***? Car keeps dying...

[Alley]

This happend a couple weeks ago and didn't think much of it. But now it seems to be re-occuring. When at WOT today and shifting from 2nd to 3rd the car died as soon as I let out the clutch and gave it gas. I tried it 3 more times and the same thing happened. Then I tried letting out the clutch real slow all the way and then gave it gas and the car was ok.

But then when testing some more the car died in 2nd gear as I was building up RPM's at about 4k. And died once in 1st gear at 4k rpm. Both times at WOT.

So anybody know what the heck is going on? Is there some sort of saftey kill switch that could be malfunctioning? Car is a 95.

 

[Viper Wizard]

Not sure but think about what's going on at that moment? 4000 rpm, max torque, left side of the motor is lifting up! Maybe a wire shorting, shutting down fuel or spark? Just a thought.

 

[Madduc]

Severely plugged fuel filter?

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

From my own experience, a plugged filter limits max power (and RPM) but since you don't run out of fuel, the engine does not die, just won't go faster.

 

[crazyspeed]

Not sure but think about what's going on at that moment? 4000 rpm, max torque, left side of the motor is lifting up! Maybe a wire shorting, shutting down fuel or spark? Just a thought.

+1 check motor mounts and wires for abrasion

 

[RTTTTed]

If it's shutting off then the probable reason is the Auto Shutdown relay or battery disconnect.

Everything die, of just the engine? Check engine light? Ignition shutdown would probably be instant and fuel shut down (as on fuel pump, etc.) would usually crap out before shutting down.

Ted

 

[Alley]

Just the engine shuts down. I still got all lights and acccessories. Would bad motor mounts cause the engine to shut down with a violent ****?

I did headers a couple months ago. As soon as I can get it on a lift I'll check all wires underneath.

Just the red engine light comes on. Same one you get if you just kill the car or something. Not the yellow "check engine" light.

 

[eucharistos]

I did headers a couple months ago

my money's on the Wizard

 

[RedSrt007]

fuel pressure / pump?

 

[RTTTTed]

fuel pressure / pump?

When the fuel pressure goes down (as in the fuel filter is plugged or pump quits) the engine usually craps out as it dies. Fuel issues are not usually instant.

Ted

 

[Tim]

I had a 94 RT10 that behaved exactly like this. It was pinching a wire that ran over top of the transmission and shorting it out. It started out intermittently and got worse. The hotter the car got the worse it got. Found it and fixed it and no more problems. I believe that this was only happening on a few of the Gen 1 cars.

Tim

 

[Alley]

Well I got the car in the air today. Motor mounts and tranny mount seemed fine. Crank sensor wire wasn't anywhere near the headers, or any other wires. I felt all along the tranny and didn't see where any wires could be getting pinched. So I guess I'm stumped again.

You think I should try replacing the crank sensor? Even though the wire wasn't getting burnt, the sensor itself could still be bad right?

 

[Venomiss]

Well I got the car in the air today. Motor mounts and tranny mount seemed fine. Crank sensor wire wasn't anywhere near the headers, or any other wires. I felt all along the tranny and didn't see where any wires could be getting pinched. So I guess I'm stumped again.

You think I should try replacing the crank sensor? Even though the wire wasn't getting burnt, the sensor itself could still be bad right?

Call Chuck and see what he says.
Then join the VCA and see a whole lot more than you are seeing on the site right now.
(Like Illustrated upgrades).

 

[dave6666]

You think I should try replacing the crank sensor? Even though the wire wasn't getting burnt, the sensor itself could still be bad right?

I think this is right. Someone correct me otherwise, but the crank sensor is required for starting the engine, but not maintaining run.

 

[Alley]

If it's shutting off then the probable reason is the Auto Shutdown relay or battery disconnect.

Ted

what and where is the auto shutdown relay?

 

[RTTTTed]

what and where is the auto shutdown relay?

Auto sut down relay supplies power to the injcetors, ign coils and probably the fule pump, depending on sensor inputs.

Look in the row of relays in the PCM.

PM sent

Ted

 

[Alley]

Can the relays be visually inspected or do you have to hook them up to some other power source to test them?

