spend on aftermarket items you NEVER get a dollar of it back on resale.(Book value has no add on for customer power adders .If the customer goes out and spends 15 grand on a blower their car is worth no more than a totallty stock car.)

 

[Shandon]

Basic Roe 5psi will dyno about 550rwhp or over 600hp. Torque will be much higher than the 08s. BUT the 08s and 09s are new with better trans, clutches and posi unit.

Advantages either way.

Ted

The Gen3 Roe Charger is putting 600+ to the wheels from Roes debute at VOI. Im not sure about the 08 clutch being better. So far all I have heard is that its easier on the left foot but they seem inclined to burning easy from what im seeing on the forum here? Trans is stronger for sure. I think buying this upgrade is more for people with a real desire to stay NA and get some good power. Its just hard to justify the $$ per HP when compared to other mods.

 

[Shandon]

The reason i went with an 08 rather than supercharging my 06 was i wanted a full warranty if somethinhg happened and no matter how much you spend on aftermarket items you NEVER get a dollar of it back on resale.(Book value has no add on for customer power adders .If the customer goes out and spends 15 grand on a blower their car is worth no more than a totallty stock car.)

Truth... but mod the hell out of em anyway

 

[jimsmyth1]

Lots of great advice! Of course now I'm more confused than ever!

 

[michaelnouri]

what about a gen 4 drop out motor from a wrecked 08, 12k
sell your old motor for 8500.00

 

[1BADGTS]

what about a gen 4 drop out motor from a wrecked 08, 12k
sell your old motor for 8500.00

Better off buying a used 08 (if you shop you can find nice low mile ones mid-upper 60s )than go true that hassle.(not to mention you get a warranty and all the other improvements as well)

 

[Viper X]

As mentioned above, Arrow Racing has made a kit to bring the Gen III engine up to and above the 2008 / 09 stock power levels.

We visited Arrow while at VOI 10 and saw their design mule engine along with Dyno numbers. Very nice kit - not sure the price is 14K - maybe through Mopar but certainly not directly from Arrow.

Dan