I RACED W/NEWZ06 SUNDAY, WARNING SRT10 ITS NOT GOOD NEWS

Ranger

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:D Hey Ranger,

The guys that "Track" their cars... appreciate talking to & sharing information and "tips" from one another.

:rolleyes: The keyboard Jockey's aren't interested in track facts.. they just want some....

Cheese with their Whine !!! :smirk:

Yawn... I don't remember all the bragging before the 06 year. hmmm...

I guess you vette guys just started tracking cars this year. :rolleyes:

Quite the contrary. Were you to use the search function, you'd see that I've been drag racing my Z06s for the past five years and posted here in Spring 2004 after attending one of Jason Heffner's track rentals at MIR. A great time hanging with car guys. Mine the only Vette. So I've been posting here for a couple years. Here's a link, if just by chance you care about the facts.

Here is one of my first posts on page 7 of http://vca2.viperclub.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB7&Number=389853&Forum=All_Forums&Words=&Match=Entire%20Phrase&Searchpage=2&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=291960&Search=true#Post389853

Hey Guys.

Just saw this thread.

We all know that to get the most out of a traction limited car...the driver is the main ingedient.

My 02 Z06 has a best pass bone stock(zero mod; and stock original tires) of 11.81. Slip It has a bunch of passes in the 11.8s and 11.9s.

I had the opportunity to run my my car (bone stock EXCEPT drag radials and a cold air intake; 363 rwhp and 350 rwtq) at one of Jason Heffner's private track rentals (Maryland International Raceway; November 15, 2002) for some of his Viper customers and others.

So we had a bunch of Gen 1 and 2 Vipers at the same track, same day, plus my Z06. Great time. Great bunch of car enthusiasts.

Density Altitude throughout the day was 400 to 500'. Air temp was high 50s-low 60s. Humidity was 50-60%.

So what did my Z06 run that day? Here are 15 runs in sequence with the 60' times included:

11.568 @ 117.94 on a 1.684 60'
11.651 @ 118.44 on a 1.728 60'
11.755 @ 117.80 on a 1.805 60'
11.707 @ 119.46 on a 1.704 60'
11.640 @ 118.16 on a 1.693 60'
11.715 @ 117.73 on a 1.752 60'
11.700 @ 118.04 on a 1.743 60'
11.778 @ 119.46 on a 1.797 60'
11.748 @ 119.38 on a 1.777 60'
11.726 @ 117.53 on a 1.774 60'
11.719 @ 117.49 on a 1.722 60'
11.742 @ 116.97 on a 1.756 60'
11.763 @ 116.87 on a 1.735 60'
11.766 @ 117.05 on a 1.776 60'
11.786 @ 116.99 on a 1.756 60'

My car was getting pretty heat-soaked as the day wore on and the launch surface got progressively "run-off." Jason can vouch this. Also Jamie Furman, who owns a blue GTS.

BTW, with the DRs and CAI the car has 75 passes in the 11.7s or better with a best of 11.55 Slip. (Jamie Furman witnessed this pass). My best trap is 120.54...at DA of 62 feet. Slip

I admire your Vipers very much, and they are very fast, especially in the hands of the right driver. Conversely, a Z06 can be very fast too with the right driver doing the launch and shifts.

Safe racing to all of you.

Ranger

Ranger
 

GR8_ASP

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I agree that Ranger has been here before and I do not believe the information he brings is bad for the VCA site or Vipering in general. I applaud the efforts he has made with the vette. Unfortunately there is no equivalent within the Viper community that I am aware of. Yes we have drag racers but most upgrade their cars to way beyond stock condition.

My most significant regret is that the bench racers out there conclude that Rangers numbers are possible by them, and since there is no comparable "optimized" Viper number for comparison conclude that they should win any race, and by a significant margin. That was true with the C5Z06, and even moreso now with the C6 Z06. The truth is the cars are so closely matched now that it comes down to the driver in most cases.
 

