Does the ACR need to break the 7:00 mark at the Ring?

[mnc2886]

With McLaren's claim of a sub 7 minute time and LaFerrari on McLaren's heels, does the Gen V ACR need to run a sub 7 minute time frame to have the record? In short, then answer would be yes if McLaren is speaking the truth. The question then really becomes with the market seeing cars like the Huarya, Agera R, P1, and LaFerrari, does the Viper need to beat them all to be relevant? My answer is yes, but losing to those cars with $1MM price tags isn't such a bad thing....

 

[Makara]

I think that the super exotics have upper their game so much that it is going to be hard to keep up with them. I think that the F12 is going to be challenge enough. While I certainly would like to see the Viper keep the title, I wouldn't be ashamed to say that the Viper is the fastest car under 1.5 million dollars around the ring.

 

[anaconda666]

It just needs to look like the GTS-R ALMS cars!!!

 

[Viper Grenade]

It just needs to look like the GTS-R ALMS cars!!!

It also needs to be almost as fast around the ring as well. If I was Ralph, I would use a GTS-R body with a dry stumped 700hp base Viper who's only option would be add AC/radio. Delete anything and everything to keep it light. On top of the unique body would be Areo and full cage (with removable door bars).

 

[phavyarden]

I would have vote for the third option a couple of weeks ago. But i think the new Viper ACR it's can be capable to do it.
I can guess that a TA could hit a 7:10-7:14, and If the ACR brings over 700HP, more aero, Trofeo's, even better brakes, and another improvments. The car could do it.
I won't be dissapointed if it hit a low 7:00's, but i have high expectations of the car

 

[ACRucrazy]

ACR-X had the same weight and HP as the 2013. Looking at everything SRT has done, it looks very methodical. The 7.03 the ACR-X ran, I expect the new ACR to eclipse that.

 

[bluestreak]

12 seconds faster than the Gen IV ACR? Do any of you guys who come up with this stuff actually drive on track? A Gen IV ACR-X on slicks ran 7:03.

A little bench racing is fun, but this is ridiculous.

 

[ViperSmith]

12 seconds faster than the Gen IV ACR? Do any of you guys who come up with this stuff actually drive on track? A Gen IV ACR-X on slicks ran 7:03.

A little bench racing is fun, but this is ridiculous.

I still don't get the whole "manufacture lap record" obsession.

 

[Makara]

12 seconds faster than the Gen IV ACR? Do any of you guys who come up with this stuff actually drive on track? A Gen IV ACR-X on slicks ran 7:03.

A little bench racing is fun, but this is ridiculous.

Hmmm, well I don't know about that. According to this http://forums.viperclub.org/threads/663460-It-s-not-0.08-seconds the gap between the TA and the ZR1 is really closer to 2.2 seconds per lap around Laguna Seca. That means that on cups, the TA would lap Seca in about 1:33.62. Randy drove the old ACR around Laguna in 1:35.12, which means that given it lapped the Ring in 7:12.22, the TA should do it in 7:05.404. Plus or minus a second, most likely minus. Now let's assume that trofeos are going to be a whole lot better than the old cups. That is an easy five seconds right there, now we are down to 7:00.404, still giving us a second of leeway in the second of error that we are accounting for. This is the TA, not the ACR. We already have practically run a 7 minute flat lap around the ring and the ACR isn't even out yet.

 

[bluestreak]

What???????

 

[Stealth]

12 seconds faster than the Gen IV ACR? Do any of you guys who come up with this stuff actually drive on track? A Gen IV ACR-X on slicks ran 7:03.

A little bench racing is fun, but this is ridiculous.

+1

Comparison to cars over $500k is fun but not really reasonable. In racing--and arguably any reference to the N-Ring is a reference to speed, handling and racing capabilities/capacity--$$$$$$ spent (in R&D and in Purchase Price) often equates to speed.

A Gen V ACR should definitely have more power (700hp) than the current Gen V SRT, TA and GTS, or better yet, give all models the power bump. The ACR must also look much more bada@@.

