Go Fast For Life
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Innovate LM-1 wideband O2 sensor w/datalogging
- Thread starter Go Fast For Life
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txlen
Enthusiast
i do..they work great!!...Len
Mike Adams
Enthusiast
What are you planning to use it for ?
2002_Viper_GTS_ACR
Enthusiast
Hey Mike,
I already spoke to Ron !! I convinced him to go with the AEM unit, which I know is your unit of choice !!
Jon
I already spoke to Ron !! I convinced him to go with the AEM unit, which I know is your unit of choice !!
Jon
Talked to Innovate today(Kevin) and others with various cars who have used the LM-1. Even a shop in OHIO that uses it with their dyno and he said it is dead on all day long. Everyone seems to be pleased with it and for the money it is hard to beat.
The AEM is a nice looking unit and I am still considering it, but to log data with it doesn't one need the $2600 unit? The datalogging feature of the LM-1 is real nice and can really help those with VEC2's and so on. All of that for around $450 with RPM cable.
The AEM is a nice looking unit and I am still considering it, but to log data with it doesn't one need the $2600 unit? The datalogging feature of the LM-1 is real nice and can really help those with VEC2's and so on. All of that for around $450 with RPM cable.
Bad_Byte
Enthusiast
The one glaring weakness I see with the unit is the fact that it can only monitor one O2 sensor. Monitoring cars with dual exhaust will require two units. Case in point all gen 1's.
How else would you monitor each bank for A/F?
Oh, sure you can do a run, switch the unit to the other bank and do another run. Somewhat of a pain although not impossible, easier if you have two O2 sensors already wired. However, (here is the gottcha)there is a BIG warning in the instruction manual that you can't leave the sensor in the exhaust without having it wired to the LM-1. This means you'll have to install the O2 sensor in a HOT exhaust if you want back to back runs. Not fun.
On the plus side is that if you do monitor with two units (supposedly) you can import all readings and compare each bank by matching up the RPM.
Personally, I think creating the need for two units is a fantastic sales tool.
My question to everyone is: If you have a car with dual exhaust and someone tells you that your A/F is xx.x then how can you be sure that every cylinder is producing the correct mixture?
How else would you monitor each bank for A/F?
Oh, sure you can do a run, switch the unit to the other bank and do another run. Somewhat of a pain although not impossible, easier if you have two O2 sensors already wired. However, (here is the gottcha)there is a BIG warning in the instruction manual that you can't leave the sensor in the exhaust without having it wired to the LM-1. This means you'll have to install the O2 sensor in a HOT exhaust if you want back to back runs. Not fun.
On the plus side is that if you do monitor with two units (supposedly) you can import all readings and compare each bank by matching up the RPM.
Personally, I think creating the need for two units is a fantastic sales tool.
My question to everyone is: If you have a car with dual exhaust and someone tells you that your A/F is xx.x then how can you be sure that every cylinder is producing the correct mixture?
A couple of insights. The VEC2 logging will be helpful, however, the viper doesn't use wideband O2 transducers. On the other hand you will be able to extract a lot of usable and helpful data. Sean might want to comment on what accuracy the viper's O2 transducers provide.
As far as not having two O2 sensors with the Innovate, that is no different than when you dyno. I have installed the Innovate O2 well on the passenger side since, my dyno shop inserts their O2 in the drivers side. When you dyno you can use the Innovate to monitor the second side. In addition, I installed the Innovate O2 well in a position so that the transducer can be changed from side to side.
Another hint on the rpm module. For some reason the clamp-on transducer for rpm pickup will not work on my car. I would recommend saving the money and order the auxiliary terminal block without the rpm transducer and merely pick-up one of the coil pack drivers and bring it to the aux input block. I am also bringing a fuel pressure input to he aux block.
For reference all the new Autometer gauges have 0-4.5 volt output for logging purposes, any of their gauges can now provide a logging output that can be brought to the Innovate logger.
As far as not having two O2 sensors with the Innovate, that is no different than when you dyno. I have installed the Innovate O2 well on the passenger side since, my dyno shop inserts their O2 in the drivers side. When you dyno you can use the Innovate to monitor the second side. In addition, I installed the Innovate O2 well in a position so that the transducer can be changed from side to side.
Another hint on the rpm module. For some reason the clamp-on transducer for rpm pickup will not work on my car. I would recommend saving the money and order the auxiliary terminal block without the rpm transducer and merely pick-up one of the coil pack drivers and bring it to the aux input block. I am also bringing a fuel pressure input to he aux block.
For reference all the new Autometer gauges have 0-4.5 volt output for logging purposes, any of their gauges can now provide a logging output that can be brought to the Innovate logger.
Jack B,
Could you explain a little better about the rpm pickup and what I should buy? How do you hard wire the rpm piece and what wire do you connect it to? I'm thinking about purchasing the LM1 and would like to hook it up to the rpm and knock sensing.
Thank you,
Lou
Jack, I also gave them a call and asked about your above statement. Do you mean to get the $99 cable and hook it to the coil pack and that in turn hooks to the module?
Or are you saying there is someway else to pick up the rpm data?
