Tire age issues??

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dano

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Howdy!

I have been seeing posts about tire issues with age. I have a '97 GTS with original tires and 11k miles.

The tread looks really good but the car has been in dry, cold Denver it's whole life.

I hate to drop a bunch of cash on new tires but I don't like riding on "borrowed time" either.

Replace or wait??

:confused: Thanks!
 

mad0953

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Weird......I have a 97 GTS with original tires and 11K miles too. It spent most of it's life in Phoenix and the rubber is really hard and spins way too easily and I get a ton of wheel hop. I am going to the PartsRack this Spring and pick me up some 18" stock wheels and some new rubber. I think it's a good, safe, idea. :2tu:
 

RoadiJeff

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Wasn't there a thread around here recently from Tire Rack about the dangers of how tires can wear out from age before tread life?

Mine are the original tires on my '99 with 17,000 miles. The tread looks like they could easily go another 10,000 miles before they wear out. Since I average around 2,000 miles/yr that means another 5 years out of them. I probably won't go that long but it will have to wait until I have a spare $1,500 for tires and $2,500 or so for a set of CCW 505 wheels.
 

AviP

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If it is not showing wear and you don't push it, stick with it. New rubber will be a waste. My 97 is at 24K. :eek: I don't track my car or drive crazy like I used to.
 

Chuck 98 RT/10

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Key is what AviP said. If you don't drive crazy you should be ok. The problem with that is why drive a Viper if you aren't going to load some Gs in an on-ramp once in a while?

My advice is, if you're gonna keep that old rubber don't do any spirited driving.
 
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dano

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"No spirited driving"?? LOL...I am older now and try and keep things under check. I never push higher speed...just the occasional rustang or ricer run (on a closed course...of course).
 

97 B/W GTS

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Get new tires.

I have a '97 GTS also. Lot's of tread left. 10K miles. Just put on the PS2's. Let me tell you...night and day. Most of the infamous tire hop and wheel spinning is gone. Therefore not only can I accelerate faster, but it's much safer car. It's like a new car. Think of it as a 'cheap' mod...you will gain performance.

How can you not "push it" once in awhile? It's a Viper...isn't that what we have these cars for?

Get the new tires.
 

ViperGTS

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Have you ever seen a VIPER going 80 mph and blowing a tire? I have.

5 years, maximum! No excuses.
 

cornfish

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Have you ever seen a VIPER going 80 mph and blowing a tire? I have.

5 years, maximum! No excuses.

I agree. I had 4 year old tires on my 2003 WRX (got it in '02.) The tread looked absolutely fine but since the car was sitting in my garage for ever, I guess one of the tires started to form a slight bubble (that I couldn't see until it was too late.) I drove it to a company party with a few people in the car and the tire blew at 80mph.. Not cool at all but thank god no one was hurt and no damage to the car at all as I was able to slow it down in time. Pretty scary stuff. The car only had 19k miles on it at the time.
 

Bobpantax

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A wise man once said: the only thing worse than old tires is old/cold tires. Your tires are nine years old. They are unsafe for any kind of performance driving. That includes acceleration and road racing. Keep the tires and risk the car, yourself and your passengers or do the responsible thing and get new tires. Those who don't because of the cost of the tires cannot afford to be driving a Viper and should either park the car until they can afford the new tires or sell the car before they hurt themselves and others. I know that this sounds a bit tough but if you use the search function you will find too many posts concerning adverse events due to old and/or cold tires. Proper tires are essential to handle the HP and torque of the Viper. To ignore this fact is irresponsible.
 
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dano

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Got it!

Not that I can't afford the tires...was just hoping to drop the $ on some other mod.

I just went to local tire place for quote....I'll try to keep my foot out of her for the next couple of weeks until I change tires.
 
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dano

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I know this has been beat to death...local tire store has Mich PS...Partsrack has PS 2's. Local place says Mich doesn't make a PS2 for the rear in stock size...this is too much brain damage for something so simple....help...
 

ByteMe

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A couple of us Northwesterners had 97s with low mileage original tires. Here are the differences we saw by going with new ones:
1. The car doesn't follow grooves in the road hardly at all - big difference
2. The car doesn't hydroplane as easily
3. The car has more grip on dry pavement
4. We don't worry about the tires

My advice is to buy new tires and do burnouts :evilmad: with the old ones before switchout.
 