Ranger

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Among severely traction-limited cars, I certainly agree that it will always come down to the drivers whatever the venue. Times will vary dramatically depending on the skill and experience of the drivers.

Ranger
 

Warfang

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I agree that Ranger has been here before and I do not believe the information he brings is bad for the VCA site or Vipering in general.

No... he's only been around since all the 06 z06 hubub started. Like I've said... the insecurity displayed is transparent. 10 years and not a peep... then the 06 z06 comes out and he's Tarzan. puh-lease! The information he brings is not "bad"... it's just irrelevant. I understand the keyboard-warrioring of Ranger and his flunkies here, but have the courtesy of just pointing to the vette site for his response... I don't care to read it here. I find their posts as irritating and pointless as when one of our guys go to their site to stir **** up.

This has nothing to do with his skills or how great the z06 is. Both stand on their own merits... to go out of his way to point it out, especially his own achievements, is eye-rollingly pathetic. :rolleyes:
 

KWIK96

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I am sorry. I must have this all wrong. Probably all that cheese and whine I ate.
Why don't we just add a forum called Z06, that way we won't interfere with the SRT threads, then invite Ranger to VOI (sorry my bad ZOI) A workshop on how to get the best out of our Z06's is just what we need. Book now to avoid disappointment. Be careful Fred he may be after your job
 

outnumbered

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For those of you that don't know Ranger he is only doing the same that your very own Wanted is doing.Which by the way I know.Believe me Ranger is no way the bragger(troll) some are making him out to be.His first comment to anyone here was in response to a legitimate question on fuel.We have the same issue on the Corvette forum.We have bench racers,waxers,real racers,engineers wantabe's etc.I think on the Corvette forum there are more people that don't own a Vette and promote their own favorite car.There is no hidden aggenda.Two great drivers which are enthusiast are having a gentlemans shoot out.This has much less to do with the cars than the drivers themselves.
This is a drivers race.

Ranger I commend you for your strenght & self control to not over react to some of the comments.As on the Corvette Forum you have remained a gentleman and a class act.
 

Warfang

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For those of you that don't know Ranger he is only doing the same that your very own Wanted is doing.Which by the way I know.Believe me Ranger is no way the bragger(troll) some are making him out to be.His first comment to anyone here was in response to a legitimate question on fuel.We have the same issue on the Corvette forum.We have bench racers,waxers,real racers,engineers wantabe's etc.I think on the Corvette forum there are more people that don't own a Vette and promote their own favorite car.There is no hidden aggenda.Two great drivers which are enthusiast are having a gentlemans shoot out.This has much less to do with the cars than the drivers themselves.
This is a drivers race.

Ranger I commend you for your strenght & self control to not over react to some of the comments.As on the Corvette Forum you have remained a gentleman and a class act.

If Wanted trolls the vette boards on how great his times and techniques are, and how great the Viper is over and over again, I'd have a little less respect for him too. My impression of Ranger went from extreme admiration, to indifference, to annoyance. Now I just feel sorry for him that he needs the attention.

It's not to say we don't welcome other views and owners of other cars' posts here. But if all you are is a one trick pony, you're not offering much to the discussion. Seems he had nothing to say before the 06 model was announced. I actually wasted a little time and looked at his post history... it's nothing but how great the z06 is and how well he drives. Take a single post on it's own, and you can respect what he says, but to pound it over and over again on every post, you realize GM marketing couldn't have sent in a better troll, or this guy is a legend in his own mind.

He's the guy at the party that always did thing better than you not matter what you say. The oneupper... :D

Ranger= http://www.gamekillers.com/profiles/oneupper.html
 

Ranger

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...It's not to say we don't welcome other views and owners of other cars' posts here. But if all you are is a one trick pony, you're not offering much to the discussion. Seems he had nothing to say before the 06 model was announced. I actually wasted a little time and looked at his post history... it's nothing but how great the z06 is and how well he drives. Take a single post on it's own, and you can respect what he says, but to pound it over and over again on every post, you realize GM marketing couldn't have sent in a better troll, or this guy is a legend in his own mind.

