For anyone selling their garage queen !

and, for Matt - Funky977, and anyone else who cares to read..........

Don't drop that price another dime, and don't let others, anywhere - have a say in what you do with your Car as far as the pricing goes. I'm not pointing at anyone directly who reply'd to your now, closed Thread. I'm simply making a statement that a LOT of people just wanna "steal" a car, of course everyone wants to get a great deal, but there are many who try to make you feel bad because of a price you are asking. Your Car wasn't overpriced to begin with, and now you do have it at a "steal" price. Your car is a beauty, not modified, and I'm sure, taken care of. You're probably a great guy, easy going ( sounds like it ) and people prey on your type when buying a Car.

Ebay ?? Forget about it ! Great place to LOOK AT Cars, but it's the home of all the Low Ballers. There are a few Cars on Ebay that sell for what they should sell for, but 9 times outta 10, it's "Reserve Not Met". It's a great place to advertise. But get your pricing between Ebay, AutoTrader and the Classifieds here and everywhere, and stick to it. These guys that talk about a mint condition Viper for 30 something........are all hype. A beautiful, Viper GTS with 450hp, with low miles....for 30something, never. Maybe a beat on, unknown history, auction car that was thrashed by whoever - might fit the 30 something market, not your car !

Don't listen to all this doom and gloom about the Real Estate market, and the Car market. Be proud of your Car, the condition it's in - and wait for a guy like yourself to come along and appreciate it - and give you a fair price, the price you are asking now is more than fair, and everyone knows it. A Dealer will buy at your price and make 5-6k on your Car, why shouldn't YOU make that $$$. Yea, Cars aren't selling great right now, so what. Wait for the spring, summer, and the guy like you to come along and buy it.

And don't let others beat ya down. Your Viper is gorgeous, and is still a Car to be reckoned with. Stay the course, and don't "cave" !

Carry on...........

Tony Robbins, is that you???

Carrot for President

Thanks for the post, but I don't feel bad. The price I started out with was to get some sort of response (I was hoping for positive). I have/had room to wiggle on the price and warranty. I certainly understand that our (VCA) board has a lot of knowledgeable people and I appreciate the comments.

My purpose of the thread was to get my car shown to the people on the board and the post evolved into something else.

I'm not worried about it. If someone wants a great GTS then they will know where to come.

No worries,
Matt

funky977 said:

Thanks for the post, but I don't feel bad. The price I started out with was to get some sort of response (I was hoping for positive). I have/had room to wiggle on the price and warranty. I certainly understand that our (VCA) board has a lot of knowledgeable people and I appreciate the comments.

My purpose of the thread was to get my car shown to the people on the board and the post evolved into something else.

I'm not worried about it. If someone wants a great GTS then they will know where to come.

No worries,
Matt

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No worries here either, just not afraid to speak up for the positive side of Car ownership in general. It amazes me how the Car owner themselves, can beat down their own pricing, when they already own the same Car.

Also, if a buyer has 47k he has 50k, show the Seller some Respect is what I'm gettin at. Like I said, why let a Dealer make 5k on it.

And yes, there are lots of knowledgeable owners on this site, but when it comes to buying and selling, we're all different. We're not talking about cams or superchargers here, and this is where the experts are for those topics. I see the same thing all the time, "price too high" "saw one sell for 38k", jeeeezuz, we have one of the coolest cars around. And a low mileage, mint condition, 2001 GTS, no matter what the color is - should be 50k minimum. If you can afford to sell for an el cheapo price, then that's cool. And someone will get a great Car, at a great price. I just wanted to add something positive for a seller, instead of the typical negativity that takes over most of the time.

My .02 cent, of course.

Using Ebay as a barometer for car prices is a joke.

Seems like prices just keep sinking. Mines worth more than the going rate to me, just cause I like it. Anybody know how many GTSs' are left in the world? It was something like 6000 GTS/ACRs produced between 1996 and 2002, and I heard from Viper Days once that a high 43% get totalled. Even if thats exagerated(?), there still can't be that many of them left in existence. You'd think that prices should rise eventually, but I'm not holding my breath.

ViperJon said:

Using Ebay as a barometer for car prices is a joke.

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Manheim would be a good barometer.

Prices will rise on these cars I guarantee it! Look at some of the build numbers for these cars. They are extremely low..period. Vic, you own a 1 of 86 built car, I own a 1 of 116 built car (99 Blk RT/10 with cognac int), the list goes on and on. These cars are so very unique and you cannot compare anything on the road to them. It might take another 10 years to see a rise in values, but it will come.

