Question about Steering pulling

[viperjim]

Although I've had many performance cars, I'm new to Vipers. I just purchased a 2003 with 10,000 miles and have been concerned with how much erratic pull I have to fight from the front wheels hitting irregularities in the road surface. The worst are the ruts left at intersections near the white stop lines. It's like a bad video game. I asked the Viper mechanic at the local Dodge dealer and he blamed it on wide tires ( they are stock. On a smooth highway, the car feels twitchy- I assuming because of the fast steer, but otherwise OK.
I was beating up on a Mustang Cobra yesterday and the car ****** because of a rut in the road at 80 mph. Enough to make the back end kick out and the ABS come into play. Any thoughts?


Jim

 

[MikeR]

Im no expert, so there could be other problems in suspension,but my feeling is its the tires if they are still the stock run-flats. I have a new 05, it wanders all over the place on un-even surfaces. Its because of the tires. My buddy switched his wheels and tires out and his tracks nice and straight.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Why would ABS come into play when the back end kicks out? Did you slam on the brakes at 80mph?

 

[Viper Wizard]

Your alignment may be off?

 

[Racer Robbie]

Im no expert, so there could be other problems in suspension,but my feeling is its the tires if they are still the stock run-flats. I have a new 05, it wanders all over the place on un-even surfaces. Its because of the tires. My buddy switched his wheels and tires out and his tracks nice and straight.

same problem here and I changed the tires out to the stock OEM size in Michelin NON run flats. Then I redid the alignment as The Viper Wizard suggested

 

[Flash1034]

Mine does the same thing. Im hoping its the runflat tires. Its not very confidence inspiring is it?

Flash

 

[Nader]

Mine does the same even with non runflats - albeit less. it will only do it on a certain stretch of highway by me and I attribute it to the width of the tires and aggressive factory alignment for turnin.

 

[Mike Dolan]

My '05 did it (I think it's called 'tramlining') when it was new, but now it's quite stable. I think the biggest difference was after a couple track sessions rounded the outer edge of the front tires.

I now have a bit over 18,000 miles on the originals and really like the way the car tracks - straight as an arrow. If new tires cause a return of the 'twitchy' tracking, my solution will be to go back to the track (not that I need an excuse).

 

[SilverMamba189/200]

Have you checked your tire pressure? If I set mine to the factory spec it does it bad...I've found that by increasing the pressure a bit it seems to help a bunch. I have the factory runflats with 4,500 miles on the 2005 Mamba.

 

[DavidSB]

First thing I'd do is check your alignment. You may have too much negative camber.

 

[Grunt]

First thing I'd do is check your alignment. You may have too much negative camber.

What are the alignment specs? Thanks

 

[zorroespanol]

Although I've had many performance cars, I'm new to Vipers. I just purchased a 2003 with 10,000 miles and have been concerned with how much erratic pull I have to fight from the front wheels hitting irregularities in the road surface. The worst are the ruts left at intersections near the white stop lines. It's like a bad video game. I asked the Viper mechanic at the local Dodge dealer and he blamed it on wide tires ( they are stock. On a smooth highway, the car feels twitchy- I assuming because of the fast steer, but otherwise OK.
I was beating up on a Mustang Cobra yesterday and the car ****** because of a rut in the road at 80 mph. Enough to make the back end kick out and the ABS come into play. Any thoughts?


Jim

the wider the tires, the more the car will follow any imperfection on the road. This is absolutely normal for the Viper, or any car with fat shoes.

You can check alignment, but even with a correct one the car will still follow the road's imperfection, or truck tire grooves... Those who say this doesn't happen must have the fortune of good roads!!

Try hitting the brakes HARD at above 80 MPH, you need to grab the steering wheel with both hands and fight for control.... at least in Miami highways!! LOL.

Cheers!

 

[viperjim]

Although I've had many performance cars, I'm new to Vipers. I just purchased a 2003 with 10,000 miles and have been concerned with how much erratic pull I have to fight from the front wheels hitting irregularities in the road surface. The worst are the ruts left at intersections near the white stop lines. It's like a bad video game. I asked the Viper mechanic at the local Dodge dealer and he blamed it on wide tires ( they are stock. On a smooth highway, the car feels twitchy- I assuming because of the fast steer, but otherwise OK.
I was beating up on a Mustang Cobra yesterday and the car ****** because of a rut in the road at 80 mph. Enough to make the back end kick out and the ABS come into play. Any thoughts?


Jim

the wider the tires, the more the car will follow any imperfection on the road. This is absolutely normal for the Viper, or any car with fat shoes.

You can check alignment, but even with a correct one the car will still follow the road's imperfection, or truck tire grooves... Those who say this doesn't happen must have the fortune of good roads!!

Try hitting the brakes HARD at above 80 MPH, you need to grab the steering wheel with both hands and fight for control.... at least in Miami highways!! LOL.

Cheers!

The feeling is a combination of driving in wagon ruts and being on ice. The car is fine and then it catches a rut and pulls quickly to one side. I almost side swiped a truck because of it.

What do you do when you bag the run-flats? Are you SOL if you get a flat tire?
Also, what tire pressure do you increase to when you inflate the tire pressure above the 29 psi specs,

 

[Flash1034]

I'd like to know the same info. Im coming out of a Carrera S and it was as stable as could be. If its the tires, Im ditching them for something else. I already had my alignment checked and it was within specs.

