Should I be Pissed?

[KaiPL]

Took my car to the dealer to get it aligned.

Pick the car up, they tell me that they had to really tweak the caster (5 degrees left, 6.3 degrees right) as the car was pulling when they test drove it, and 1.3 degree cross caster was what it took to correct that pull.

I drive away, and my tire pressure sensor goes off, telling me that I've got 9 pounds of pressure in my right rear tire. (My almost new Pilot Sport Cup tire.)

I turn around, head back to the dealer, and use their air hose to air it up. I notice a hissing sound coming from the tire. I drive it back to the service bay, and they discover two holes in the tire, and it is leaking badly.

So, I'm kind of ticked. I brought the tire in without a hole, and now it's got two holes in it. "Must have happened when we took the car out on the test drive" they say.

So, they put in a temporary patch, air it up, and I drive to a tire store to get a real patch. I notice that the car is now pulling noticebly to the left.
I conclude that the reason that the car was pulling on their test drive is not because the alignment needed 1.3 degrees if cross caster, but because the right rear tire was flat.

So.

I'm going to have the tire permanently patched.
I'm taking the car back to the dealer to get the caster alignment redone.

Right now, I'm feeling kind of peeved. I'm unhappy that my tire has two holes in it. For some reason, a racing tire with patches doesn't seem as desirable to me as a racing tire without patches. I'm unhappy that I have to spend time tomorrow getting my alignment redone.

Should I just get over it, or should I try to get the dealer to do something for me (like buy me a new tire.)

 

[Andy 98 RT/10]

The dealer should get you a new tire, no questions asked.

 

[DEVILDOG]

The dealer should get you a new tire, no questions asked.

Ditto.

 

[RedVenom]

I would talk to them about buying you a new tire first, because things happen sometimes. See if they are willing to fix the problem. Then if they don't help you out, then you should be pissed.

 

[Yellow32]

Absolutely,

The dealer not only owes you a tire but the service mgr should bend over backwards to make amends for their totally incompetent work.

There is no way I would push a tire that has been patched, even if the patch is in the center of the tire thread, not worth the potential for trouble.

How could a mechanic align a car w/o checking the tire pressures?! Ridiculous!

That would be like adjusting the shocks for "ride height" without checking the tire pressure!

-J

 

[STUGOTS]

should you be pisst???? NO downright murderous rage, in which you want them to feel the wrath of hell itself??? YUP.

Sorry to hear of your troubles.

Hope everything works out well for you.

 

[Sellshomesdrivesviper]

Its an easy compromise, they give you a new tire, and you remain a happy customer.
There should be no doubt about it.

 

[SnakeEye]

Sorry to hear...they should buy you a new tire.

 

[TOPGON]

Your story is precicely why I used to dread taking my car for service. I will say here in Dallas the Viper tech at the dealer is the only one who works on my car and I have his cell phone and make appointments through him. I don't even get that treatment with Mama's Lexus. Very sorry for your troubles it's definitely new tire time and a huge apology for the jiffy lube caliber of work.

 

[knuk]

A patch?? Your tire has lost it's speed rating due to the punctures. The dealer owes you a new tire.

 

[SRTRICKY]

This is exactly why I stay at the dealership for the entire time they work on my car (today I waited 3 hours to just get my car in there and another 4.5 hours of work and tomorrow I'll be going back for another hours worth to align the tips)
Ricky

 

[Phil]

Sorry to hear that. Good luck for asking them to buy you a new set of tires. At least this is what the dealer should do anyway as they damaged it. However, I wasn't so lucky when my dealer crashed my GTS a few years ago which not even one word of apologies and ofcourse, they did not do anything but to asked me to deal with the insurance. But anyhow, good luck to you.

 

[NOMERCY]

They owe you a tire. That's B.S.

What dealer was this?

 

[KaiPL]

They owe you a tire. That's B.S.

What dealer was this?

Northglenn Dodge

I'm headed back there this morning.

We'll see what happens.

 

[vipersrt10]

they should buy u a new tire cuz youre racing on it, they dont allow patched tires on the track, tell them

 

[Steve-Indy]

We have seen this type of tire accident before... be it from the test drive or simply pulling on to the lift...standup dealers that I know will immediately order a new replacement tire if the car's tires are in good shape...if tires worn, they will replace BOTH tires on that end of the car.

Just this AM at our morning car/pilot coffee-BS session, 996TT driver reported similar incident at Porsche dealership this week with one of his new Pilot Sport Cups (he DOES track the the car)...dealer had new Sport Cup tire on the way immediately.

