stainless steel brake lines

[Matrix]

Did anybody know, where I can get stainles steel flex brakeline kits for my viper?

 

[rcl4668]

Did anybody know, where I can get stainles steel flex brakeline kits for my viper?

Stoptech makes stainless steel brake lines for the 2003-2008 Vipers. I am fairly certain others do as well.

/Rich

 

[Fast Too]

I just installed Stoptech SS lines on my 06. I got them from Jon B. at Parts Rack. A word of caution or rather advise. The lines do not come with install instructions but it is very straight forward to install. There are no instructions available on Stoptech's site either for a gen 3. However the gen 2 instructions are available on their site and worked good as an overall guide especially for securing the ABS line on the fronts. The other thing I found is that the lines in the kit for the front are labeled backwards. In other words the line labled left was actually the right and visa versa. The rears were labled correct. I informed Stoptech about this, I don't know if it was just my kit or is an error in all gen 3 front kits. They are going to look into it and correct as necessary. I also had to reshape the securing bracket for the right front to get the hard line fitting to even come close to lining up with the SS line fitting. Other than those quirks to the install it was very simple. I'd also recommend speedbleeders if your going to replace your lines. They made bleeding the system after line replacement very easy and quick. The speedbleeders are available in either zinc plated or SS. I chose SS but they are twice the cost of the zinc plated ones. 15.00 each vice 7.00. Daves Big brakes has those, or you can get them directly from speedbleeder. Prices are the same from either source. Good luck.

 

[Nader]

I just installed Stoptech SS lines on my 06. I got them from Jon B. at Parts Rack. A word of caution or rather advise. The lines do not come with install instructions but it is very straight forward to install. There are no instructions available on Stoptech's site either for a gen 3. However the gen 2 instructions are available on their site and worked good as an overall guide especially for securing the ABS line on the fronts. The other thing I found is that the lines in the kit for the front are labeled backwards. In other words the line labled left was actually the right and visa versa. The rears were labled correct. I informed Stoptech about this, I don't know if it was just my kit or is an error in all gen 3 front kits. They are going to look into it and correct as necessary. I also had to reshape the securing bracket for the right front to get the hard line fitting to even come close to lining up with the SS line fitting. Other than those quirks to the install it was very simple. I'd also recommend speedbleeders if your going to replace your lines. They made bleeding the system after line replacement very easy and quick. The speedbleeders are available in either zinc plated or SS. I chose SS but they are twice the cost of the zinc plated ones. 15.00 each vice 7.00. Daves Big brakes has those, or you can get them directly from speedbleeder. Prices are the same from either source. Good luck.

How do you like the rotor and ss lines? How do the brakes feel now? What about pedal feel?

 

[Fast Too]

How do you like the rotor and ss lines? How do the brakes feel now? What about pedal feel?

Nader,

The brakes feel much more repsonsive. Pedal feel is fantastic with these lines. I did the initial bed in proceedure recommended by stoptech. I installed EBC Red Stuff pads in the upgrade, and their bed in proceedure called for basically babying the breaks for two hundred miles before agressive stopping. Stoptech's proceedure was much more agressive. It consisted of 2 intervals of 10 each 60 to 10 mph agressive brakings with a cool down between each interval. I took the car out again today and the brakes feel very good, no squeaking etc. from the EBC red pads. Something I have heard they are notrious for. Even drove through some stop and go stuff in town, nada a squeak. I'd recommend the upgrade to the SS lines and rotors by stoptech. Pads I think are a matter of preference and intended driving habits. Hope this answers your question.

 

[rcl4668]

Nader,

The brakes feel much more repsonsive. Pedal feel is fantastic with these lines. I did the initial bed in proceedure recommended by stoptech. I installed EBC Red Stuff pads in the upgrade, and their bed in proceedure called for basically babying the breaks for two hundred miles before agressive stopping. Stoptech's proceedure was much more agressive. It consisted of 2 intervals of 10 each 60 to 10 mph agressive brakings with a cool down between each interval. I took the car out again today and the brakes feel very good, no squeaking etc. from the EBC red pads. Something I have heard they are notrious for. Even drove through some stop and go stuff in town, nada a squeak. I'd recommend the upgrade to the SS lines and rotors by stoptech. Pads I think are a matter of preference and intended driving habits. Hope this answers your question.

Fast Too -

I plan on installing the Stoptech 2-piece Aerorotors and ss brake lines on my 08. Do you have a link to the Stoptech bed-in procedure? I couldn't find it on their website. Thanks a bunch.

/Rich

 

[Phoenix SRT]

I thought that the OE SRT brakes (i.e. stopping distance) were some of the best on the planet. Will Stoptech rotors improve stopping distance or fade resistance? If there aren't any tests out there showing the Stoptech rotors perform better on the SRT than OE, why change from OE?

The SS lines make sense, though. Maybe they don't lessen stopping distance, but they make for better pedal feel. I hope, anyway. Mine just arrived from JonB and I plan to install them in the next week or so.