I would consider it a definite accomplishment for the Gen V ACR to beat any legitimate production street car under $500k, even if that "only" means beating the current Gen IV time. The C7 Z06 and C7ZR1, when released, will be good benchmarks, as will the new 991 GT2 RS, when released.

These are truly exception times for performance cars!

 

[VIPER GTSR 91]

Records are always made to be broken and they WILL. But to break 7 at the Ring in a street stock Viper is VERY unlikely soon.

 

[TrackAire]

Hmmm, well I don't know about that. According to this http://forums.viperclub.org/threads/663460-It-s-not-0.08-seconds the gap between the TA and the ZR1 is really closer to 2.2 seconds per lap around Laguna Seca. That means that on cups, the TA would lap Seca in about 1:33.62. Randy drove the old ACR around Laguna in 1:35.12, which means that given it lapped the Ring in 7:12.22, the TA should do it in 7:05.404. Plus or minus a second, most likely minus. Now let's assume that trofeos are going to be a whole lot better than the old cups. That is an easy five seconds right there, now we are down to 7:00.404, still giving us a second of leeway in the second of error that we are accounting for. This is the TA, not the ACR. We already have practically run a 7 minute flat lap around the ring and the ACR isn't even out yet.

Damn, that was funny .....you should run for politics because you'd have no problem explaining and convincing the public that the deficit would be gone in 18 to 24 months.

The 7:12 ACR Ring record was luck. The weather sucked, one of the cars broke and we ran out of time. If it wasn't for movie director Ron Howard giving us a couple free hours of track time (he was renting the track filming a movie) we would have not have set the record on that attempt. (we all need to go see his new movie when it comes out as a form of thanks for the free track time).

Having said that, I honestly think the 2010 ACR could have run a better time. The weather and track conditions were not even close to optimal and the lack of track time really hurts in setting up a competitive product. I think the 2010 ACR could easily run under 7:09 if the planets all aligned.

I think if the great super cars of the world all went to the Ring on the same weekend to try to set a new record, it would make for a great televised pay per view event.

Cheers,
George

 

[Makara]

As car enthusiasts we should go out and see Rush (what he was filming on the ring) anyway, just because we would all most likely really enjoy it. I wasn't aware that he gave the track time to run the vipers, that is huge. I'm sure that they didn't stop production and had other locations scheduled but that is still a pretty big deal for him to do that.

The 7:12 that the ACR put down is amazing. Any lap time put down at a track is less than what the car is capable of as there is no absolute perfect lap and subject to driver, weather, and a million other variables, but that time certainly did get a lot of car enthusiasts to take notice. Realistically, I'm sure almost all of us here that love to bench race what one car or another can do would kill ourselves on that track trying to get an 8:00, but it sure is fun knowing that the viper is capable of kicking some butt.

Last night I pulled home in my jeep as my next door neighbor was getting dropped off by her boyfriend in his new car. We chatted a bit about the new car and he told me that it could go over 227 miles per hour. My neighbor asked if it was faster than what I had. Her boyfriend, who races cars, said, "No his viper is faster around a track" all while my viper is sitting next to a modified 911 turbo sitting in my garage, getting completely ignored. I sort of love that about the viper. In truth, the 911 turbo is faster on the street in a practical sense just because on crappy surface streets, it is a lot safer to push a car with awd and the electronic aids than the balls to the wall viper, but on a proper surface, the viper is just sick. On just about all surfaces, the viper is hands down way more fun, and that is why I can't see myself without one for a very long time.

Back to bench racing. I think that the ACR will run the ring in 6:49.94. I used maths and sciences to come to this conclusion.

 

[madninjaskillz]

As car enthusiasts we should go out and see Rush (what he was filming on the ring) anyway, just because we would all most likely really enjoy it. I wasn't aware that he gave the track time to run the vipers, that is huge. I'm sure that they didn't stop production and had other locations scheduled but that is still a pretty big deal for him to do that.