There ARE STANDUP DEALERS out there !!!

Good luck, Kai...and please keep us posted.

 

[KaiPL]

Well.

They said the flat tire wasn't their fault. I had to speak with several different people, and finally got the bottom line from the service manager, which was:

"I'm not responsible if your car gets a flat tire. If your tire gets a nail in it while we are driving it, that's not negligence." "Flat tires happen all the time. I'm not buying you a new tire just because you got a flat tire."

He agreed that if he had wrecked a fender that he would pay for that, but seemed to think that tires were different. "Just because your tire decides to give out while it's here doesn't mean we should buy you a new tire."

After a lot of arguing, he agreed to pay for half the replacement cost of a new tire. I suppose that my alternative was taking the dealership to small claims court, so I suppose that it is better than nothing.

As for the alignment, the car pulls badly to the left now, which is probably not surprising considering that they put 1.3 degrees of cross caster in it and the specifications say a maximum of .3 degrees. It took a while to convince them that this was a problem too. The service manager told me that "the Viper is a very tempermental handling and getting a perfect alignment is not possible." I told him I didn't expect perfection, but that I wanted the alignment within the specified tolerances. He suggested that we leave the alignment alone, and just change the position of my steering wheel to compensate for the pull to the left. After much discussion, we finally agreed that the car needed to be realigned so that it falls within the specified tolerances.

Wow! These folks have truly set a new standard for customer service.

p.s. A few more choice quotes from the service manageer:

"That's a track tire, you shouldn't be driving it on the street anyway."
"The pulling to the left you are feeling is probably just due to bumps in the road."

 

[redsrt03]

Kai,

Not to take sides, but since you brought it in for an alignment anyway, I assume you noticed something weird before you took it in.

Is it possible you had a flat or almost flat tire prior to taking it in?

Anyways, my Viper spend part of OCT, all of NOV, and part of DEC at Northglenn, so I know how frustrated you are feeling.

 

[SRTJOE]

The first thing you do when doing an alignment is check tire pressure! If they do not, they will chase there a$$ around and do the alignment over and over till some body checks tire pressure. They do owe you a new tire and I would not bring it back to a bunch of retards like that ever again. Thank god we have a great Viper tech in town or I would Probably do most of the work my self.

Sorry You have to put up with this BS.

 

[KaiPL]

Kai,

Not to take sides, but since you brought it in for an alignment anyway, I assume you noticed something weird before you took it in.

Is it possible you had a flat or almost flat tire prior to taking it in?

Anyways, my Viper spend part of OCT, all of NOV, and part of DEC at Northglenn, so I know how frustrated you are feeling.

I know that the tire was not flat when I brought it in. I have a smart tire pressure monitor that would inform me if I was losing pressure. Also, I put gas in the car and checked the tire pressure at a gas station one block away from the dealership. Everything was normal. The dealer also told me they checked the tire pressure before they did the alignment. They didn't say anything about the car having a flat tire. When I picked it up, the tire was completly flat (9psi). I used the dealer's air hose to put air in it, and as soon as I did, I could hear air escaping, and the tire pressure began dropping immediately. No way that they could be working on a wheel alignment and not notice the hissing sound of air coming out of that tire.
I think they either damaged it getting it off the lift (they use boards, one of which was splintered and broken) or else they did it during the test drive.

 

[KaiPL]

And now the good news.

They re-did the alignment. They evened up the caster, and added more caster than had come from the factory. (My factory set caster was significantly less than factory specifications.)

The car tracks much better now. It isn't quite so "darty" over uneven road surfaces. The car doesn't pull, and is noticably easier to drive.

I think they did a good job on the alignment the second time around.

I'm no longer pissed. If they hadn't hassled me about the tire, they would have earned themselves a customer for life. With the amount of money I spend on my car, they would have easily been able to make up for the cost of my new tire.
As it is, I'm not unhappy, but I'm unlikely to go back and see them again either.

 

[Joe Dozzo]

When I had my Viper, I had two rules when it came to factory service...

1. NEVER, NEVER, NEVER EVER got to either Christophers Or Northglen. Very bad things happened to my car at both.

2. Try Glenn at SW Dodge (I know it's a longer drive, but you won't be disappointed!).


And you might see if Jim Slater is at the dealership NE of Denver - sorry, I don't have the card with me.

 

[big-n-italian]

I drive away, and my tire pressure sensor goes off, telling me that I've got 9 pounds of pressure in my right rear tire. (My almost new Pilot Sport Cup tire.)