97 B/W GTS

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I know this has been beat to death...local tire store has Mich PS...Partsrack has PS 2's. Local place says Mich doesn't make a PS2 for the rear in stock size...this is too much brain damage for something so simple....help...

They can order the tires. It took my store 1 day to get them.

Buying tires online is a hassle. You have to get them mounted and balanced locally. You'll probably end up paying more for the mount & balance if you show up at their doorstep with tires in hand. Just buy them from a good shop and ask them to meet or beat your best online deal (including shipping etc). They'll do it. They want a $1600 sale (for PS2's).

Also, find a shop that can handle the 13" wide wheels. Not all balancing machines can handles them. Hunter "Ride Match" (Hunter 9700?) is a good machine...it applies a roller to the spinning wheel to simulate a tire on the road.

Get the tires. You won't regret it.
 

SidewinderGTS

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When I got the Viper last year,traction was awesome on 5 year old tires with losts of tread.These summer,crap.Add losts of fun burning them off.
New tire for the summer of 2007.
 

Steve 00RT/10

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My advice is to buy new tires and do burnouts with the old ones before switchout.

This is excellent advice. Between burnouts and donuts, I try to comply with this procedure once a summer.

Last time I checked with Michelin, they said their tires were warrantied for 6 years from the date of manufacture on the side. This time frame would include performance driving. I would not trust tires older than that which had also been on the car from the start. I have 1 set of 01 tires left for next year that I bought a few years ago when they were cheap. They have been kept covered and in the basement. Cool, dry, and away from the sun.

Steve
 

Asp Man

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"They have been kept covered and in the basement. Cool, dry, and away from the sun."

Keep them away from the furnace, the ozone generated by the fan motor will kill those tires quicker than any of the other factors you've considered.
 

Steve 00RT/10

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Keep them away from the furnace, the ozone generated by the fan motor will kill those tires quicker than any of the other factors you've considered.

They are away from the furnace, but I'll respectfully disagree. I just flat out don't believe it. There is no way a fan motor on a household hot air furnace would ever generate enough ozone to destroy a new MPS before high heat and/or continual direct sunlight would. ...especially a new tire which has never been in use and kept covered in a big garbage bag.

Steve
 

ViperGTS

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http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=138


Nothing Lasts Forever...and Tires Are No Exception

In the 1970s, bias ply tires wore out in about 15,000 miles during two years of service. In the 1980s, early radial ply tires wore out in about 40,000 miles during four years of service. And by the turn of the century, radial tires lasting 60,000 to 80,000 miles were providing four or more years of service on vehicles averaging about 15,000 miles per year. In all of these examples, the tire treads "wore out" before the rest of the tire "aged out."

However, not all of today's vehicles average 15,000 miles per year. Multiple-vehicle families, occasionally used recreational vehicles and vehicles driven only for pleasure are driven fewer miles per year. Additionally, enthusiast vehicles trailered to events, shows, stored or put on display for extended periods of time put on far fewer miles. It's possible to encounter ten-year-old tires with significant remaining tread depth because they've been driven less than 1,000 miles a year!

Unfortunately, the growing realization that tires are perishable means that the tires on some of these vehicles will actually "age out" before they "wear out."

How long will tires last before aging out? The U.S. National Highway Traffic Safety Administration and tire manufacturers are currently studying the many variables. Heavily loaded tires only driven occasionally in scorching climates face some of the most severe conditions, while lightly loaded tires driven every day in moderate climates experience the least severe. Add to that the amount of exposure to the elements (sun and atmospheric) and the quality of tire and vehicle maintenance practices (proper inflation pressure, wheel alignment, etc) and you have an idea of the complexity of the situation. While tire life will ultimately depend on the tires' service conditions and the environment in which they operate, the difficult task remains how to confirm and quantify it.

The current industry association recommendations regarding inspecting and replacing tires due to age originate outside the United States.

The British Rubber Manufacturers Association (BRMA) recommended practice issued June, 2001, states "BRMA members strongly recommend that unused tyres should not be put into service if they are over six years old and that all tyres should be replaced ten years from the date of their manufacture."

