Hot Tip...Buy the Gen V Collectible while you can still afford to

Bobpantax

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 2, 2000
Posts
6,957
Reaction score
3
Location
Miami
Hi Tony. Failure is part of capitalism. Sometimes very painful failure. Out of that failure, crucial lessons are learned. When the failure is artificially and politically avoided, lessons are not learned.

I disagree with the article. It assumes the shutdown of both companies. That was never going to happen. In a chapter 11 proceeding there can be debtor in possession management or a trustee, upon cause being demonstrated, can be inserted. A chapter 11 is not a liquidating bankruptcy until and unless it is converted to a chapter 7. The nature of the "rescue" package finally put together was highly political and screwed the bondholders in a very abnormal way.

We will never know which company might have bought the assets of GM out of a normal bankruptcy proceeding and what that company would have done with those assets. It cannot be assumed that a company doing same would not have been successful and the alleged economic domino effect eliminated or at least largely mitigated.

A writer for the New York Post wrote what I have quoted below. I agree with him.

The GM recall indicates that from 2001 until very recently the culture of GM, like the Ford culture used to be at the time of the Pinto gas tank issue, was morally corrupt. Lives were willfully sacrificed when a known problem was concealed. Can you honestly say you believe that they did not conceal anything else? Something else that could effect some of their performance vehicles? Other than a new CEO, how many of the people who made and supported the decision to conceal the ignition switch problem still work there?

To my knowledge, neither the old Chrysler nor the new Chrysler has had this type of scandal for as long as I can remember.

"It’s true that, in the scheme of things, $10.5 billion is a drop in the bucket of federal spending. It’s also true that the bailout helped GM get back on its feet, and some people who might have lost jobs kept them.
The problem is that the real costs of the bailout are both higher and hidden. For one thing, bailing out a carmaker was certainly not what Congress had in mind when it passed the Troubled Asset Relief Program. For another, the political nature of the intervention ensured that when the claims were sorted out, politics guided the decisions as much as economics. That’s why the United Automobile Workers Union made out and certain creditors did not.
Then there are the costs paid by those that didn’t need a bailout: notably, Ford, as well as foreign automakers with plants here. Presumably, they all lost sales and market share and profits when the federal government intervened on behalf of their failing competitors. And had GM gone through the regular bankruptcy system, it would itself be stronger today.
That’s because the bankruptcy process reorganizes companies or places their assets in the hands of those who can make them productive. We’re glad our government is out of the car business. Pity we’ll never get an honest accounting of the full costs."










Bob, you are looking at the subject with a narrow understanding of the economic factors related to the GM/Chrysler bailout. While I'm not necessarily a fan of those either, I do understand the economic domino effect and how much it would have cost the US taxpayers had either of those massive companies failed. Please read this article and gain a broader perspective. We (USA) spent $10B in order to avoid losing $105B. That is the big picture.

http://www.cargroup.org/?module=News&event=View&newsID=70

Also, the GM ignition switch recall has nothing to do with tuning the engine control module timing/fuel maps.

Quit trying to make political statements about this simple technical request. We simply wish to be able to modify our $100,000+ cars, period. No discussion needed.
 
Last edited:

Free2go

Enthusiast
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Posts
3,290
Reaction score
6
This is America. We want the damn PCM unlocked. Bruce H apparently has a red phone in his home with a direct line to Ralph's cell. But Bruce is too busy swinging back and forth on SRT sack screaming "wooooooohoooooo"! to get the job done. Bob...can you file a class action suit?
 

Bobpantax

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 2, 2000
Posts
6,957
Reaction score
3
Location
Miami
I don't think I made the point I was rtying to make clearly. It is possible that Fiat/Chrysler cares more about the possible adverse consequences to the owners/drivers of its cars than GM or Ford do and, as a result, is willing to forego the extra sales which might be produced by unlocking the controller code of its performance cars to the same degree. Is the Ferrari code accessable? I do not think so but correct me if I am wrong.

However, someone over the years has always managed to crack the OEM Chrysler controller codes and someone eventually will. It's the American way. We like a good challenge. I know there are some top notch programmers/ code writers out there in the Viper Nation. How about getting a group together and doing some pro bono development work for the Viper Nation?
 
OP
OP
Bruce H.

Bruce H.

Enthusiast
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Posts
646
Reaction score
19
Location
Near Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Got the word today that a lovely black collectible has just rolled off the line and was headed for final inspection! If I'm just half as happy as every other Gen V buyer is then I'm going to be ecstatic. It's become very obvious to some that there's a complete disconnect between the price of these cars and their quality and performance. Gotta love that!
 

TrackAire

Enthusiast
Joined
Jun 24, 2009
Posts
1,523
Reaction score
1
Location
Vacaville, California
I don't think I made the point I was rtying to make clearly. It is possible that Fiat/Chrysler cares more about the possible adverse consequences to the owners/drivers of its cars than GM or Ford do and, as a result, is willing to forego the extra sales which might be produced by unlocking the controller code of its performance cars to the same degree. Is the Ferrari code accessable? I do not think so but correct me if I am wrong.

