Had dinner with PVO managers, results at bottom of thread!!

shifter

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I'll be dining with James Finck (interior and electrical systems manager), Herb Helbig (PVO senior manager) and Pete Gladysz (powertrain senior manager) at an SAE function April 18th. If you guys have any specific questions for these guys, let me know and I'll try to get some answers. We will also be reviewing the car, hood to tail, in detail with them.
 

jwwiii

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Joe;

What a great opportunity! I have the 03' on order and do have a couple of questions.

1. What if any styling changes are PVO considering? The SRT is fine with me, but many are dissapointed. Subtle changes to body,etc?

2. Stripes? Would they be so kind as to submit a couple of stripe designs to us? Maybe we cert holders could place a vote? Something as simple and inexpensive as stripes could give the Viper a bit more aggressive look for those who want it. Maybe even make the stripe option a "first Year SRT" special design.

3. The Silver paint: is it the same Silver as my 98' RT and my 02' Caravan? I haven't found any info saying that this is a "New" Silver for Viper only.

4. Will all Viper dealer techs be immediately required to be trained on the new Vipers mechanicals, etc? It does seem to be a whole new machine.

5. Will there be parts promptly available for service if needed?

Thanks!

Jim Wallace
 
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shifter

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No problem, Jim. Being well submerged in the auto industry, I can tell you that the answer to numbers 4 and 5 are 'yes'. It's a requirement for production readiness, but I'll confirm.
 

kverges

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Am I the only one who wants answers to the really important questions:

1. What will be the final hosepower (is drivetrain in production trim yet)?

2. What will be the brake package and will it be robust enough to handle multiple laps at speed on a track that is ******* brakes?

3. What will the car weigh?

4. Will it have built-in harness mounting bosses?

5. Would they let me do some durability testing on a prototype to help answer the above?
 

Venom Lover

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Cool opportunity, Joe!

A follow-on to Dave's hardtop question....I hear the hardtop is coming in the middle of the model year. Will those who get their cars early be able to get the factory hardtop after the fact, and if so at the cost of the option (as opposed to at the cost of the part, which I suspect will be more).

Jim's got a good set of questions on the styling also. I know I ribbed him a little in the other thread, but I think stripes would make a big difference, so I'm also eager to hear about that.
 

bad viper

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Are they going to send an info package this month on the Comp Coupe?.Will they be painting them production colors for an extra fee as Eric indicated in Phoenix they might? Panoz
delivers all cars to a Vegas address to avoid state sales tax
problems for race cars which are not going to be registered
for street use anyhow. Can I use my Neveda address?Can the car
be fitted with Z or N rated street tires at
the factory? My use is open road racing.
 

King GTS

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Joe,

One question, in a word........GTS!!!
smile.gif
 
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shifter

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GTS was going to be my first query as well. I'll write all your questions down before I go and will do my best to get answers. I'll likely disseminate some of the questions to my engineers attending with me so I don't seem too outspoken.

I have a feeling we'll only get publicly released info, but you never know.
 

GR8_ASP

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Ask if the AutoWeek article (April 8 edition)is accurate. It quotes a top speed of 176 MPH! Don't know about you guys but I expect 50 more hp and a lower Cd (versus the RT/10) to INCREASE the top speed. 176 is what my 95 RT/10 tops out at with the roof off.

We want numbers. HP, torque, 0-60, 1/4 mile, top speed, max G's in cornering, 60-0 and 100-0 braking distance, etc. And of course if you can weasel the cost out of them it would be greatly appreciated. The AutoWeek article also quotes "less than $100,000." Better be a lot less.

Ron
 

-RUNNR

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Not Viper related, but I would like to see if there might be any chance of them making a factory Neon with no extra junk in it for Autocross, SCCA Solo I, etc...
 

Marv S

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SRT-4?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by -RUNNR:
Not Viper related, but I would like to see if there might be any chance of them making a factory Neon with no extra junk in it for Autocross, SCCA Solo I, etc...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
 

Daffy

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Thanks for asking!

My biggest question is: Hardtop, yes / no, how much & would it resemble the Comp Coupe top (scoop).


Also, I second the stripe consideration, in the pic-renditions I've seen the stripes make a very positive difference in the look.

Thanks,

Dave.
 

Mike - in Denver

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Aside from some good questions above, I would be interested in knowing...

Are the wheels final (i.e. the wheels that we have seen at the shows)?
Anything we can expect to change from the show cars? I am wondering if the exhaust tips on production cars will have better finished look (chrome on black would be nice)?
Any changes to address the running temp of the car/engine.

Thanks
 

GTS Dean

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by kverges:
Am I the only one who wants answers to the really important questions:

4. Will it have built-in harness mounting bosses?

5. Would they let me do some durability testing on a prototype to help answer the above?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Keith,

Check out the interior pics and you will notice that there are separate harness openings in the seatback below the headrest. Undoubtedly, there are threaded inserts lurking nearby.