Environmental conditions like exposure to sunlight and coastal climates, as well as poor storage and infrequent use, accelerate the aging process. In ideal conditions, a tyre may have a life expectancy that exceeds ten years from its date of manufacture. However, such conditions are rare. Aging may not exhibit any external indications and, since there is no non-destructive test to assess the serviceability of a tyre, even an inspection carried out by a tyre expert may not reveal the extent of any deterioration."

More recently, The Japan Automobile Tire Manufacturers Association (JATMA) recommended practice issued May, 2005, states "customers are encouraged to have their vehicle tires promptly inspected after five years of use to determine if the tires can continue to be used (recommends spare tires be inspected as well). Furthermore, even when the tires look usable, it is recommended that all tires (including spare tires) that were made more than ten years ago be replaced with new tires. Additionally, because in some cases automobile makers—based on the characteristics of the relevant vehicle—stipulate in the owner's manual the timing of tire inspection and replacement. Please read and confirm the content of the owner's manual."

Several European vehicle manufacturers of high performance sports cars, coupes and sedans identify that "under no circumstances should tires older than 6 years be used" in their vehicle owner's manual. However, it should be noted that European recommendations must include driving conditions that include roads like the German Autobahn, which allows vehicles to be legally driven at their top speeds for extended periods of time.

While American driving conditions don't include the high-speed challenges of the German Autobahn, the U.S. divisions of DaimlerChrysler and Ford Motor Company joined their European colleagues in 2005 by recommending the tires installed as Original Equipment be replaced after six years of service. (General Motors declined to offer a recommendation until a more scientific analysis of driving conditions and tire aging could be completed).

Because many of the tires The Tire Rack offers are manufactured in Europe or Asia, it's common for us to receive new tires direct from the manufacturers that are six to nine months old. Additionally there are some instances where the tire manufacturer's minimum run quantities will produce enough tires to meet a few years of consumer demand for lower volume types and sizes. In these cases the tires we receive directly from the manufacturer may already be several years old. Finally, when we work with a tire manufacturer to help them clear a discontinued tire line out their warehouses, this clearance frequently uncovers some new tires that are older. These tires are typically offered at a significant discount and will most likely be worn out within their useful lifespan. Since we rotate our inventory, most of the tires we ship are less than a year or two old.

It is also important to note that the more aggressive the tires' tread compound, the shorter its life. DOT-legal competition tires would have the shortest shelf live before the aging process would begin to diminish their performance. Sometimes the tires that were just right at the end of this season will be too aged to be fully effective the next year. Max Performance and Ultra High Performance tires would be next, and so on down the line.

Our experience has been that when properly cared for, most street tires have a useful life of between six to ten years. And while part of that time is spent as the tire travels from the manufacturing plant to the manufacturer's warehouse, to the retailer and to you, the remainder is the time it spends on your vehicle.
 

RoadiJeff

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Our experience has been that when properly cared for, most street tires have a useful life of between six to ten years.

That's good enough for me. 8 years down and two to go on my '99 RT, regardless of what Bob says. Thanks.
 

JonB

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I know this has been beat to death...local tire store has Mich PS...Partsrack has PS 2's. Local place says Mich doesn't make a PS2 for the rear in stock size...this is too much brain damage for something so simple....help...

1) PartsRack is NOT lying to you! We have them, and Im DRIVING on them! PS, at VOI9, they got me 2+ SECONDS faster than good/old Sports in AutoX !!!!!

2) Pilot Sports are what most here are speaking above. Most of those will be 1.5+ years old when bought NEW. PS-2 are the newest. months old.

3) One quote posted here is $1600. PartsRack is WAY BELOW $1400, and NO TAX.
~$15 ea for s/h

4) We have emailed and talked, and I hope to help you.....but If you dont take MY advice, take the other's advice: DONT DRIVE ON HOCKEY PUCKS just becasue they show a lot of (hard, slick, inflexible) Tread.

5) New Tires: $1350; Hitting the Guardrail $13000-25000; peace of mind: PRICELESS
 
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dano

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...in fact, Jon...I have done a bunch of shopping araound and you are the best price. I'm willing to send you $ if you still want the sale.
 

snampro

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If anyone has any doubts about old tires I'll give you my buddy's email address. When he bought his car I told him to replace the tires because they were old and he would wreck. He waited a while and wrecked his car when the rear broke out. When he got his car fixed and put new tires on he said, "Wow, those tires are much stickier..."
 

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