I turn around, head back to the dealer, and use their air hose to air it up. I notice a hissing sound coming from the tire. I drive it back to the service bay, and they discover two holes in the tire, and it is leaking badly.

Not taking sides either, but how do you know that YOU didnt run over something on your way home from the dealer? Happens.

 

[big-n-italian]

<< How could a mechanic align a car w/o checking the tire pressures?! Ridiculous >>

exactly what I am saying. How could they not and even visually miss 9 lbs in a tire - would be obvious.

<< I drive away, and my tire pressure sensor goes off >>

If the tire was flat before you left, (Becasue of dealer fault, at the dealer), wouldnt the light be on right away and not come on later?

<< As for the alignment, the car pulls badly to the left now >>

i also think if the tire was flat at the dealer, that you would have said you immediately felt the car "pulling" as soon as you left the dealers lot on the way home, and that wasnt mentioned.

Just some views to ponder from the other side. Everyone is jumping the dealer here without thinking of all the possibilities.

(Putting flame suit on.)

 

[KaiPL]

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough as to the facts.

I did not drive more than 20 feet before the tire pressure sensor went off. It started ringing as soon as the sensors spun up. I wasn't "on my way home." I was still on the dealer's lot, within 20 feet of where I started the car. I didn't mention the car "pulling" because I wasn't driving the car faster than 5mph. As soon as the alarm went off, I drove the car (slowly) about 100 feet to where the air hose was, filled the tire with air, and heard a loud hissing sound when the air came out of the hole. The tire wouldn't hold air. It was deflating rapidly.

They said that they checked the tire pressure on all the tires prior to doing the alignment. I doubt it was at 9 pounds then. I think it is more likely that the tire was damaged pulling it off the rack, or during their test drive.

I can't see how I could possibly have been driving the car when the tire was damaged. I checked tire pressure right before I got to the dealer. It was fine. The car sat in their service bay while I checked in, waited for my rental car, etc., and by the time they got around to working on it and they checked the tire pressure, it was still fine.

Something happened to the tire that put a big hole in it. It didn't happen after I picked the car up. If that hole was in it when I dropped the car off, the tire would have been flat by the time they did the alignment (which it wasn't.)

 

[Skip White]

Kai, they should replace the tire, and in all fairness, pro-rate the usuge. If it were your family car or pickup, a good quality patch job is ok. This car is about speed, and due to the design of these tires, I don't think patches are to good of a thing to have.

As far as that lousy alignment, I've said it so many times. You should deviate from the oem specs a bit, and a good alignment will make the car drive day and night differently. A good alignment will take a full three hours to do on this car. I have had so many alignments done, and I'm blown away by how well my car drives with this most recent one.

Do you guys remember the movie Sean Connery was in and he said I've found the cure for cancer, and now I've lost it.
Well that's the way I feel about loosing my print out of the best alignment I've ever had. I had it and lost it. We worked about four full hours on my SRT and I lost the printout.

Getting every thing just right is very tedious. Most alignment guys don't do this. They alter the printout to show within range limits. The oem settings **** on this car, and to tell the truth, I think many SRT's are not given a three hour alignment. They get it close and that's it.

I use that Sean Connery statement a lot, when I loose something, just like the way he says it.

Skip White

 

[big-n-italian]

<< Perhaps I wasn't clear enough as to the facts. I wasn't "on my way home." >>

The biggest reason i thought you were on your "way home", was because in your original post, you said:

<< I turn around, head back to the dealer, >>

To me, that sentence doesn't imply at all that you were still in the parking lot.

my apologies.

 

[ArlyDude]

Keep us updated. Tomorrow is Monday and I hope you keep us updated on what you do with this situation. I'd give them 3 days to get me a new tire, pro-rated for wear seems like a fair compensation. How many miles were on these tires?

 

[redsrt03]

Kai,

Glad you got your alignmet right. I guess lesson learned is to do a very good visual on any car before you leave the service department. That way, any dings, low tires etc, can be negoiated before you leave the premises.

BTW. I added a couple of lbs of air to my tires (current pressure is ~32 lbs I think) and I've noticed the bump-steer has become almost non-existent.

 

[Viper X]

They owe you a tire or maybe two.

My local dealer just lost their next sale and a bunch of business for their behavior too. I just can't understand the short term thinking of some dealers / people.

PS - After my three hour alignment, I still have bump steer too. It's better, but not what it should be. I'll try increasing the air pressure to 32 lbs. Just got back from the Silver State and I can tell you that bump steer isn't any fun at 160 mph.

Dan