 

[Fast Too]

Fast Too -

I plan on installing the Stoptech 2-piece Aerorotors and ss brake lines on my 08. Do you have a link to the Stoptech bed-in procedure? I couldn't find it on their website. Thanks a bunch.

/Rich

Rich,

Here is the link.

StopTech : Balanced Brake Upgrades

If you don't get the ones coated with the optional anti-corrosion gold zinc coating (as I did) you must first wash the rust inhibitor off. I washed each rotor like three times to be sure it was all off mine. If you do get the ones coated with the optional anti-corrosion gold zinc coating you must wait until that wears off before beginning the bed in proceedure. The hard copy of the bed in proceedure that will be included with the rotors discusses the need for washing etc.

 

[Fast Too]

Rich,

That link didn't come through. Go to Stoptechs site, click on technical information, select white papers, and then hit the link that says "Pad and Rotor Bed-In Theory, Definitions and Procedures NEW"

Hope that helps.

 

[Fast Too]

Phoenix - The OE brakes are good, no question about that. However I have noticed better stopping power (less distance) and responsiveness over the OE's rotors by upgarding to stoptech Aerorotors and SS lines. The stoptech rotors are also significantly lighter and more importantly they dissipate heat much better than the OE rotors by their design.

 

[rcl4668]

Rich,

That link didn't come through. Go to Stoptechs site, click on technical information, select white papers, and then hit the link that says "Pad and Rotor Bed-In Theory, Definitions and Procedures NEW"

Hope that helps.

Thank you. I assume that since I will be sticking with the stock pads (at least for now), that I would be using the less aggressive bed-in procedure (2 sets of 10 stops from 60 to 10 mph)?

Also, I had a question about ordering the zinc anti corrosion coating on the Stoptech rotors. What is the benefit of the coating if it will wear off fairly quickly, especially if used for track days or HPDE events? I called Stoptech and the sales rep said the coating would not be useful for me since (1) I intended to use the rotors at the track and (2) I live in the Pacific NW where we do not really have extensive use of salt on roads. Have you noticed that the corrosion protection has made a difference in the appearance or performance of the rotors? How much more did the coating cost?

Again, thanks for all of your feedback.

/Rich

 

[Fast Too]

Thank you. I assume that since I will be sticking with the stock pads (at least for now), that I would be using the less aggressive bed-in procedure (2 sets of 10 stops from 60 to 10 mph)?

Also, I had a question about ordering the zinc anti corrosion coating on the Stoptech rotors. What is the benefit of the coating if it will wear off fairly quickly, especially if used for track days or HPDE events? I called Stoptech and the sales rep said the coating would not be useful for me since (1) I intended to use the rotors at the track and (2) I live in the Pacific NW where we do not really have extensive use of salt on roads. Have you noticed that the corrosion protection has made a difference in the appearance or performance of the rotors? How much more did the coating cost?

Again, thanks for all of your feedback.

/Rich

Rich,

I think you misunderstood or I poorly communicated it. I did not get the gold zinc anti-corrosion plating. I did not do so for the reason you stated, it wears off so what is the benefit? The regular aerorotors come with a rust inhibitor that must be washed off. The only way you can tell it is gone is when the rotors begin to flash rust. If cleaned properly they resemble how your rotors look immediately following washing your car. When they look like that you have them cleaned properly (rust inhibitor gone) and you can then install them. All that info is in the hard copy sheet that accompanies your new rotors. I did the two sets of 10 as you plan for the bed in. Since your putting these on your 08 the pads should be like new so I don't think you'll have issues sticking to the stock pads other than a lot of dust. Be ready for those babies to smoke at about the 5th hard brake during the first interval of 10. Also don't let your car come to a complete stop with your foot on the pedal while your brakes are very hot or you will imprint significant pad material in one spot, which will lead to vibration due to a high spot created on the rotor. Good luck.

 

[Viper X]

Stainless steel brake lines (from Stoptech via Parts Rack) work very well. Pedal is better and stays better on the track.

FYI, GTS-R Vipers ran brake rotors that were not slotted or drilled and won LeMans three consecutive years. If slotted or drilled brake rotors were better on the track, i.e. dissipated heat better, produced shorter stopping distances and lasted longer, don't you think the folks that developed the GTS-R Vipers would have used them?

While slotted and / or drilled brake rotors look cool, until someone proves that they perform better on the track, I would not spend the dough on these and expect increased brake performance.

Dan

 

[rcl4668]

Rich,

I think you misunderstood or I poorly communicated it. I did not get the gold zinc anti-corrosion plating. I did not do so for the reason you stated, it wears off so what is the benefit? The regular aerorotors come with a rust inhibitor that must be washed off. The only way you can tell it is gone is when the rotors begin to flash rust. If cleaned properly they resemble how your rotors look immediately following washing your car. When they look like that you have them cleaned properly (rust inhibitor gone) and you can then install them. All that info is in the hard copy sheet that accompanies your new rotors. I did the two sets of 10 as you plan for the bed in. Since your putting these on your 08 the pads should be like new so I don't think you'll have issues sticking to the stock pads other than a lot of dust. Be ready for those babies to smoke at about the 5th hard brake during the first interval of 10. Also don't let your car come to a complete stop with your foot on the pedal while your brakes are very hot or you will imprint significant pad material in one spot, which will lead to vibration due to a high spot created on the rotor. Good luck.