He's the guy at the party that always did thing better than you not matter what you say. The oneupper...

Warfang, suggest you forget about a career transition to sales.

Ranger
 

outnumbered

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I personally still don't see him as a troll.If that were true he would be attacking anything he could.That is not the case.I think this all transpired due to him and Tommy Tom Wanted meeting at the track and both shared a common respect for each others driving abilities.All the other stuff I am not touching.He can defend himself.
 

Warfang

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I personally still don't see him as a troll.If that were true he would be attacking anything he could.That is not the case.I think this all transpired due to him and Tommy Tom Wanted meeting at the track and both shared a common respect for each others driving abilities.All the other stuff I am not touching.He can defend himself.
He's just boring... nothing new to say. You can cut and paste any of his posts. They're interchangable.
 

Ranger

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I personally still don't see him as a troll.If that were true he would be attacking anything he could.That is not the case.I think this all transpired due to him and Tommy Tom Wanted meeting at the track and both shared a common respect for each others driving abilities.All the other stuff I am not touching.He can defend himself.

Hi outnumbered. Thanks for your kind words a few posts earlier.

Warfang has hurled invectives my way on several threads over time, Nothing new about his hostile attitude on this one. Suspect his discourtesy toward guests is a habit members are aware of.

Ranger
 

Warfang

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I personally still don't see him as a troll.If that were true he would be attacking anything he could.That is not the case.I think this all transpired due to him and Tommy Tom Wanted meeting at the track and both shared a common respect for each others driving abilities.All the other stuff I am not touching.He can defend himself.

Hi outnumbered. Thanks for your kind words a few posts earlier.

Warfang has hurled invectives my way on several threads over time, Nothing new about his hostile attitude on this one. Suspect his discourtesy toward guests is a habit members are aware of.

Ranger
I've been nothing but fair in my observations. Your skills are admirable, as is the car you drive. I've never denied that. It's just your constant tooting of your own horn that gets old. You'd do better inviting the people who are interested in your endeavors to the vette boards. Coming here to do it is just tacky. You don't go to a man's home to tell him how great your own house is. :rolleyes:
 

Ranger

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Was asked in a PM to elaborate on the content of a typical check list for the drag strip. Here goes:

After Tech Inspection

Adjust front and rear tire psi to conditions. (log numbers)

Change fluid in clutch master cylinder if it’s less than perfectly clear.

Conduct at least ten sets of the shifting drill.

Check track-surface temperature, wind speed/direction, and DA. (log numbers)

Walk both lanes to the 660’ mark.

Double-check seat/steering wheel positions for proper clutch access.

Manage water temp <190 degrees at the line. (log number)

Manage oil temp to >120 degrees at the line. (log number)


For the Pass

Keep front tires dry.

Heat rear tires properly by adjusting burnout duration to conditions.

Make minimal-depth stage.

Choose proper launch-RPM for conditions, and adjust from previous passes. (log number)

Make proper clutch release.

Squeeze throttle to remain hooked.

Make proper shift points (near limiter) and strong shifts. (log shift points)

Stay in the racing groove to minimize spin on shifts.

Execute a very strong shift to 4th gear no matter how close to the traps.

Stay on the throttle past the traps.

Enter log notes about the pass upon return to the pits.

Before leaving the drag strip, return the tires to stock psi and erase the car number from the windshield and side window.

Ranger
 

Warfang

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Was asked in a PM to elaborate on the content of a typical check list for the drag strip. Here goes:

After Tech Inspection

Adjust front and rear tire psi to conditions. (log numbers)

Change fluid in clutch master cylinder if it’s less than perfectly clear.

Conduct at least ten sets of the shifting drill.