I lowered my 97 RT/10 to 39,950 and I won't go any lower. I have noticed that most cars(always some exceptions) have leveled off a bit and with spring/summer around the corner, they should only rise.

When they anounce the death of the Viper this summer , all prices will jump $10K. Watch wait and see.......

I am glad somebody stepped up and said something because I was thinking the exact same thing. I don't care how the market or economy is but 47 for a low mile 01 GTS is a steal even for a red car. If I liked red I would have jumped on that sucker so freaking quick your head would be spinning. These cars have a specific audience and are very unique and even some of the rarer/nicer cars will take longer to sell than other cars. If that GTS is as nice as it sounds it will sell for 50+ without a doubt. Unless you are desperate I would hold your ground and sell it for what it is really worth because low mile pristine GTS's are far and few apart. I say jack it back up to low 50's and give it until spring and it will be gone. You may also want to consider giving Bernie at BJMotors a call and see if he can put it on his web site under consignment.

I've been watching the market. I think 47k for a 2001 with low miles is a great price. That being said, that's the list price and no one pays list. It's about the haggle and about both parties feeling they made a good deal. So it's a 45k car now. And brothuh, that's a STEAL of a price for a 2001!!!

Ha ha, no... if someone has 47k, they do not have 50k. There are plenty of people (right here on the forums, too) who have shoehorned their way into a Viper. But if you want/need X higher price, ask X higher price and sit on it. It's just a waiting game. From where I sit, the market isn't doing bad at all. That doesn't mean people in general are not still fearful and gripping their billfolds tightly. The media came out and said the magic danger words: recession, gas at all-time high, ISM lowest in memory....

None of that changes too much other than the way people are thinking. If you're looking to get a few extra bucks on the car, wait until the middle of the warm season. Then if it remains untouched, back the price off again before the season ends.

But the reverse of that other statement above is..... 47k is as good as 50k. My angle is
why stress for half a year over 3k ? That's not even a full set of rims. That's barely a set of tires and a muffler. Or a new fridge for the kitchen.

I think that what some here are reluctant to accept is that for you the car no longer matters. Family is all-important, as it should be, and you're making the right decisions it seems. I get the feeling that the guys in the house on the hill are worried at seeing their property value drop because one guy down the block parked his new boat on the lawn. Your price was fine before. Its amazing now. But I know what the car is and what the market has been. If a buyer knows that, he'll gladly pay 47k and thank you. But a new Viper guy won't know the deal you're offering. Either price is good, it WILL sell. This is just the dead time of year. Now its a waiting game.

Good luck with the sale, and all my best to you and your family. If you're following this thread, we need pics of your pride and joy.... your family!

I just think he should have stuck at 50-whatever, and bottomed out at 50k or 49k at the very least. But, hey - not mine, no big deal. But that takes care of the guy who thinks 47k is the asking price, and 45k is the buy price. I like when I see a seller say "FIRM". I know he means business, might not be your type of seller, and most pass them by - but sometimes there is a reason a seller says, I'm bottomed out - this is the price, take it or leave it. I don't agree that there is always haggle room and don't think the haggle game needs to take place every single time you buy something. Especially if the seller is saying - look, this is the 3k off the price you would have beat me down on anyway.....why ask an outrageous price to begin with - I think those games are a waste of everybody's time.

And, why stress over 3k ?? It's more like, why stress over 6k - if you're a realist. 2001 GTS, mint - Stock - should read 50k FIRM ! If someone wants it, like they should want it, I don't see the difference in 50k and 47k, at all. I do see a helluva difference in the haggling price of 53k and 47k......and I'd bet money a Dealer would list it for 55k at least, and not even have to clean it !

You dropped it too low Matt - and good luck with it, hope it goes to a great buyer, but I wouldn't listen to the, "I'll give ya 45k for it" people. You're already giving them at least 3k man. It's not about the money at all, it's about a little respect for what you're already giving up, and being nice about the sale price.

Just stickin up for ya, that's all. Do what ya gotta do.