 

[RTTTTed]

You could just switch a couple around ie.low beam to ASD.

The you'd have problems with your lights not engine shutdown if the p[roblem is the relay. Otherwise, the relay may be doing the shutdown, but not the cause. Test the relay output with a power indicator light. If the light stays on when the engine shuts down the problem is not from the Auto shutdown circuit.

Ted

 

[Jack B]

This happend a couple weeks ago and didn't think much of it. But now it seems to be re-occuring. When at WOT today and shifting from 2nd to 3rd the car died as soon as I let out the clutch and gave it gas. I tried it 3 more times and the same thing happened. Then I tried letting out the clutch real slow all the way and then gave it gas and the car was ok.

But then when testing some more the car died in 2nd gear as I was building up RPM's at about 4k. And died once in 1st gear at 4k rpm. Both times at WOT.

So anybody know what the heck is going on? Is there some sort of saftey kill switch that could be malfunctioning? Car is a 95.

Is the car stock and if not what are the mods. You may want to log the injector PW, that will narrow down the issue and that can be done with a scan tool or the VEC.

 

[dave6666]

Is the car stock and if not what are the mods. You may want to log the injector PW, that will narrow down the issue and that can be done with a scan tool or the VEC.

Will a scan tool like the Actron CP9180 do that type of scanning?

 

[crazyspeed]

So, how did the story end?

 

[Jack B]

Will a scan tool like the Actron CP9180 do that type of scanning?

I am not sure about that specific model, but, in general most scan tools in the $200 range can extract the enhanced Chrysler PIDs.

 

[TomH]

So, how did the story end?

Alley is taking it to Woodhouse for a diagnosis.

 

[Alley]

Well I dropped the car off with Mark J this morning and he already got back to me before they closed. He thinks he has the issue resolved. Said my TB's were so far out of sync that one of the flaps would completly close and one would stay open when I'd let off the gas causing the car to die. Now I know about re-syning the cables myself and have done it. I asked him about that, and he said it was worse then that and they had to take off the cables and totally redue the setup. About a half hour job he said.

I'm not 100% sold on this being the only reason. But he said there were no codes thrown. But to my recolection the car would die at WOT even when building up RPM's and I would think even if the cables were out of sync they would both be totally open at WOT. And I don't get how they could become so out of sync all of a sudden. But I'm sure he's more familier with them then I am, so I'll test it out and see.

So hopefully thats all it was. Plus he was able to tell me about some other issues I had, which was basicly fluids that were really dirty and way overdue for a change. ie: brake, powersteering, rear diff, and tranny. So I'm having them change them for me too before I go back to pick up the car.

 

[Alley]

Well, just got bad news. Mark J called me and said its not the TB's like they thought and I need a new PCM. It was corrodid on the inside. But they dont' make or service them anymore. So there looking for a used one for me. Anybody here have one or know where I can find a used Gen I PCM? Only other option is I guess convert the car to a Gen II computer system which I'm sure isn't cheap.

 

[JonB]

Engine Negative Grounding Strap...loose / corroded

 

[ViperTony]

Well, just got bad news. Mark J called me and said its not the TB's like they thought and I need a new PCM. It was corrodid on the inside. But they dont' make or service them anymore. So there looking for a used one for me. Anybody here have one or know where I can find a used Gen I PCM? Only other option is I guess convert the car to a Gen II computer system which I'm sure isn't cheap.

Found on ebay, hopefully its what you're looking for:
eBay Motors: DODGE VIPER PCM PRIMARY COMPUTER 1994 GEN 1 94 (item 170279821117 end time Nov-23-08 18:15:33 PST)
eBay Motors: DODGE VIPER PCM SECONDARY COMPUTER 1994 GEN 1 94 95 (item 170279822124 end time Nov-23-08 18:19:40 PST)

Looks like a primary and secondary computer is needed?

 

[Alley]

Well one is the PCM and one is the ECU I believe. Not sure how much confidence I have in that add though. hmmm...

 

[ViperTony]

Well one is the PCM and one is the ECU I believe. Not sure how much confidence I have in that add though. hmmm...

Forward it to Mark J and have him grill the seller.

 

[Alley]

I will. mark also called me and said he found one for $510.