However, someone over the years has always managed to crack the OEM Chrysler controller codes and someone eventually will. It's the American way. We like a good challenge. I know there are some top notch programmers/ code writers out there in the Viper Nation. How about getting a group together and doing some pro bono development work for the Viper Nation?

Ferrari, Maserati and Fiat have tuning available for them.

Every manufacturer has issues with recalls and faulty equipment. At this point, I think I'd rather have an airbag that does not go off versus a window stuck in the down position (Gen 3/4 Viper issue). Driving the car back from the VOI in Utah through 7 hours of very hard rain would have been a major ***** if it happened to me. Not to mention the safety issue of a lone female driving in a large city, etc without being able to roll up the windows and lock the car and the potential for an issue there. Notice Chrysler has not addressed this issue....I don't think Fiat/Chrysler cares anymore than the other automakers....it's all about the bottom line, statistical data payout and the ability to spin a situation by taking 6 to 12 years to come to some sort of resolution. As you know, very common when these things go to trial or public. Time is on their side, not the consumers.
 

Bobpantax

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 2, 2000
Posts
6,957
Reaction score
3
Location
Miami
I am not sure you understand the gravity of what happened. The issue is not recalls. All auto makers have them. The issue is that GM sat on the data since 2001 knowing that the defect could result in the air bags not deploying. 13 people died who did not have to die. This was a crime not just bean counting.

Please post the details of the Ferrari and Maserati after market calibration resources. That would be interesting and possibly helpful for lobbying for future code access to perhaps a few select aftermarket manufacturers who see an adequate business case to develop something.
 
Last edited:

FLL-B/W-GTS

Enthusiast
Joined
Dec 31, 2007
Posts
575
Reaction score
0
Some of you guys have some serious stress going on..Whats all this political stuff on a car site ??? Go to the track and do some burn out and have some fun...
Ya,unlock that that computer...
 

VRYALT3R3D

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 4, 2012
Posts
276
Reaction score
0
Got the word today that a lovely black collectible has just rolled off the line and was headed for final inspection! If I'm just half as happy as every other Gen V buyer is then I'm going to be ecstatic. It's become very obvious to some that there's a complete disconnect between the price of these cars and their quality and performance. Gotta love that!

Congrats!!! I assume you are now in D1 status?
 

VRYALT3R3D

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 4, 2012
Posts
276
Reaction score
0
Thanks! I don't actually know what any of the stages/status are, and apparently we don't have access to an on-line system here in Canada. The one I'm interested in will signify it's been loaded on a truck and has just left the yard :)

Hey Bruce,

Below you will find a list of the possible statuses. Your dealer should know what status the car is in. It is on the invoice/ dealer oder confirmation(I forgot the exact name)

BA: New order that hasn't been checked
BB: Review by fleet department
BD: Special equipment processing
BE: Edit error
BG: Passed edit n/a for schedule
BGL: Edit ok parts unavailable
BX: Passed edit available for schedule
C: Sub firm - Tentative schedule
D: Firm schedule - dealer has allocation and all parts available
D1: Gateline schedule - scheduled to be built
E: Frame
F: Paint
G: Trim
I: Built not ok'd
J: Built ok'd
JB: Shipped to Upfit Center (for Stripe)
JE: Emission check
JS: Shipped to storage
KZ: Released by plant , invoiced
KZL: Released - not shipped
KZM: First rail departure
KZN: First rail arrival
KZO: Delayed/recieved
KZOA: Plant holds
KZOB: Zone/distribution holds
KZOC: Carrier delays
KZOD: Carrier holds
KZOE: Mis-shipped vehicle
KZOF: Show/test vehicle
KZOG: Damaged vehicle
KZOH: All other reasons
KZT: Second rail departure
KZU: Second rail arrival
KZX: Delivered to dealer
ZA: Canceled
 
OP
OP
Bruce H.

Bruce H.

Enthusiast
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Posts
646
Reaction score
19
Location
Near Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Thanks, Tex!

Hey Bruce,

Below you will find a list of the possible statuses. Your dealer should know what status the car is in. It is on the invoice/ dealer oder confirmation(I forgot the exact name)

Thanks for the list, and I assume Chelseasnake is right about I status as it was the dealer that told me yesterday that it had been built and was awaiting final inspection. Hopefully it will pass inspection quickly and blow thrrough the J's and K's!
 

Chelseasnake

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Posts
1,100
Reaction score
0
wont be long now. it should be in kz status in the next few days, and ship next week. { you hope }
 

Chelseasnake

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 19, 2008
Posts
1,100
Reaction score
0
i have seen some of my cars leave the plant on one day, and be at the dealer in toronto the next day.
 
Top