The 7:12 that the ACR put down is amazing. Any lap time put down at a track is less than what the car is capable of as there is no absolute perfect lap and subject to driver, weather, and a million other variables, but that time certainly did get a lot of car enthusiasts to take notice. Realistically, I'm sure almost all of us here that love to bench race what one car or another can do would kill ourselves on that track trying to get an 8:00, but it sure is fun knowing that the viper is capable of kicking some butt.

Last night I pulled home in my jeep as my next door neighbor was getting dropped off by her boyfriend in his new car. We chatted a bit about the new car and he told me that it could go over 227 miles per hour. My neighbor asked if it was faster than what I had. Her boyfriend, who races cars, said, "No his viper is faster around a track" all while my viper is sitting next to a modified 911 turbo sitting in my garage, getting completely ignored. I sort of love that about the viper. In truth, the 911 turbo is faster on the street in a practical sense just because on crappy surface streets, it is a lot safer to push a car with awd and the electronic aids than the balls to the wall viper, but on a proper surface, the viper is just sick. On just about all surfaces, the viper is hands down way more fun, and that is why I can't see myself without one for a very long time.

Back to bench racing. I think that the ACR will run the ring in 6:49.94. I used maths and sciences to come to this conclusion.

Bro, do you even lift?

 

[PDCjonny]

I still don't get the whole "manufacture lap record" obsession.

If you were around when the ACR was rumored to be going back to the 'Ring for an attempt to retake the record you would know what the "obsession" is to Viper owners. It consumed this site for days and when the record was reclaimed from GM and Toyota it was cause for great joy around here.
Important part of Viper history apparently lost on the influx of noobs whose interests are focused on leather interiors now.

 

[ViperSmith]

If you were around when the ACR was rumored to be going back to the 'Ring for an attempt to retake the record you would know what the "obsession" is to Viper owners. It consumed this site for days and when the record was reclaimed from GM and Toyota it was cause for great joy around here.
Important part of Viper history apparently lost on the influx of noobs whose interests are focused on leather interiors now.

Ah yes, more hate from you. You've bashed new owners since I joined this forum last year non-stop. You've bashed the Gen V at every opportunity. It taking back Laguna Seca wasn't fast enough "for you" - though it ran over the Gen IV ACR record there.

But to your point, when the record at LS was retaken it got a big "so what" from you and calling us "sycophants" for liking the new Viper - hilarious double standard.

 

[BigDawg]

It doesn't need to but that would be great! The Viper has a history of slaying supercars on the track, so I'd like to see it continue. However, I won't be down on SRT or Ralph if they don't beat the 7 minute mark. Just shatter the 'old' ACR record and I'll be happy.

BTW, what is a hypercar? Is that a supercar with starbucks in the gas tank?

 

[PDCjonny]

Ah yes, more hate from you. You've bashed new owners since I joined this forum last year non-stop. You've bashed the Gen V at every opportunity. It taking back Laguna Seca wasn't fast enough "for you" - though it ran over the Gen IV ACR record there.

But to your point, when the record at LS was retaken it got a big "so what" from you and calling us "sycophants" for liking the new Viper - hilarious double standard.

Hardly hate pal, you are the quintessential new breed of Viper owner.
Clueless to it's history, and in need of non stop constant reinforcement you're making the right decison before maybe buying one.
Have you ever bought a new car? Do you always need so much hand holding?

You don't see the "obsession" with manufacturers lap record times?
Yeah that was never important in Viper history. You really should buy a cadillac.

 

[ViperSmith]

Hardly hate pal, you are the quintessential new breed of Viper owner.
Clueless to it's history, and in need of non stop constant reinforcement you're making the right decison before maybe buying one.
Have you ever bought a new car? Do you always need so much hand holding?

You don't see the "obsession" with manufacturers lap record times?
Yeah that was never important in Viper history. You really should buy a cadillac.

Hand holding? What on Earth are you talking about? I put a deposit down once I could and ordered first day the banks were open. If it weren't for the production delays, I'd be driving it now. So, not quite sure what point you are incorrectly trying to make.