John
Or are you saying there is someway else to pick up the rpm data?
John
1TONY1
Enthusiast
Just upgraded my Techedge 1.0 to this: http://www.wbo2.com/2b0/default.htm
Still have to figure out the logging but it should be nice. The display fits perfect in one of the center air vents.
Still have to figure out the logging but it should be nice. The display fits perfect in one of the center air vents.
JDawg:
correct, you just need the auxiliary input cable. It is actually a terminal block that accepts the additional 0-5 volt inputs and sends them back to the logger via a din cable. I'm not sure which will work better, however, either a coil pack driver or tach output should give us the signal we want. I plan on connecting a coil pack driver this week.
correct, you just need the auxiliary input cable. It is actually a terminal block that accepts the additional 0-5 volt inputs and sends them back to the logger via a din cable. I'm not sure which will work better, however, either a coil pack driver or tach output should give us the signal we want. I plan on connecting a coil pack driver this week.
V
vegasviper
Guest
How would the Vec1 one A/F compare to these units, is it not accurate enough
SpinMonster
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I have the LM-1 and it was exactly the same as my FJO was in readings. I can warn though that if you take the readings from the tailpipe it isn't accurate with cats on the car.
One big advantage of the LM-1 is that it can be calibrated to the speific ambient conditions with the push of a button.
One big advantage of the LM-1 is that it can be calibrated to the speific ambient conditions with the push of a button.
SpinMonster
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2 methods.....it can be configured with the input on the box using the tach output wire if you dont want to spring for the inductive cable....give them a call in Cali.....nice people and they will go into detail
Bad_Byte
Enthusiast
What would be the output voltage range on the PCM output to the tachometer. I'm assuming that's the tach output you're referring to. My service manual does not specify a range.
SpinMonster
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the LM-1 canm be configured for many different tach settings with varying voltages...2-12 cylinders....give them a call and you will get exact info and a deal
Bob D
Enthusiast
I used the camshaft position sensor signal for my RPM because it was in the same harness (C3 at the PCM) as the other 4 wires I wanted to tap into. I soldered a 6 pin connector at the harness so it can be easily plugged in.
I log air intake temp, coolant temp, RPM, throttle position and MAP along with A/F.
Bob
I log air intake temp, coolant temp, RPM, throttle position and MAP along with A/F.
Bob
SpinMonster
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you can get a signal without the rpm cable yes but it is easier the way you did it
Bad_Byte
Enthusiast
Hey Bob, question about your use of the cam shaft position sensor signal for RPM input to the LM-1. I'm trying to use the same and my RPM is comming in exactly twice what it should be. I tried programming the RPM-converter to 2 pulses per rotation but same results. I called innovate and all they had to say was use the tach signal. I was whole lot less than pleased with the guys technical expertise.
Any words of wisdom?
Also, on a similar note which ground are you using out of the PCM? Signal ground or Power ground?
Art
Bad_Byte
Enthusiast
Picking up the tach signal is not difficult at all. The problem is the rpm does not indicate correctly. I calibrate the LM-1 with the audio signal from my laptop per the instructions. When I connect the tach signal the RPM is no where near accurate. For instance at idle my tach shows appx 600 rpm while the LM-1 is showing closer to 1700 rpm and it goes up somewhat logrythmicaly from there. Say I'm running at 2000 rpm the LM-1 is closer to 4500.
I have finally found a combination that is very close to correct by using the cam sensor and setting the pulses per cam rotation to 4. I may experiment with other pick ups (crank, or injector driver) but for now the cam seems to provide what I'm looking for.
PS: All Klaus and Philipe at innovate could say is "All cars are different, what works for one may not work for another". In short they were fairly useless, although they were polite and did return my calls. For that I guess I should be appreciative, and I am.
Bob D
Enthusiast
Art
I haven't found the right combination yet. I'm off about 12%, actual 5000 rpm reads 4400. I'll be using the LM-1 on a SRT 10 Ram today. It will be interesting to see if there is any difference.
I can't remember what ground I used. It is written down on my notes somewhere. When I find them I'll let you know.
Do you have number of cylinders set to 5 ?
Sorry I can't help more. It's been a while since I set mine up.
Bob
I haven't found the right combination yet. I'm off about 12%, actual 5000 rpm reads 4400. I'll be using the LM-1 on a SRT 10 Ram today. It will be interesting to see if there is any difference.
I can't remember what ground I used. It is written down on my notes somewhere. When I find them I'll let you know.
Do you have number of cylinders set to 5 ?
Sorry I can't help more. It's been a while since I set mine up.
Bob
Bad_Byte
Enthusiast
Hi Bob thanks for the reply. At least I don't feel quite so bad now, since I'm not the only one having difficulties with the RPM. I thought from your previous post that you had the RPM's nailed down and working exactly as displayed on your tach.
I have tried both the cam sensor and the tach output so far. The closest I've come to getting the tach and the LM-1 to mactch is by using the cam sensor and calibrating using my laptop and the audio cable with the settings below. I'll probably try a few more settings after I have a chance to compare the rpm's under better conditions.
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