Water/**** Injection System Pics

[litemup]

Just finished installing the Snow Performance Stage 3 Water/**** injection system. Thought I would post up some pics to see what you guys thought.

I tapped the windshield washer fluid tank and installed the water/**** fitting.

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I also made a custom bracket to mount the water/**** pump.

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Here are some pics of the custom dash plate I made for the water/**** controller.

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And here is a pic of the dual nozzles I installed on the underside of the intake manifold.

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Last are a few pics of the intake manifold I polished.

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[Russ M]

Your install looks very clean, but you choose poorly on nozzle placement. You want to give the **** a chance to cool down the air charge. To do so you need to place the nozzles just past your intercooler aiming into the air stream for it to atomize better.

Just make sure it post intercooler/blowoff valve.

 

[BOTTLEFED]

nice and clean
well done

RussM is right, you should have mounted the nozzles as far from the combustion cambers as your system would allow

what size nozzles did you go with?

 

[Martin]

There are a couple of thoughts I have about what's been said about where to place the nozzles. Way back in the school days, my research work was on using water injection to reduce octane requirements, reduce NOx, and increase overall power, so this is a topic near and dear to my heart.

It is true that the farther you put the nozzles from the combustion chamber, the cooler the intake charge will be. That comes with a price, though. As the atomized water evaporates, it does cool the intake charge, but it also displaces oxygen with water vapor. The net result is you get less detonation - but that is as much because you're richening the combustion mixture as it is from the cooler intake temps. So, you get what you want (less detonation) but you're missing out on maximum power.

At the other extreme, if you were able to inject the water mixture directly into the cylinder at exactly the right time (that's where the 'secret sauce' is), you can actually increase power while achieving all the other benefits. In short, if done right, you are using otherwise unusable waste heat from the combustion to turn the water to vapor (increasing overall efficiency) - and as that water expands to vapor, it safely increases combustion chamber pressure and thereby increases power. At the same time, you can use that water to control detonation and decrease combustion chamber temperatures to decrease NOx levels. Best of all, since the water is injected after the air has already entered the combustion chamber, you have gotten as much oxygen into the chamber possible - which allows maximum power.

So, where the nozzles are installed presently isn't as bad as many might think. If the water can get into the cylinders before fully vaporizing, the benefits of in-chamber vaporization will be realized with less power loss than if the water had vaporized well upstream. The main thing I'd be worried about is that the water won't make it into the cylinders evenly - you might experience detonation (or rich conditions) in the cylinders farthest from the nozzles.

What I'd like to see one of these days is a direct port water injection system that evenly got atomized water directly into each cylinder. Even better, a set of heads that allowed for direct chamber injection - but like our funding source felt 20 years ago, the cost and complexity (and owner maintenance) probably outweighs any benefits. Plus, since they were mostly concerned about emissions, there are plenty of other ways that are much less expensive to solve that problem...

 

[litemup]

nice and clean
well done

RussM is right, you should have mounted the nozzles as far from the combustion cambers as your system would allow

what size nozzles did you go with?

I went with .175 Snows smallest nozzles. I was considering mounting just one bigger nozzle after the intercooler, but figured I would go with 2 smaller one and put them on the intake manifold. I know I would lose the better cooling benefit, but mounting the nozzle before the IAT sensor would fool the PCM into thinking the air with cooler (which is the point for ****)and make the motor run leaner which I didn't want. I was running lean enough as it is.

 

[litemup]

There are a couple of thoughts I have about what's been said about where to place the nozzles. Way back in the school days, my research work was on using water injection to reduce octane requirements, reduce NOx, and increase overall power, so this is a topic near and dear to my heart.

It is true that the farther you put the nozzles from the combustion chamber, the cooler the intake charge will be. That comes with a price, though. As the atomized water evaporates, it does cool the intake charge, but it also displaces oxygen with water vapor. The net result is you get less detonation - but that is as much because you're richening the combustion mixture as it is from the cooler intake temps. So, you get what you want (less detonation) but you're missing out on maximum power.

At the other extreme, if you were able to inject the water mixture directly into the cylinder at exactly the right time (that's where the 'secret sauce' is), you can actually increase power while achieving all the other benefits. In short, if done right, you are using otherwise unusable waste heat from the combustion to turn the water to vapor (increasing overall efficiency) - and as that water expands to vapor, it safely increases combustion chamber pressure and thereby increases power. At the same time, you can use that water to control detonation and decrease combustion chamber temperatures to decrease NOx levels. Best of all, since the water is injected after the air has already entered the combustion chamber, you have gotten as much oxygen into the chamber possible - which allows maximum power.

So, where the nozzles are installed presently isn't as bad as many might think. If the water can get into the cylinders before fully vaporizing, the benefits of in-chamber vaporization will be realized with less power loss than if the water had vaporized well upstream. The main thing I'd be worried about is that the water won't make it into the cylinders evenly - you might experience detonation (or rich conditions) in the cylinders farthest from the nozzles.

What I'd like to see one of these days is a direct port water injection system that evenly got atomized water directly into each cylinder. Even better, a set of heads that allowed for direct chamber injection - but like our funding source felt 20 years ago, the cost and complexity (and owner maintenance) probably outweighs any benefits. Plus, since they were mostly concerned about emissions, there are plenty of other ways that are much less expensive to solve that problem...

Thanks for the info.