Perhaps a Gallardo would be more up my alley, so I can talk down to everyone else. The only persons seeking validation is you, that you made the right decision not to buy one. More power to you.

I know it maybe inconceivable to you, but people do buy vehicles for different reasons. I don't get the obsession over lap times, but I appreciate the work that goes into getting them, but it made no impact on my purchasing decision at all. I've said all along the Gen V would be a monster once it got out of a "Minimally Viable Product" stage - and it is. So, yawn. Go on, continue being ignorant to people new to the brand, it is quite welcoming.

 

[VENOM V]

If you were around when the ACR was rumored to be going back to the 'Ring for an attempt to retake the record you would know what the "obsession" is to Viper owners. It consumed this site for days and when the record was reclaimed from GM and Toyota it was cause for great joy around here.
Important part of Viper history apparently lost on the influx of noobs whose interests are focused on leather interiors now.

Alright, I was with you and in complete agreement up until you took another cheap shot at "noobs." Most of us "noobs" bite our tongue and rise above when we read generalizations like that. New buyers of the Gen V are a diverse group that spans from people that have always wanted a Viper and can just now afford one, to serious track rats, to cross-shoppers from european exotics, to muscle car guys that are stepping up to a true super car. And yes, most everyone that is honest will tell you that they want to have their cake and it too. With the Gen V, you can- Word-class performance and, god forbid, a comfortable leather interior. Oh, what a travesty.

Quit lumping all new buyers together as a group and condemning them. It makes me and others wonder where the chip on your shoulder comes from- jealousy, insecurity, or general bitterness in life? If you were in a room full of VCA members (new and long-time members), would you really be so rude as to insult the "noobs" to their faces?

 

[witz323]

The fact that the Viper is even in a conversation about Ring times against cars like the McLaren, Paganni, LaFerrari etc... is good enough for me. I could really care less if those cars beat the Viper on a track, I mean come on...for those prices they should be wiping the floor with every Viper, Porsche and Corvette variant. The viper will still be VERY relevant despite losing track contests to cars which cost $500,000 - $1,500,000.00.

 

[VENOM V]

The fact that the Viper is even in a conversation about Ring times against cars like the McLaren, Paganni, LaFerrari etc... is good enough for me. I could really care less if those cars beat the Viper on a track, I mean come on...for those prices they should be wiping the floor with every Viper, Porsche and Corvette variant. The viper will still be VERY relevant despite losing track contests to cars which cost $500,000 - $1,500,000.00.

Amen, brother, and thanks for getting this thread back on track

And the fact that the Viper is King of the 'Ring today is impressive. And even against some of the mega-bucks super cars, we've accomplished the unthinkable at Laguna Seca. Just look at all the Vipers ahead of the McClaren, Ferrari 458 and LFA there...

TOP 20 AT LAGUNA SECA (Motor Trend):
20. 2013 Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG Black Series Coupe 1:38.90
19. 2012 Mercedes-Benz SLS AMG 1:38.82
18. 2013 Ford Shelby GT500 1:38.70
17. 2011 Porsche 911 GT3 RS 1:36.77
16. 2012 Lexus LFA 1:36.39
15. 2012 Audi R8 GT 1:36.39
14. 2012 Nissan GT-R 1:36.35
13. 2103 Nissan GT-R Black Edition 1:36.34
12. 2010 Ferrari 458 Italia 1:36.22
11. 2009 Chevrolet Corvette ZR1 1:35.83
10. 2013 SRT Viper GTS* 1:35.77
9. 2012 Lamborghini Aventador LP700-4 1:35.40
8. 2008 Dodge Viper ACR 1:35.12
7. 2013 SRT Viper 1:34.63
6. 2012 McLaren MP4-12C 1:34.50
5. 2012 Chevrolet Corvette Z06 1:34.43
4. 2013 SRT Viper GTS 1:34.23
3. 2010 Dodge Viper ACR** 1:33.92
2. 2013 Chevrolet Corvette ZR1 1:33.70
1. 2013 SRT Viper TA 1:33.62

 

[Makara]

Bro, do you even lift?