I wouldn't sell it for a dime less than 50K, it's worth it.
Go try to find another like it somewhere with the low miles and cared for condition. And don't even mention the auctioned crap on Ebay. When I was looking for a mint B/W I checked in to a lot of the GREAT deals on Ebay. EVERY one had a story. Clean low mileage GTS's are not easy to find. Let the buyer go find one like it for 47K. Not gonna happen

I agree that this car should not be sold for that price, but if our buddy funky977 needs to sell it, 47 will get the car sold. Nobody is going to quickly come out of the woodwork and pay 50+ for that car. It is just a reality that some of you are going to have to deal with. That being said, there is no way I'd be selling my pristine 2001 with 4k miles unless I really really really had to.

You can price a car for whatever you want, it just won't sell if it is, in fact, overpriced, unless you find a sucker. The market determines what the price is, not the relatively few who frequent this site. Most here ALREADY own a Viper, and thus are extremely subjective. If you actually want to SELL your car and not sit on it for 6 or more months, you need to be aggressive in pricing it. It's competitive, and there's always another one for sale that may have an owner who truly wants to move the car.

Also, as these cars age, it will only be more difficult to finance them, and not many folks who have $50k sitting around looking for a hot car think, "OK, I'll throw it at an 8yr old model." Someone who has that kind of coin could put it down on an '08 and pay $600/mo.

Being rare does not make something valuable, either. DeLoreans, Bricklin, Yugo - all rare and not worth much. If the demand for the car was there they would have sold more initially when they were new.

Just thought I'd provide some counterpoint, since I was one of those in the market just a few months ago. I was aggressive when I sold my Procharged Z06 (sold in 3 days on the corvette forum) because I wanted to get into the Viper I had found, and didn't want to pay on a loan.

For all current Viper owners, I agree that the higher the selling prices, the better. However, if a car is properly advertised and languishes at $50K, how exactly is that market price? I always assumed that sale price was the key to establishing a market price. If the car sells by the end of the day today, it's probably under-priced. If it continues to sit dormant at $47K, maybe 45 is the right number? Who knows? I've walked away from deals for less than $1K difference, so I'm also not sure how 47 automatically means 50? Not trying to cause any trouble here, just trying to understand the logic, or apparent lack thereof. Cheers!

Rod

Someone who has that kind of coin could put it down on an '08 and pay $600/mo.

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Just what a guy doesn't need who's budget is 50k, a $600 month car payment.

not the relatively few who frequent this site

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Yep, that'd be me I guess. here we go with the resumes........

Most here ALREADY own a Viper

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aaaaahhh, I know nothing about Viper ownership.....don't care that it says "enthusiast". It didn't used to, before you got here.

so I'm also not sure how 47 automatically means 50

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If I was in the market to buy a car in that price range, I wouldn't let that amount/difference deter me from buying it, that's all.

I do agree that some people are hurting the rest of the viper owners by letting their cars go for so cheap. Luckily I think that is pretty rare. You can usually get pretty close to what you want for the car, just takes much longer to sell.

goldcup said:

Not to stir the *** but Premier in springfield Mo. has a 2000 grey/white striped coupe 9900 miles for 46900.00.I have dealt with them and they are great to deal with and their cars are typically as close to perfect as you can get.eBay Motors: Dodge : Viper (item 300196688224 end time Feb-12-08 09:53:07 PST)

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I have also been following ebay, among all the other for sale outlets, and a fellow board member's insanely clean yellow 2001 GTS with just a hair over 14K miles did not receive any takers on a $49,900 BIN price. Like it has been stated by many others previously, if you can afford to wait 6+ months, there is probably someone out there who will pony up the big $$$. Can only comment with many grains of salt added since I am unable to personally inspect all cars but sure seems to be quite a few 2000's and 2001's with low miles that are hovering right around that high 40's asking price point. Why am I not yet a Viper owner? Because I currently have my 71 GTX advertised for sale with very aggressive pricing. Like the majority of current Viper owners here, I'm in no hurry to sell. Go figure!

If nothing else, I'm finding this to be a very informative thread with regards to the Viper market. Would not think of purchasing one without visiting this place on a regular basis.

Rod

If nothing else, I'm finding this to be a very informative thread with regards to the Viper market. Would not think of purchasing one without visiting this place on a regular basis.

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That's what it's all about Lemon T. Sharing info, whether we disagree or whatever, it's all here. GTX - cool car ! But when you get the coin for a GTS, or RT10, pull the plug in this current market - coz it's a helluva Car, a lot of power, tons of torque-as you already know, and to be able to buy a car of this caliber for $40something, is simply a great buy regardless of year, color, mods, any of that stuff. The Gen II cars are still admired by a ton of people, probably still the favorite overall, and to compare this model with Yugos, DeLoreans and Bricklins, etc. is absurd to me. But whatever the case - get that Satellite sold, and jump in now, because the current jump has never been better.

