How is the ACR oiling system different from GTS

[vegasviper]

Would like to convert my GTS to ACR oiling

 

[Viper Specialty]

Oil filter adaptor is the only difference. The ACR's were supposed to come with Anti-Slosh oil pans, but it never actually happened.

 

[vegasviper]

And what difference does that make from the ACR?

 

[Silver Snake]

Oil is allowed to circulate through the oil cooler all the time, instead of only higher temps.

Mark

 

[vegasviper]

Any special wiring or is it that simple to bot on the adaptor.



Any idea at what temp. does the oil go into cooler on the GTS?

 

[VPRVENM97]

Partsrack sells the ACR oil filter adaptor for $259.

Detailed How-To instructions (and photos) by Henry and Janni Cone HERE

 

[GTS Bruce]

The oil flow in a GTS is not temp related its pressure valve regulated.When oil pressure drops no oil goes to the cooler like in when stopped in traffic to maximize AC performance.BUT could also happen when you need it most on a continuous high g corner when the oil isn't being picked up.So saftey sake I have the acr adaptor and a baffled pan with a different windage and scraper tray.The baffles are just doors that screw in and only allow oil to flow toward the pick up not away from it.Both are good at least for peace of mind and Jon B has all the parts you need. Bruce

 

[Ron]

Note that the ACR adaptor is not recommended (by Dodge) for cold weather driving.

 

[viperama]

What means "cold weather"?

We have a average of 80°F in summer.

 

[Viper Specialty]

No specific number is put on it. Just make sure if you plan to drive the car in freezing temparatures that the engine is FULLY warmed up before you start on your way. the adapter is not recomended by dodge for cold weather because the wind-chill on the oil cooler of a cold engine can drop the oil temp below -54 degrees or so, which will cause the oil to thicken excessively.

I also recomend that if you do have an ACR adapter, and do drive in the cold, keep it a gear down at all times- it will help keep things a little warmer. 6th gear could allow temps to drop into dangerous territry of the temp is low enough.

 

[Ron]

Daniel,

Where do you get this stuff?

The "not suitable for cold weather" comment from Dodge is based on the oil not getting hot enough for evaporation of moisture and fuel dilution. The only effect that wind has on inanimate objects (like oil coolers) is that it shortens the time that it takes the object to cool to the actual air temperature. No amount of wind can cool an object down below the ambient wind temperature.

25 degree air temp + 150 MPH wind = 25 degrees to an inanimate object like a thermometer or oil cooler.

Running the engine up to operating temp before driving would have little positive effect as the oil in an ACR application would quickly cool below optimimum in cold weather. Running 1 gear higher would also do nothing but decrease your gas mileage.

The only plausible solution would be to decrease oil change intervals and / or partially block the oil cooler during colder months.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Also, Daniel, it's the "slump" time that affects cold oil performance. Sucking oil into the pickup tube (and how fast the oil runs into the pan, refills the volume of oil sucked into the pump) is the limiting factor, not excessive pressure on the downstream side of a positive displacement pump. Therefore running the oil pump at a higher speed (higher engine speed) would be even more prone to cause a lubrication failure.

 

[Viper Specialty]

Daniel,

Where do you get this stuff?

This is what I get from technitions who work with cars here in the winter time- I dont. (specific experience was from another vehicle that had its oil cooler thermostat stick open during an extreme cold snap around here- no oil would pass through the cooler) I figure they may know what they are talking about, guess I was wrong. I just took what they said as "good reasoning" and left it at that. The problem and exact answer was not one I have really run into before. However, I can still see how they came to the conclusion in hindsight, especially after adding what you had added. If the adaptor indeed allowed the oil to remain cool enough to retain moisture, then certainly that same moisture, when enough of it accumulated, could freeze in the system and cause flow restrictions- especially if the oil cooler has a lower reservoir where any moisture could accumulate after driving and then freeze.

I didnt even think about the fact that wind chill cant cool beyond ambient temparature, which would have discredited his original guess and reasoning to Dodge's decision. (In fact, I can't BELIEVE I didnt even think it all the way through) Honestly, the first example of "wind chill" that popped into my head was how gas flowing at a high rate of speed from a compressor or the like has the ability to "freeze up", but I completely forgot that the underlying cause if that is due to gas expansion being endothermic.

TOM- do you think that oil re-entering the block, even at below 32 degrees (like if coming back from a cooler in dead of winter), the oil will remain at a low enough temparature to cause this "slump" effect you are refering to? wouldnt the heat of the block alone it is flowing through and over as it runs back to the pan be enough to keep it heated to at least flow with enough speed to keep up? I can see how that could happen in a cold engine, but I would think in a hot engine, by the time the oil was running back towards the pan, it would have been sufficiently warm? Basically, at that point, wouldnt it be working very much like an oil-cooled engine does?

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Daniel, we are all getting to extreme examples. What I meant to get across is that a cold oil failure (whether at really sub-zero temperatures or from excessive cooling) is more likely to occur from not picking up enough oil rather than not being able to pump it through the engine. At 32F, no oil is going to really have a problem - I use diesel 15W40 safely down to 5F. It was just meant to say what happens first, not necessarily at what temperature.

Also, to clear something else up, the dispersants in oil will hold water and keep it "dispersed" so it does not separate and freeze. It may turn to white mayonaise (take a look at the inside of an oil fill cap in the winter) but won't let water "puddle" and from an ice block. Oil tests to qualify for the API symbol are run such to generate 5%-10% water in the oil and it does not form layers.

 

[Viper Specialty]

TOM- Then what in your opinion could have caused what the Tech's had experienced? I was there when they were diagnosing it. All I know is the the cooler thermostat had been stuck open for what could have been a long time, and oil would not flow through the cooler if you allowed the car to sit in freezing (but was sub-zero F at the time) temperatures and the engine was started. Cure was a new Oil Cooler Thermostat and an oil change. Could it have retained enough water over time that it indeed WAS forming an immovable sludge? It was not a Viper, so God knows what kind of oil had been in it.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

I'm sorry, I don't even know if that thermostat was redirecting all the oil through that cooler or not - if like the Viper non-ACR Gen 1 thermostat, then a blocked oil cooler would block all oil flow, I think. If the vehicle being worked on had old, wet oil and had no oil pressure until new oil and a thermostat, then I would still say that the sludgy stuff wasn't running down the crankcase fast enough to refill the pan - maybe not running down at all. I've seen a few taxi engines that ran until you shut them down; the sludge would solidify and next start was without oil. I'll still go a answer with sludge that doesn't flow under force of gravity before a sludge that can resist oil pressure.

 

[vegasviper]

So. how about the ACR that came with the factory AC, do they have the ACR adaptor ro the GTS do to AC?

 

[Viper Specialty]

ACR's have the ACR adapter, regaurdless if they are equipped with A/C or not. A/C performance suffers slightly from this.