Durability testing? I'm sure they would be pleased to accomodate your desires for a nominal fee of around $75,000. In fact, they would probably let you keep the car and do pretty much whatever you want with it...
 

vipernut

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A lot of us fell off the SRT bandwagon when the colour we originally wanted (and were supposed to get) was eliminated...SO looking forward.....I'd like to know if they plan on adding "graphite" to the colour choices in the near future??
THANKS!!
 

SRT10

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Joe, here's to summarize on some of the questions...

1) What is the MSRP of the 03 Viper?

2) Allocation on the new Vipers. Who will get the first ones?

3) Horsepower ratings...something more concrete than "at least 500 hp"

Please keep us informed Joe.
BURNOUT.gif
 

Marv S

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Joe,

The 2003 sidepipe car sounds much different from the former sidepipe roadsters. I was told there is now a balance tube (H-pipe, etc)on the exhaust. Since it's a sidepipe car It must be fairly far forward.
Can you get some info on the Balance pipe they have put on the 2003?


<UL TYPE=SQUARE>
<LI>Size if the pipe.
<LI>placement -- Before the Cats??(how was it fit to still have enough ground clearance?)
<LI>Estimated HP gain?
[/list]

Thanks
 

JonB

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Keith: I just saw the '03 SRT-10, wheels-off, at D-C AZPG, and the Brembos are indeed robust, and undergoing endurance testing there.

They went to school on Stop-Tech and have separate E-brake calipers.

Marv: There were 2 SRT-4s there as well. Patchwork bodies. Neat car and motor. SCCA has no current racing class for this car except in Auto-X.

Jim W: There were 3-4 Silver SRTs there. Hi-sparkle as the 99 Silver Viper. Very nice looking. Dunno if it is a solo color. (Graphite '02 is not solo!)
 

dadsvpr

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how about whether current viper owners who didn't buy new will have some kind of program for them to get a 2004 srt at $500 over invoice. seems only fair.....

Jason
 

Steve Ferguson

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The magazine test results from the mules are supposed to be in June/July editions. PR would not reveal which magazines were doing the tests, so you can probably guess that the standard or traditional ones will all be covering the results.

As for 2004 models at $500 over invoice, Dodge would simply say that anything like that would be in violation of franchise laws, since it constitutes price fixing, and that would get Dodge in a whole heap of trouble.
 

dadsvpr

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uhm, what i really meant was a question whether there is the possibility of extending to the rest of the viper owners what just original owners on record, currently still on record with chrysler got this year, an ability to have a preferred opportunity to order, then pay whatever it is those who are taking delivery of their 2003's. Some of which dealers have proactively quoted as low as $500 over invoice.

wouldn't venture to suggest price fixing, etc.

the fellow i bought mine from just missed his opportunity by a month because i was so diligent in processing the paperwork to chrysler. he was a pretty nice guy, he probably would have extended to me his option if he had it or i asked. i wouldn't dream of bending the rules any other way but do feel with the slim timing of my purchase and the conditions of the program that it was unfortunate timing.

Jason
 
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shifter

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Hey Guys,
Had the dinner with the PVO boys last night, and I have some disappointing news. I didn't get most of the answers to your questions, as I presumed. They were pretty strict about not divulging any information that was press sensitive. It seems that the press will get the car soon, and then there will be a steady flow of information. Interestingly, John Coletti was there as well, and the look on his face during some of the conversations was a tell tale sign he has some work to do.

Having said that, here's some information that I did get, and my impression (sorry if this is old news):

There were a few goals and objectives of the SRT10:

0-100-0 equal to or better than the original 427 Shelby Cobra (13.2 seconds I believe), 0-60 in under 4.0 (goal for GEN I was 4.5)
60 - 0 in 100ft or less
1.0G continuous lateral acceleration
Lower weight (100lbs or 1 class)
Improved interior comfort (Better top that doesn't leak (they made quite a few jokes about the current soft top); Functional A/C (current one is full hot or full cold); Better Audio; dead pedal.
Better brakes
Make money doing it (emphasized by Wolfgang)

They said this list was derived from interviews with the VCA and various enthusiasts, so if you disagree, you didn't speak loud enough I guess.

To accomplish the above, here's what they did (in no particular order):
Extensive use of magnesium. The SRT has the largest 1-piece stamped mg panel in production. The dash support panel and part of the rear bulkhead I believe is mg. Also the top support and some misc. chassis pieces. There are also some carbon fiber panels in the engine compartment. Total weight save over GEN II is 100lbs, with a larger vehicle and more content.

