Advantages to creampuff pistons?

[BradH]

Are there any *advantages* to having the creampuff/cast pistons of the 2000 and later models? I know the well documented disadvantages (they're weaker and less capable of handling forced induction, NOS, etc.) But assuming you want to keep the car stock, is there anything preferable about them when compared to the forged pistons from 99 and earlier?

 

[monnieh]

They are lighter and so reduce the amount of rotating mass in the engine. This makes more power.

The only time you want the forged pistions is if you are going to supercharge. There is a lot of debate about using NOS with the lighter cast pistons.

If you are saying N.A. then the cast pistions are what you want.

 

[Joseph Dell]

The biggest advantage is that [especially for this crew] it gives us something to spend $$ on!



JD

 

[PDCjonny]

So how much more measurable power do cast pistons provide over the earlier forged pistons and more aggresive cam (through '99) that no one would want?

 

[ViperJoe]

Creampuff sounds all foofy and all, does that count?

And they make a good ashtray when you pull them out and go to forged for the huffer!

 

[DEVILDOG]

How much will it cost me to "upgrade" to cast in my NA engine?

 

[Joseph Dell]

The thing about pistons is that they don't give you ANY more power until you start adding power adders. you'll blow up your motor if your pistons are crap and you run more than ~5lb of boost. Change to forged and you can run 15psi w/o a problem. Sure, you still have to tune it, but you've freed up (and strengthened) one of the weakest parts of the engine.

So here is where things get bad: Pistons themselves cost ~1000 for a viper (parts). bearings, gaskets, etc... will run you another ~500. BUT while you have the motor in pieces, it makes sense to do things like heads, cam, rockers, rods, etc...

plus, the "cost" of the labor varies greatly. some viper shops charge 11k+ for a piston swap! other places 2-5k. My opinion is that a novice can do pistons w/o messing it up... so if you have the time (no lift required) you should do it yourself. it can be done over a weekend if you have a machine shop that can swap the pistons from one set of rods to the next. total hrs of labor is less than 20 even for a 1st timer.

So that's the skinny on the pistons!

JD

 

[monnieh]

I really need to dyno mine now that I have the 708 cam and the lighter cast pistions. Have not done anything to the heads and have a balanger exhasut with high flow cats.

I expect around 430-440 hp at the wheels and 480-490tq. But unitl I get it dyno'd I don't know.

I can tell you now that the motor is at 5000 miles it is pulling as stong as any viper I have driven or have ridden in that was naturally asperated.

Anybody planning on a dyno day soon?

 

[carguy07]

They are more stable for thermal expansion. That's why forged pistons can knock a little when they are cold. Cast gives you a better seal because you don't have to account for as much expansion.

I would ALWAYS pick forged over cast for a performance motor. Your cast NA motor with some added timing or compression can still go to pieces quickly.

 

[kcobean]

Advantage: They keep people who tend to mod cars from spending LOTS of money going F/I with their Viper.

 

[Camfab]

For a stock or near stock application, they should provide a much longer service life between rebuilds. As stated above they expand less than a forged piston. The Viper also switched too a longer rod in 2000. The longer rod should provide reduced tendencies for piston scuffing as well as longer piston dwell at TDC. The longer rod is the real reason that the cast piston has durabillity issues in blown applications. The top ring land is much closer to the top of the piston. So in theory a cast piston car vs. a forged car should produce a slight power advantage. The truth of the matter may be negligble to none. It's all in the tune, and forged pistons give the tuners an insurance policy for their mistakes.

 

[C O D Y]

I will say this...... I have vipers with cast and forged. I haven't burnt a DROP of oil with the cast pistons in 16,000 miles.

 

[FE 065]

I had two with forged and one with cast. Didn't use a drop in any of them as I recall.

 

[carl B]

I have a set of Forged Diomond pistons I got off Sean Roe already mounted on a set of cream puff rods wirh less than 1000 miles on them if anyone is interested?

I have upgraded the rods now too

Carl

 

[VIPER BAZ UK]

Hay Carl
I'm of to NY on Wednesday for a week..So will let you know when i get back...See how much i spend..Also i got my Rad today as well...
MANY THANKS...

 

[carl B]

Wish I known that you were going so soon as you could have brought my gaskets back from Chuck!!

Carl