Check track-surface temperature, wind speed/direction, and DA. (log numbers)

Walk both lanes to the 660’ mark.

Double-check seat/steering wheel positions for proper clutch access.

Manage water temp <190 degrees at the line. (log number)

Manage oil temp to >120 degrees at the line. (log number)


For the Pass

Keep front tires dry.

Heat rear tires properly by adjusting burnout duration to conditions.

Make minimal-depth stage.

Choose proper launch-RPM for conditions, and adjust from previous passes. (log number)

Make proper clutch release.

Squeeze throttle to remain hooked.

Make proper shift points (near limiter) and strong shifts. (log shift points)

Stay in the racing groove to minimize spin on shifts.

Execute a very strong shift to 4th gear no matter how close to the traps.

Stay on the throttle past the traps.

Enter log notes about the pass upon return to the pits.

Before leaving the drag strip, return the tires to stock psi and erase the car number from the windshield and side window.

Ranger
Hey... that was pretty interesting and informative. Thanks for sharing. :2tu:
 

SRT10_SWISS

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I found this post in the Z06 forum back im 2003. I think no additional coment is needed....


<font color="blue"> This is the real deal! I was right behind Ranger. Sitting in the water box ready to do a burnout. I watched from launch to lights coming on.

It was a great launch, especially for stock tires. No spin to speak of. The shifts to 2nd, 3rd, &amp; 4th were solid and without tire spin. That really surprised me. But when the lights came on with 11.81, I just started screaming and cussing in amazement and frustration ( I was not on my game). The starter was laughing at me. I could not match Ranger's times and I was on drag radials and I have a Vortex air box.

Ranger and I have been on the same dyno back to back. The dyno shows 6 more HP for him when both of us have cold air boxes on.

Just goes to show you that Ranger is a DRIVER!!

Way to go, John. </font>
 

Black SRT

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Ranger,

Interesting thread, and I appreciate your willingness to help others improve their game. I notice that you don’t mention power-shifting, but it’s hard to believe you could attain those times without it. Do you power-shift all gears? I’d also be interested in hearing your technique for heating the tires.

Thanks again for the advise!
 

Ranger

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Ranger,

Interesting thread, and I appreciate your willingness to help others improve their game. I notice that you don’t mention power-shifting, but it’s hard to believe you could attain those times without it. Do you power-shift all gears? I’d also be interested in hearing your technique for heating the tires.

Thanks again for the advise!

Thanks for the kind words, Black SRT.

Powershifting is very much a mixed bag.

(1) Power shifting won't lower your times unless the traction is extremely good. That generally doesn’t happen on Corvette stock tires. On drag radials that are well-heated and with very good track prep, traction will definitely support a power shift from 3d to 4th, and 2d to 3d, but not necessarily the 1st to 2d. Try it both ways and see which is faster. Just remember if the power shift makes the tires spin, some easing of the throttle may make them spin less, which may lower the ET.

(2) Power shifting definitely increases the risk of damage to the tranny. Most of the Z06 racers I know personally that power shift have had their trannies rebuilt or replaced. My trannies have been fine so far; but I power shift ONLY when conditions reward it. Otherwise, I shift very fast but ease the throttle.

Making strong shifts work well requires very fast leg speed and well coordinated movements of the right hand and clutch foot.

It take practice to get the moving parts of a very fast shift synchronized. Leg speed governs the pace. The legs (clutch and throttle) must move in two directions. The shfter hand moves in only one direction. And the movements need to occur fast and in proper sequence. Practice, practice, practice.

My experience has been that the magic to strong shifts under heavy acceleration is to practice, practice, practice. To reduce wear, I practice with the engine off and omit the throttle but include the clutch. 1-2, 2-3, 3-4...repeat. Sets of five. I do perhaps 50 sets per week and then 10 sets between passes in the staging lanes. This routine embeds muscle memory and makes each shift a preparatory queue for the next.