The door glass is a smart glass system. It will travel down 1/8" approx when the door is opened and closed to support the 'U' channel top sealing strategy (like the XK8 convertible).

There is a built in Battery life extender for people who enjoy Garage Queens

Both driving lights (high and low) are true HID

6 disc in dash CD with 7 channel amp (8 speakers total)
Fully adjustable pedals with adjustable dead pedal

Flat blade wipers (looked hi-tec)

SRT is 2" wider and 2.5" longer than the GEN II. The biggest reason for the length is the convertible top. It makes the top more functional and stable.

Extensive CAE and FEA done on the chassis which resulted in a 31% increase in torsional stiffness without adding any weight.
7% reduced drag

200MPH rated run flat tires (19" rear, 18" front)

20% larger front calipers and rotors. Larger rear calipers and rotors as well (don't know how much exactly)

Enhanced ABS with an electronic proportioning valve

Aluminum 2 row (52mm) radiator with a 2.5kw Hydraulic cooling fan! Radiator top water temp reduced by 10 degrees. Fan motor supported by power steering pump.

Exhaust was wild. Biscuits in front (after collector) and mufflers/cats in the very rear (in the valence). Though it has side exhaust, the pipes actually run to the rear of the car, with a crossover or balance tube, and then back to the side. Might make for an expensive aftermarket cat-back.

Cracked Steel rods in the engine

Road race type oil pan

Injection molded gaskets

Roller rockers

1999 spec cam (better HP with the new heads)

Single, dual bore throttle body (improved velocity for better drivability and 'torque smoothing')

Torque range is 1600 rpm to 5600 rpm

Actual HP and Torque couldn't be revealed, but I did see a graph with out detailed axis number. However, from eyeballing it HP looks like it is at about 505 or so, and torque at about 510 to 515 at least.

Same tremec 6 speed trans

Heat treated gear set with a single piece counter shaft

Dana 44 Spread bearing diff

Heavy Duty CV joints

A few more comments:

When asked about the GTS, the reply was "we are building 25 competition coupes for race purposes"
The engine will be built at CAAP along side the car.

DCX has employed a technique called 'Panel net build strategy' to assemble the car. From what I understand, they basically use body and chassis parts to align the next operation instead of using fixtures. They said 'no more shimming' and 'much improved fit and finish'

No comment on colors, sorry

PVO said they thought they hit a home run with everyone but the VCA. The claimed that the VCA simply loved the GEN I and II cars so much, no change in looks would have been well received. They felt that the styling would grow on us, especially after we get a chance to drive the car and witness it's performance.

DISCLAIMER: This is all from memory, so I'm hoping I have it all correct. If not, I apologize.

My impression:

From a styling perspective, I didn't like the car. Too refined. Funky panel lines, rear was best described by another engineer as "camaro-ish", exposed top looked odd, sill panel looked out of place, especially with the vents at the hood marriage. Hood was dreadful compared to GEN II. You can tell that the car is longer and wider. Wheel wells are much better filled, and the some of the interior and exterior trim pieces look odd (grille over A/C air intake). Rear diffuser looked cool, but not good enough to improve the overall look from behind. Tach is larger and centered, and the speaker arrangement was intriguing. Stainless bezels around the radio and A/C head would have looked cool. The bezels around the gages are 100% metal with real Allen screws (for the price, they should be).

My Conclusion: From an engineering perspective, this is one hell of a car; from a Sports Car performance perspective, this is one HELL OF A CAR. The question then becomes can you get past the 'mature' looks (mature was used by PVO in describing the styling change, the better A/C etc). For 10G more than the 2002 (rumor, not a quote from PVO), you must decide for yourself.

Cheers.
 

Steve Ferguson

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Joe, just to add a few things:

The top material has a hard section, pretty much from the roll hoop to the windshield, that is made with a die-cast magnesium.

The presentation was great, and will be shown at VOI 7.
 

Vypr GT2

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Did Mr. Coletti have anything to say about the GT-40, especially anything about first year build numbers?
 

GTS Dean

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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by shifter:

My impression:

From a styling perspective, I didn't like the car. ...sill panel looked out of place, especially with the vents at the hood marriage.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thank you. I'm not alone.
 
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shifter

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A couple people have sent me e-mails about my comments regarding the size of the car. Side by side, you can easily tell a difference between the GEN II and the SRT. Both in width and length. However, one of the reasons it doesn't hit you when looking at the SRT from behind, in my opinion, is the lack of visible tire. Behind my GEN II, you see 2 fat tires and instantly know the car must be able to make good use of them. Behind the SRT, due to the styling and the splitter, you can't see the meaty tires as well. The stark contrast isn't there.

Just another example of 'refinement' for the SRT.

Also, yes it does seem as though you have to open the trunk to get the top out. No pulling over and reaching around. One center latch.
 

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