Sorry, but I sense fear in this thread and a false sense of reassurance. The worst is yet to come. Hang on tight because it's not going to be pretty

Let's face it, these cars are nothing more than "toys", a luxury item if you will. Cars are not selling because people are having to pay more for gas, groceries, etc. plain and simple. Wake up! WE ARE IN A RECESSION.

I agree and the deals will be amazing,I may have to pull the trigger on a mate for my GTS!!!

dans69ss said:

Wake up! WE ARE IN A RECESSION.

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Too many V10's at casa Dave to start worrying about gas prices now.

But remember, if you park your car in the garage and put your money in the bank, then threads like this are great entertainment.

However, if you park your car in the bank and put your money in the garage, this sh_t is word.

dave6666 said:

if you park your car in the garage and put your money in the bank, then threads like this are great entertainment.

However, if you park your car in the bank and put your money in the garage, this sh_t is word.

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Dave, that quote is absolutely rich.

chimazo said:

You can price a car for whatever you want, it just won't sell if it is, in fact, overpriced, unless you find a sucker. The market determines what the price is, not the relatively few who frequent this site. Most here ALREADY own a Viper, and thus are extremely subjective. If you actually want to SELL your car and not sit on it for 6 or more months, you need to be aggressive in pricing it. It's competitive, and there's always another one for sale that may have an owner who truly wants to move the car.

Also, as these cars age, it will only be more difficult to finance them, and not many folks who have $50k sitting around looking for a hot car think, "OK, I'll throw it at an 8yr old model." Someone who has that kind of coin could put it down on an '08 and pay $600/mo.

Being rare does not make something valuable, either. DeLoreans, Bricklin, Yugo - all rare and not worth much. If the demand for the car was there they would have sold more initially when they were new.

Just thought I'd provide some counterpoint, since I was one of those in the market just a few months ago. I was aggressive when I sold my Procharged Z06 (sold in 3 days on the corvette forum) because I wanted to get into the Viper I had found, and didn't want to pay on a loan.

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I agree with this guy.

I see where venms96 is coming from in trying to protect the value of the car, but with the current market/economy things are hurting for car sales bad.

Im also amazed that yellow GTS someone mentioned earlier hasnt sold yet. That car looked showroom new. No bites at 49k? Im very surprised. If it was black or red or an ACR it would already be in my garage.

Curious as to how the "And a low mileage, mint condition, 2001 GTS, no matter what the color is - should be 50k minimum." valuation was determined? Wishful thinking? Because the car looks cool? You'd have a hard time getting a loan for that amount because no financing company would ever arrive at that value for the car.

My comment about most on this forum already owning a Viper alludes to the fact that most sales will be to NON-Viper owners, and they will be the ones looking at Ebay, KBB, etc. for an idea of what prices would be - like it or not.

What I meant by "relatively few who frequent this site" has nothing to do with resumes/length of ownership/# of posts. What ALL forum-specific sites have in common is that they create the illusion that most owners participate in said site, when the fact is, most DO NOT.

As mentioned previously, a low-mile, no stories GTS that's offered at $47k or $49k or whatever and didn't sell means that those in the market at this time deem it overpriced.

Mine is not for sale period. There are no more Viper RT-10 or GTS. Yes there are some newer srt something or others out there. I might try to pick up a 92 or early 93 Viper RT-10. GTS Bruce

Lemon_Twist said:

I have also been following ebay, among all the other for sale outlets, and a fellow board member's insanely clean yellow 2001 GTS with just a hair over 14K miles did not receive any takers on a $49,900 BIN price. Like it has been stated by many others previously, if you can afford to wait 6+ months, there is probably someone out there who will pony up the big $$$. Can only comment with many grains of salt added since I am unable to personally inspect all cars but sure seems to be quite a few 2000's and 2001's with low miles that are hovering right around that high 40's asking price point. Why am I not yet a Viper owner? Because I currently have my 71 GTX advertised for sale with very aggressive pricing. Like the majority of current Viper owners here, I'm in no hurry to sell. Go figure!

If nothing else, I'm finding this to be a very informative thread with regards to the Viper market. Would not think of purchasing one without visiting this place on a regular basis.

Rod

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I hate to get involved in these threads. But, since my car was mentioned. I feel obligated.