On the C6Z particularly, I always ensure the oil temp is above 100 degrees, before banging the shift drills. With that in mind, good time to bang through the drill is at the completion of the daily commute to and from the office.

Heating the tires with a burnout is necessary for drag radials and improves traction on C6Z06 stock runflats.

Drive around the water, back into the waterbox and immediately spin the tires just enough to get a full rotation of them, but NOT enough to throw water up into the wheel wells.

Roll forward out of the water few feet; but do NOT roll so far as to put the rear wheels onto the rubber/VHT prepped area.

Put the 6-speed in 2d gear.

Drop the clutch and feed the throttle and (if necessary), quickly lightly apply the brakes with your left foot. I don’t always need the brakes but sometimes it's helpful for keeping the rear end from walking sideways.

Bring the rpm to about 5000 until the tires smoke strongly and start to grab and the rpm starts being drawn down. At that point, back out of the throttle and (if applied) release the brake, and you'll roar forward. The tires are heated. I don't count seconds but just spin them strongly until they smoke and begin to grab hard.

Takes a little practice. But remember, if you botch the burn-out, DON'T retry it with dry tires. Doing that will likely glaze the clutch...or worse.

Ranger
 

outnumbered

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Ranger,

Interesting thread, and I appreciate your willingness to help others improve their game. I notice that you don’t mention power-shifting, but it’s hard to believe you could attain those times without it. Do you power-shift all gears? I’d also be interested in hearing your technique for heating the tires.

Thanks again for the advise!

Thanks for the kind words, Black SRT.

Powershifting is very much a mixed bag.

(1) Power shifting won't lower your times unless the traction is extremely good. That generally doesn’t happen on Corvette stock tires. On drag radials that are well-heated and with very good track prep, traction will definitely support a power shift from 3d to 4th, and 2d to 3d, but not necessarily the 1st to 2d. Try it both ways and see which is faster. Just remember if the power shift makes the tires spin, some easing of the throttle may make them spin less, which may lower the ET.

(2) Power shifting definitely increases the risk of damage to the tranny. Most of the Z06 racers I know personally that power shift have had their trannies rebuilt or replaced. My trannies have been fine so far; but I power shift ONLY when conditions reward it. Otherwise, I shift very fast but ease the throttle.

Making strong shifts work well requires very fast leg speed and well coordinated movements of the right hand and clutch foot.

It take practice to get the moving parts of a very fast shift synchronized. Leg speed governs the pace. The legs (clutch and throttle) must move in two directions. The shfter hand moves in only one direction. And the movements need to occur fast and in proper sequence. Practice, practice, practice.

My experience has been that the magic to strong shifts under heavy acceleration is to practice, practice, practice. To reduce wear, I practice with the engine off and omit the throttle but include the clutch. 1-2, 2-3, 3-4...repeat. Sets of five. I do perhaps 50 sets per week and then 10 sets between passes in the staging lanes. This routine embeds muscle memory and makes each shift a preparatory queue for the next.

On the C6Z particularly, I always ensure the oil temp is above 100 degrees, before banging the shift drills. With that in mind, good time to bang through the drill is at the completion of the daily commute to and from the office.

Heating the tires with a burnout is necessary for drag radials and improves traction on C6Z06 stock runflats.

Drive around the water, back into the waterbox and immediately spin the tires just enough to get a full rotation of them, but NOT enough to throw water up into the wheel wells.

Roll forward out of the water few feet; but do NOT roll so far as to put the rear wheels onto the rubber/VHT prepped area.

Put the 6-speed in 2d gear.

Drop the clutch and feed the throttle and (if necessary), quickly lightly apply the brakes with your left foot. I don’t always need the brakes but sometimes it's helpful for keeping the rear end from walking sideways.