Sorry, your previous post was quite clear, I misunderstood. Thanks for the great feedback.

 

[rcl4668]

Stainless steel brake lines (from Stoptech via Parts Rack) work very well. Pedal is better and stays better on the track.

FYI, GTS-R Vipers ran brake rotors that were not slotted or drilled and won LeMans three consecutive years. If slotted or drilled brake rotors were better on the track, i.e. dissipated heat better, produced shorter stopping distances and lasted longer, don't you think the folks that developed the GTS-R Vipers would have used them?

While slotted and / or drilled brake rotors look cool, until someone proves that they perform better on the track, I would not spend the dough on these and expect increased brake performance.

Dan

Having never raced professionally I can't answer this but based on what I have researched online and talking to folks who track cars at the HPDE level, you are quite correct that for track days there will not be a huge performance advantage in terms of braking power of going from the stock Viper brake system (which is excellent esp. for an OEM system) to the Stoptech slotted system.

I am personally going with the Stoptechs for the following reasons: First, the Stoptechs save at least 30 lbs of unsprung mass versus the stock system. Second, while there is not a huge gain, the slotted design of the Stoptechs produces some benefits in terms of allowing the boundary gases on the rotor to be effectively removed from between the pad and the rotor. The only downside to the slotting is that it may result in higher wear on the pad material. I agree that for track days I would avoid cross drilling. There is data that cross drilling while fine for street applications can result in cracking when used for racing or track days.

Finally, regarding the Lemans-winning Vipers, that is interesting. I would be curious to find out what the FIA or ACO regs at the time (1999-2001??) were regarding brake systems. Is it possible that the regs prohibited certain rotor designs and materials (such as slotted, drilled, carbon ceramic etc.)? For example, carbon ceramic rotors can save a lot of weight (10+ lbs per corner) and at that level racing teams would sell their right arm to get that sort of weight advantage. I do know that rotor size and surface area is a major part of the heat dissipation equation but I would imagine that slotting and/or carbon ceramic materials would all be advantages teams would jump at unless they were prevented from doing so by the regulations.

/Rich

 

[Fast Too]

Stainless steel brake lines (from Stoptech via Parts Rack) work very well. Pedal is better and stays better on the track.

FYI, GTS-R Vipers ran brake rotors that were not slotted or drilled and won LeMans three consecutive years. If slotted or drilled brake rotors were better on the track, i.e. dissipated heat better, produced shorter stopping distances and lasted longer, don't you think the folks that developed the GTS-R Vipers would have used them?

While slotted and / or drilled brake rotors look cool, until someone proves that they perform better on the track, I would not spend the dough on these and expect increased brake performance.

Dan

Dan - Thanks for your opinion. Spend your money on the upgrade's that you see will benefit your intended use of your car. I'll do the same. Cheers.

 

[JonB]

Short Versions of why you are all correct:

SS lines give a better pedal feel outright, and it STAYS consistant even when 1100-degree rotors heat the lines. Laps 1, 10, and 30 = same pedal feel. NOT TRU FOR RUBBER LINES. Rubber lines expand, even more at 500f+.... and cause your brake-points to change as they heat. I hate that !

Slotted rotors and their pads PERFORM better in short-venue events ie under 60-minute sessions, like Viper Days, VRL, SCCA, HPDE and club track days. Endurance here is not as critical as .25 sec per lap to Tommy Archer.

Plain rotors and their pads ENDURE better in 4-12-24 hour events like the FIA-GT and ALMS GTS-Rs raced and won almost everything. Endurance was more important than a bit faster stopping power. You dont worry about giving up .25 sec per lap, faster times, if you would have to spend 10+ minutes in a PIT STOP changing brake pads that the slots ate....

 

[mxz900]

Installing the StopTech SS lines on my Gen III. Anyone know the proper way for attaching the front lines to the electrical wire (assume this is speedo line??) that is affixed to the stock lines with plastic clips? Don't want to zip tie to the SS lines as it will eventually wear through it over time. Kit comes with 6 zip ties and rubber grommets, but not sure how to get the rubber grommets on the lines without cutting them.

 

[Viper X]

MXZ900,

Run your zip tie through the hole in the rubber grommet (it's a short section of rubber hose actually), then wrap the pointy end of the zip tie around the brake line and back through the rubber hose. Now, wrap the other end of the zip tie (it should be the pointy end and the gripping end around the plastic ABS sensor line. Insert the pointy end of the zip tie into the "gripping" end of the zip tie and snug it up. This will secure your ABS line to your stainless brake line.

When all three of these have been assembled and installed, check to be sure that neither of your "lines" rub on the tire / wheel when at full lock in either direction.

Then take your car to the track and enjoy!

Dan