I did sell my car BTW.. Ended the auction early..

Having bought and sold 3 Vipers, and been in the car business. Here is the problem with these threads.. There are 2 sides to the fence. The sellers, or potential sellers. Want to believe their cars are worth something they are NOT. And the buyers, want the sellers to believe their cars are worth something they are not..

So... what are we left with? The middle... True "market value". Which is pretty tough to determine on these cars. NONE of the books(kbb,nada,galves,black book) are in line. Actually, Galves+10% is pretty close..But you have to look at ACTUAL sales as well.. Auction results+average margin,dealer sales,autotrader/cars.com actual sale prices. Then take the average..

I just went through selling my car, which was in fact, PRISTINE. And pretty low mileage (14k). I thought I was pretty realisticly priced. Given the condition was SUPERB, and way above average. Even for Viper standards. However, I did end up doing a deal, short of my asking figure. Im just not one to waste time. When I want to sell a car, I sell it... I just cant take the suspense and time consumption of having a car sit for 6 months,taking calls,etc,etc.. Could I have sold it for asking if I left it advertised for 6 months? maybe,maybe not. The true market value (at this time) for my car was, what it was....What was the problem? Weather we like it or not, Solid colors are Not the most desireable in a GTS.. Color plays a HUGE role in GTS pricing(bigger role than model year, I believe). Dodge charged $3k for the stripes. I think there is still at least a $3k(maybe more) swing in value, for stripes NOW. All else being equal.. Case in point, I had a Black/Silver striped 2000 GTS, which many on this board refer to as the "undesireable year" because of the ABS lacking, and non-forged internals. Let me tell you something. I sold that car in TWO DAYS, for my asking price. I had people fighting over it. HOT looking car... Not quite AS clean as my Yellow car. But, close.. Why? Rare color combo, No others on the market at the time.. Did not matter that it was a 2000.. Color is HUGE.. Solid color cars will not bring all the money.. You have to look at the market. Whats out there right NOW?? Unfortuneatly for me right now, there are/were SEVERAL solid yellow cars on the market. Were they as clean? NO WAY... But it didnt matter, people were glued on the price.

Someone posted a link to the 2000 GTS that Premier has. Thats a good deal, on a rare and desireable color combo.. But he obviously knows the market, and has it priced CORRECTLY for THIS market. If it were $52k, it would sit..... Good deal though. That car WILL sell!!!!.. If we saw that car 6-12 months ago. It would have been a SCREAMING STEAL!!!! Dealers would have bought at that figure.

The Good news.... Vipers STILL hold resale like NO OTHER car Ive ever seen, and will continue to do so....Think about it.. Lets use the 2000 @ Premier as an example. The car is priced @ middle/upper $40's, That car listed new for what? $72k(approx.), and probably sold for about $68k depending on the "deal" you got,maybe less... Thats nearly a 70% residual on an 8 year old car. Thats AMAZING! No other exotic/sports car even comes close to that resale. Most 3 year leases have a 50% residual. After only 3 years of ownership.. I know,I know. A Viper is limited production,low mileage,etc. But still.. Thats not too shabby. I have a 2005 Merc. E55, thats worth nearly HALF its MSRP... HALF!! The car has 10k miles on it.. Makes me sick..off topic real quick, ALWAYS LEASE AMG cars.. ALWAYS..

Bottom line is, These threads are invalid, because of each individuals agenda. And should probably avoid them all together in the future. I am pretty "into" mid-year Corvettes, and watching that market. Ever since the whole Barrett-Jackson fiasco started. Everyone thinks their car is worth $250k. Some are, MOST are NOT.... On the flip side, we shouldnt be giving stuff away either.. If you have time to wait it out, go for it. Im just too impatient.. And I DO agree... The GTS's WILL be collectable.. And Im sure I will own another one.. Probably look for another Black/Silver stripe GTS next.

ok, I've said my peace.. goodnight all..

Chipster said:

I do agree that some people are hurting the rest of the viper owners by letting their cars go for so cheap. Luckily I think that is pretty rare. You can usually get pretty close to what you want for the car, just takes much longer to sell.

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Because the Viper is so limited production, we, as owners control the market prices on these cars. If one person sells it at below market value then the next buyer will try to get a similar deal. If one keeps the mimimum price on these car at a certain level, then that would be establish as the "Viper buy-in" price. Otherwise the value of the Viper would follow the Corvette prices.