Bring the rpm to about 5000 until the tires smoke strongly and start to grab and the rpm starts being drawn down. At that point, back out of the throttle and (if applied) release the brake, and you'll roar forward. The tires are heated. I don't count seconds but just spin them strongly until they smoke and begin to grab hard.

Takes a little practice. But remember, if you botch the burn-out, DON'T retry it with dry tires. Doing that will likely glaze the clutch...or worse.

Ranger
Ranger you can't be all that bad.It is awful nice of you to share your years of perfecting your driving skills.I think it is time to write a book. :2tu: :nana:
 

29OUTLAW

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Takes a little practice.

Ranger

This is exactly what everyone tells me when I bring up the subject of drag racing. The problem is that I don’t make enough money to “practice” in an $80K car. I guess my greatest Viper accomplishment will remain picking up groceries.
 

Black SRT

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Ranger,

I thank you for your unselfish contributions to the sport of drag racing. Thanks again for the info, and good luck retaining your titles.

Rick M.
 

Warfang

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Ranger,

I thank you for your unselfish contributions to the sport of drag racing.
I have to agree... the last couple posts shows your value to the site. Makes me want to take up drag racing one of these days. I'd rather be a fan than a critic. :2tu:
 

agentf1

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Wow, a very enlightening thread, in more ways than one. Thanks for sharing some of your techniques Ranger. :2tu:
 

Ranger

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Thanks for the kind words, gents.

Have learned through the years that car guys, even of cross-brand species, usually learn stuff from each other. But the keyboard some times gets in the way.

Ranger
 

ViperJames

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Park a Vette and a Viper next to each other. Which one would you rather have? VIPER VIPER VIPER VIPER. GEN 1, GEN 2 or GEN 3...Viper
 

forensicsteve

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I sold my GTS a couple of months ago. Until my lower back heals, I have had to find another driver-seating arrangement. Starting to think about the srt10 as my back improves.

I don't race....don't know how...but enjoy reading about those that do. Spending more time now reading the srt10 forums...and I see it as a bonus when a relative expert offers info on another high-performance vehicle brand.
 

GARY J

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Ranger,
I just got to this thread, because I mainly stay over at the Alley nowadays. You, my friend, are the real deal. A true racer. I can remember our days over at the CF. You have laid down some truly impressive numbers at the strip. Kudos to you for keeping your cool in this thread. The haters need to **** and pay attention. At least he is at the track layin it down. Again, congrats to Ranger for putting down some kick ass numbers, and to Wanted for putting it on the line!

GJ
 

Warfang

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I sold my GTS a couple of months ago. Until my lower back heals, I have had to find another driver-seating arrangement. Starting to think about the srt10 as my back improves.

I don't race....don't know how...but enjoy reading about those that do. Spending more time now reading the srt10 forums...and I see it as a bonus when a relative expert offers info on another high-performance vehicle brand.

We missed you steve. Hope that back heals up soon. :2tu:
 

Ranger

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Ranger,
I just got to this thread, because I mainly stay over at the Alley nowadays. You, my friend, are the real deal. A true racer. I can remember our days over at the CF. You have laid down some truly impressive numbers at the strip. Kudos to you for keeping your cool in this thread. The haters need to **** and pay attention. At least he is at the track layin it down. Again, congrats to Ranger for putting down some kick ass numbers, and to Wanted for putting it on the line!

GJ

HEFFNER TWIN TURBO FE-GTS (THE NEW BIG RED)
HEFFNER TWIN TURBO SRT-10 (10.65 @ 148.19MPH ON 20'S)
8.75 @ 163MPH IN RIPPER02'S HEFFNER TWIN TURBO MONSTER

Thanks, Gary. And since the CF days, you've manage to assemble an awesome group of Jason's TT creations. Congratulation on the acquisitions and the passes. I watched Jason put some test passes on one of his early TT at Capitol Raceway and was almost dumbstruck at the acceleration the car produced. Definitely a man's car.

Take care,

Ranger
 
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