No Class Points For Upgraded Brakes if Stock???

[Tom and Vipers]

I saw that Stoptech rotors are 0 points.

Stoptech brakes are 1 point for SS and up.

Other brakes are 2 points for SS and up.

Does that mean that if you are a lower class than SS such as Stock, there are no points assessed for a racing brake system?

Boy, that sounds like a loophole!

 

[FrankBarba]

ARE YOU ON DRUGS??? read the rules....if you use the stop tech rotors they are ok for all classes and you are assesed ZERO POINTS... buy the rotors put them on your car and you will receive NO POINTS.... if you add the brake system you must be in SS class...no ifs and or buts...exactly what are you trying to acheive ??? if you want to stay in the stock class add items with zero points....sounds like you don't know what you want to do...why start a new post anyway...keep it under the matrix..

 

[Tom and Vipers]

The rules are not well defined regarding brake points.

If what you said is true, if I put Brembos on a Stock car, I will be put in SS.

That doesn't explain what "and up" means.

The rules say, "StopTech Brake System - SS and up 1 (point)." "SS and up" sounds like the condition under which points are assessed. If Not "SS and up" then does not apply.

PS I didn't put this is Matrix because it is not related to the discussion of potential changes. I merely sought a clarification and did not want to digress the Matrix thread.

I want to run Stock class and develop my driving skills so that I can hang with the SS guys. It's pretty clear that driving is the biggest speed part for a Viper. Besides, I have a 100k warranty on my 00 GTS and I plan on using the warranty up - so no mods for me.

However, Wayne's car is another story..... it will get the best brakes and probably a couple of wings/splitters.

As far as wheel to wheel, if I get around to doing it, it will be something fun and cheap (leaves Viper out). Shifter karts or remote dirt tracks where all you need is a car, a helmet, and a can of spray paint for your number. My problem is I like full body contact - the more bumping, the better. Dirt oval karts is pretty good for that too.

Rules drive me nuts in general, there are way too many of them. I really hate the safety rules since I have a great sense of well-being. Like in the Ruf Porsche Video, Rosen is wearing no helmet, short sleeves, blue jeans, and what appear to be penny loafers.... and he was probably doing 200 mph on the big straight not to mention John Force Power Slides at 100 mph.

Actually on the rules subject, one of the reasons Stock appeals to me is that you basically can't do anything to your car - and that sure makes it simple.

My focus on brakes is that at Road America, I experienced a slight amount of brake fade and I didn't like that. (Ducts will go on my car.)

Fingers tired... time to sleep....

 

[Skip at Viper Days]

This is a good question and let me explain why! Stopping is the best thing on a track. Be it planned or emergency you want your brakes to be there. 3300 pounds is a lot to stop and our stock system, which is great for the road can use some help on the track. Stop Tech offers a very affordable system that was specifically designed for the Viper!! It simply works!!
Viper Days is trying extremely hard to run events that are SAFE!! We want every owner to experience driving at speed safely and having fun. We only wish every driver would learn how to drive their Viper safely and properly.
I know rules are a pain but insurance companies and atternies require them. As for the Ruf piece.... Steve was at Road America with us and if you wanted to rude with him you signed a release.AND he wore full safty equipment!!
Please use all safety items available to kep you alive!!.... do not elude them!!
Skip

 

[Janni]

Tom,
The Viper Days points matrix is easy once you print it out use a highlighter to note all the options (don't forget to add points for your stock gen II engine...) you have on your car. As already discussed elsewhere, as soon as you have a Gen II car, you are in Super Stock. Try it - and then add up the points. Really as a Gen II car, you have one point to play with - we opted for wider front tires, but a non-Borla Cat Back will cost you a point as will a wing or several other choices. You can install a cage and get -1 point, so that's an option, too. But Super Stock has really been pushing the envelope when it comes to keeping the car as stock as possible. It really is the most competitive class in the Michelin Challenge Series - it puts the emphasis on the driver.

Many safety items can be done to the car with zero points - as can many things related to vehicle longevity (oil pan baffles, fan kits, harnesses, etc.) ANd many things that can be done to your stock brake system to enhance performance - SS lines, better pads, better rotors, MANY cooling options (air deflectors, better wheels, stoptech rotors, titanium pistons, pad backing plates, etc, etc...) I think we've done just about everything we can and still stay in Super Stock (including patronizing ViperDays sponsors for exhausts, rotors, air filters...)

At VIR Henry was seeing brake rotor temps of about 1200 degrees F (maybe highter - cannot look at the color key on the temp paint bottle right now...)- we constantly monitor temperature with the help of temperature indicating paint at various places on the rotor and now, the back of the pad. He experienced ZERO fade after three whole days. He changed front pads, but only because the starting set was not new. No other maintenance - no brake bleed - nothing.

Bled the brakes in preparation for Putnam Park - very little discoloration at each bleeder screw - more in the front. But the fluid was still performing beautifully. Castrol SRF. I think this is an often overlooked area - and while Motul is good - once it gets "wet" you'll get poor performance. And you can draw in a bunch of water in just a few track sessions when you see a lot of heat (and the SS folks do...)

Contact us directly if you'd like a more complete list of our Super Stock mods - we try real hard to not have to work on the cars at the track, and always have paid special attention to brakes. We've not missed a single session due to maintenance issues. Preparation is everything.

hope this helps - enjoy your car at the track.

 

[BWoodbury]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>
(including patronizing ViperDays sponsors for exhausts, rotors, air filters...)
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is the one issue I have with the Viper Days points system.

The fact that the same mods has different point values depending on who you bought the part from. Yes I know this a way to help out the sponsors, and I know that sponsors are a GREAT thing for a series like Viper Days, but I think you are going to have problems with this down the road.

What are you going to do when the sponsors change next year or the year after. Say I carefully plan my mods (Ok I don't run in Viper Days, so say Janni carefully plans her mods) to stay in a particular class. Then next year the sponsor changes and my free exhaust now costs me 2 points.

I have not changed my car, but it is now in a different class. And worse yet I am now probably at the bottom of this new class as I have not spent all my points. I would not be a happy racer...

 

[Janni]

Bob,
I have not done all that much performance mods- the biggie was the Borla over others because they support Viper Days. I still like the system and would not remove it if the sponsorship / points matrix changes next year. I would just deal with the new classification. This is not F-1.....

That being said, even if it did bump me into "prepared" if you look at the results from just about every event, then you'll see that even if you threw the Super Stock guys into Prepared and Modified, usually the SS guys would still win - even with "lesser" cars. I'd venture to say that the folks with more mods are not getting the most out of their car before making modifications.....

Really, while there is competition at ViperDays, the real deal should be the drivers focusing on improving their skills and if folks get too bent about points for this and who's done what, the fun goes down a notch, I think. Right now, everyone is very open about their car's set up and mods and everyone is willing to help everyone else - and that is what it is all about. Everyone is in the same boat with regard to points so we'll continue to work with Skip in the off season to discuss the coming year and offer our suggestions. This is supposed to be about having fun, you know....

 

[BWoodbury]

Janni,

I have noticed that higher classes and faster speed do NOT always go hand in hand in Viper Days. But this is the first time I have ever seen that on such a wide scale.

I just think that the points system should penalize racers based on the performance the parts offer, not on the amount of money the sponsor contributed. What if we ran elections this way? Oh, wait, never mind...