Wide Band O2 sensor and gauge - CLASSIC

[WESTCOAST JASON]

While in the hunt for the ever 'perfect' tune I started talking to some of the import tuners in my area. Figure they know as much as anyone as far as getting every single HP out of an engine (per cc anyhow). Anyhow, one of the things they turned me onto was a company called Tomei and an A/F gauge that they make. I am told it is the best wide band / gauge kit that Japan has to offer. At nearly $400 for the kit it was not cheap, but I trust the group I was speaking to and being that most of their 1.8L motors are in the 300FWHP level, I trust their tuning knowledge. Here is the Classic part though, I was putting in the gauge and noticed the funniest typo I have ever seen on a piece of hardware from Japan. Study the photo below and tell me you didn't laugh out loud......

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[Viperoctane]

LOL thats really a classic hhhahaha REAN lol

 

[1TONY1]

Jason, Is there an interface box between your sensor and the gauge? How many wires does the sensor have? Here is the one I finally got installed yesterday, It reads the a/f = 14.7 and on the right side of the display has a rich/lean lcd bar that move up and down. It can also be logged on a palm of notebook. I went to the dyno yesterday and it was within .1 of their w/b, one was in each header.

 

[Sean Roe]

Tony,

Have you tried linking up to it with a laptop yet, in order to record your run?
I've seen that one around for a couple of years and was curious about it since the price was so much lower than others.

Sean

 

[Marc Lublin]

Here is the display on the FJO. You can use your palm and either playback through it or sync with you desktop and chart your results. Works well and tech support at FJO is great. http://vca1.viperclub.org/ubb/uploads/Marc+Lublin/AFDisplay.jpg
I'm not too good at this posting picture thing. I tried to insert the picture and it didn't go in and I also had to make it so small in order for the site to accept it. If anyone knows what I am doing wrong, please let me know.

 

[WESTCOAST JASON]

Yes, the Tomei comes with an amplifier box that goes in between the sensor and the gauge. (that is what they call it anyway, has about 8 wires going to/from it) The 02 that it came with is a 4 wire unit. It is installed in a **** I had already available in the mid pipe just before the driver side turbo. I previously had used a digital AF readout that used the factory 02 sensor and during tuning had found that all it was telling me is what has happened in the recent past. Not what was coming out of the motor at that exact moment. Watching the Tomei next to my digital one it is kinda funny, the tomei shows the current A/F and the digital one will catch up a second later. I don't know if that is because my digital one works off of the factory 02's and they are not as good as wide band, or if the gauge itself is just slow when interpreting the voltage. Either way, the Tomei unit has already been very helpful and it has earned a permanent piece of real estate in my cockpit.

 

[Sean Roe]

The difference in accuracy and speed is in the oxygen sensor type. The NTK sensors are a 5 wire and cost a few times more.
Stock sensors are good for indicating basic rich and "rean" conditions in the stochiometric area. Their age also has an impact on performance.
Sean

PS.
Mark,
Glad to hear you like the FJO wideband.


<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Sean Roe on 11-25-2002 at 06:29 AM</font>

 

[Nadine UK GTS]

Thanks for the posts, interesting. I find the OE O2 sensors read very slow, I am looking into faster reading ones (supplied as a kit) but they are still pricey! Keep us updated on what you're finding...(Rean or not, haha!)

 

[Bill B]

The tech edge unit is available from http://techedge.com.au/vehicle/wbo2/builtwb.htm It uses the NGK/Bosch 5 wire sensor. You can get the srnsor from www.thepartsbin.com for about $125.00 after buying this I sold my FJO.

 

[1TONY1]

Sean, Yes I have recorded it on the laptop. There are two programs at the moment (free) One will show a graph and digits in real time but will only display each sample in digit form after its recorded. The other will only show digits while recording but after the fact will also show a graph. At the moment there is no other info such as rpm. It would be nice if the Sweden stuff would let this 02 info be overlayed on its screen.....even better if it were capable of taking the w/b output info and adjusting a/f. There are some holly efi systems that can do that. Techedge has an updated box coming out, I haven't read up on the difference but it might be worth waiting on. It displays/changes as quick as the Mustang dyno w/b. ta

 

[kverges]

I also have the Techedge Unit and it works very well, with an RS232 output to data log. The NTK sensor can sometimes be hard to find; I ended up scouring local NAPA stores and paid about $250 for the sensor, and about $280 or so for the A/F meter and display unit, pre-built. The unit is available in kit form, at a much lower price.

If your O2 sensor is 4-wire, I don't think it is wide-band. The WBO2 has to have at least 5 wires, 2 for the heater, and the other three run not just the sensor, but a current "pump" that give the WBO2 the precision to go outside 14.7:1 or "shoichiometric."

 

[WESTCOAST JASON]

Keith, I am not familiar with the pump you are speaking of, but I think that is what Tomei calls the Amplifier. This unit is definatley sold as a wide band and works as one too! The 'AMPLIFIER' is a box that the Tomei interfaces to the WB and the gauge. Anyhow, it has been a real gem in chasing the tuning demons out of the car. It has read all over the gauge from rich to rean during tuning and testing. Finally, I have a solid 14:1 reading at WOT with 10PSI on 91 octane with no detonation. (colder plugs were a big help = went with the NGK). Drove the car to Vegas this holiday and got to meet up with my old Venom 650R (with NOS) and was pleasantly reminded why I went with turbo's! Got BOOST?&lt;p&gt;&lt;P&gt;

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[kverges]

I suppose it is possible that a 4-wire sensor could be WB, but I really doubt it. I am also shocked to see 14:1 A/F in any application, let alone forced induction. Others can correct me if I am wrong, but 14:1 is flat dangerous in forced induction. You would want to see more like 11.5-12:1 for forced induction, and perhaps 12.5:1 in NA trim. Your 14:1 reading makes me doubt that your O2 sensor is indeed WB, as a standard O2 is so inaccurate outside 14,7:1 that a gauge might "say" 14:1, but you could really be at a safer 12:1. Your actual experience says your car runs a safe A/F mixture, so I wonder about the O2 sensor.

Not having your WB )2 in front of me, I can't say for sure, and I am not trying to be critical, but I have serious doubts that it is a WB 02 and I would make 100% certain before relying too heavily on it.

FWIW.

 

[WESTCOAST JASON]

Understood, and you may very well be right. It is just marketted as a WB. I have used it as a baseline and that is what really helps. I can make a change in the PC by a few percentage points of pulse width and see the difference in the gauge and bottom line, thats what I needed it for. I was looking at the australian one out there, and am thinking of getting it since it has data logging anyway. But now with the other thread on the board about a possible PNP computer replacement available in a number of weeks, I will just sit and wait maybe. Car is currently outrunning its available traction anyway right now.....

 

[1TONY1]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jasontarnutzer:
Car is currently outrunning its available traction anyway right now.....

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry for your troubles Jason