All natural ability, like Bo Jackson. My hip does hurt a little bit pushing those heavy pedals though.

 

[ViperGeorge]

The 08 ACR lapped the ring in what 7:22 or so. The 10 ACR lapped it in 7:12. The only difference being the driver, a slight difference in the wing, and a revised 5th gear. Otherwise same power level. I wouldn't be surprised given further engineering, different gearing in the rear, different tires, power of the Gen 5 (at 640 now), if they cut another 10 seconds off to a 7:02 or so. After all it is a 14.4 mile track. LS is much, much smaller. I would not however expect the ACR to have more power. Clear Air certification is a pain and is what has delayed delivery of current Gen 5s. Revising the engine and going through all the BS again - I don't see SRT doing it. Maybe I'm wrong.

 

[1BADGTS]

It all sounds great but could sometell me where the moneys coming from to accomplish all of this Besides the Rand D cost theres materal costs (lightweigh componts ..)not to mention the millions its going to cost in all the federal recertifications (EPA and CRASH TESTING )Engine wise SRT changes so much as an air filter on the stock GEN 5 and its got to be recertifyed. The reason the stock Gen 5 doesnt have alum frame ,Carb Fiber Brakes, Dry Sump and more more power was LACK OF MONEY.

 

[TrackAire]

It all sounds great but could sometell me where the moneys coming from to accomplish all of this Besides the Rand D cost theres materal costs (lightweigh componts ..)not to mention the millions its going to cost in all the federal recertifications (EPA and CRASH TESTING )Engine wise SRT changes so much as an air filter on the stock GEN 5 and its got to be recertifyed. The reason the stock Gen 5 doesnt have alum frame ,Carb Fiber Brakes, Dry Sump and more more power was LACK OF MONEY.

Well BAD, at some level companies have to grow a set of balls and decide if they are going to be the lead sled dog or have the same view as the other dogs behind the leader.

It is called INVESTMENT....without it companies flounder. Remember the Lamborghini Countach?....it was way over the top, mainly in style but was a pretty potent performance package for the day. Lamborghini made the INVESTMENT to build something that has forever kept the name Lambo on the map. Hell, I think they made more money selling posters of the Countach than they actually made selling the car.

Fiat and Chrysler have to decide what they want their future to look like. Just spend enough to be in the market and you'll end up with something like a C5 Vette....10 years from now you'll be able to pick up a clean running C5 for $3000. Build something awesome and people talk, discuss, debate and desire it. Don't spend the INVESTMENT now and watch the rest of your product line start to suffer.

The money is there, it is being used for other things (maybe rightly so, maybe not). Since Chrysler is Fiats profit center for the last 12 months, I'd say the boys at Chrysler are holding up their end as is the Amercian buyer. Time to give them the money to really kick GM and Fords butts and let them play catch up for the next 10 years. Trust me, it costs a lot more to play catch up than doing it right the first time.
Often times spending 10% more today saves spending 40% a year from now. It takes balls when you decide to allow a bad quarter or two knowing that INVESTMENT will make the next 36 months prosperous. No business can survive based on making decisions every 90 days, INVESTMENT takes money and time.



Cheers,
George

 

[ViperSmith]

It all sounds great but could sometell me where the moneys coming from to accomplish all of this Besides the Rand D cost theres materal costs (lightweigh componts ..)not to mention the millions its going to cost in all the federal recertifications (EPA and CRASH TESTING )Engine wise SRT changes so much as an air filter on the stock GEN 5 and its got to be recertifyed. The reason the stock Gen 5 doesnt have alum frame ,Carb Fiber Brakes, Dry Sump and more more power was LACK OF MONEY.

They will have cash - if the Gen V sells well. That is all it boils down to. Everything is open to change, if the Gen V sells well.

 

[jsd512]

It will. I bet you the TA can run a sub-7:10.

 

[AJ usmc]

viperjon, vipersmith, I think yall lost the point of the viper. thankyou Venom V