Flash

 

[Racer Robbie]

Have you checked your tire pressure? If I set mine to the factory spec it does it bad...I've found that by increasing the pressure a bit it seems to help a bunch. I have the factory runflats with 4,500 miles on the 2005 Mamba.

here is what Luke at The Tire rack told me to run when I had the stock OEM Runflats on the car.

PSI = STREET TRACK
ZP = 30 PSI 32 PSI
ZP = 30 PSI 32 PSI

I an 32 at the time on the street.

As far as my car being twichy when running on uneven pavement that problem went away conpletly when I switched to Michelin NON Run Flats in the OEM size running 34 psi, front and 30 pst, rear.I also installed lighter copperhead wheels.

Robbie

 

[SilverMamba189/200]

My car seems much happier with 34psi...not great mind you...just a whole lot better.

 

[DavidSB]

If you're going to run non-runflats get a compressor/repair kit from Luke at TireRack and a quality tire plug kit. I think the compressor/repair kit is made by Continental and comes in a small plastic box. With the compressor and plug kit, you can fix most flats - at least until you get to a tire shop for a vulcanized patch. I know .... we're not supposed to patch runflats, but I'm fine with it for regular street driving

 

[GR8_ASP]

I have experienced the trammeling effect with both ruunflats and non runflats. No difference. Sport Cups were much worse.

 

[Flash1034]

Hmmm. Is there a fix? Steering stabilizer perhaps?

Flash

 

[madman]

Jim, forget about all the BS here about alignment, tires etc. Zorro is right on money - it's the width of the front tires combined with hard suspension, wide track and short wheelbase. The reward is a razor crisp handling on the perfect roads AND the racetrack.

I'll tell you this - for track I have 295 Cups up front, regular is 275 and for a moment I was riding 265 PS2 up front. The same ****** road to the racetrack with the rails almost 1'' deep from heavy trucks - with 265 it was so so but I could survive. With 295's it was plain dangerous to go there, the car was able to make 2 feet side step INSTANTLY. I was was so scared just to see the truck in the opposite direction (2 lane rd.).

Enjoy and be safe!

 

[YellowViperSRT10]

Mine did it with the stock runflats and still does it with my 19/20" Pirelli Pzeros.

 

[viperjim]

Thanks for all of the input.
Jim

 

[Racer Robbie]

If you're going to run non-runflats get a compressor/repair kit from Luke at TireRack and a quality tire plug kit. I think the compressor/repair kit is made by Continental and comes in a small plastic box. With the compressor and plug kit, you can fix most flats - at least until you get to a tire shop for a vulcanized patch. I know .... we're not supposed to patch runflats, but I'm fine with it for regular street driving

NAPA sells a great tire repair kit that uses a metal gun to inject a vulcanized mushroom headed plug into the tire from the outside. the mushroom head expands inside the tire and seals the leak. This works great and has saved me a couple of times though it is pricey at around $95.00. The Compressor/sealer above is a great idea except for the fact that a lot of tire sealers are very explosive. I carry one in my viper along with the plug kit at all times. When I was in the tire business we would refuse to remove a tire that had any kind of sealer in it. The NAPA Part number is 710-1028

 

[outnumbered]

My 04 does it bad. I have become used to it. I have learned if you don't hold the steering wheel tightly it is better.

Also as far as the fat tires, I don't buy it. My Z06 rarely does it, except on real bad roads.

I wonder if it is more to do with the factory alignment or the tread pattern of the pilots.

 

[zorroespanol]

My 04 does it bad. I have become used to it. I have learned if you don't hold the steering wheel tightly it is better.

Also as far as the fat tires, I don't buy it. My Z06 rarely does it, except on real bad roads.

I wonder if it is more to do with the factory alignment or the tread pattern of the pilots.

ZO6's tires are smaller than the vipers up front, right?

And yes, the fatter the tires the bigger the problem. I've experienced it with many cars that I have upgraded the wheels.

I am sure suspension geometry will come into play as well, but the bottom line is that there isn't much you can do about it.

 

[Racer Robbie]

My 04 does it bad. I have become used to it. I have learned if you don't hold the steering wheel tightly it is better.

I wonder if it is more to do with the factory alignment or the tread pattern of the pilots.

We have found great differences between different vipers as far as alignment is concerned. For the price that these tires cost I would have a good alignment shop set your car to spec even if it is new.

And yes a light touch on the steering wheel is the way to go as you can feel the feedback from the road better than if you have a death grip that cramps up your hands.

 

[outnumbered]

My 04 does it bad. I have become used to it. I have learned if you don't hold the steering wheel tightly it is better.

Also as far as the fat tires, I don't buy it. My Z06 rarely does it, except on real bad roads.

I wonder if it is more to do with the factory alignment or the tread pattern of the pilots.

ZO6's tires are smaller than the vipers up front, right?

And yes, the fatter the tires the bigger the problem. I've experienced it with many cars that I have upgraded the wheels.

I am sure suspension geometry will come into play as well, but the bottom line is that there isn't much you can do about it.

Sorry for the delay. The front tires on both cars are 275/35/18.

So it is either the tread/compound or the alignment like Racer Robbie says.

 

[outnumbered]

My 04 does it bad. I have become used to it. I have learned if you don't hold the steering wheel tightly it is better.

I wonder if it is more to do with the factory alignment or the tread pattern of the pilots.

We have found great differences between different vipers as far as alignment is concerned. For the price that these tires cost I would have a good alignment shop set your car to spec even if it is new.

And yes a light touch on the steering wheel is the way to go as you can feel the feedback from the road better than if you have a death grip that cramps up your hands.

Do you recall what part of the alignment that is typically off? I was told before that the alignment is quite aggressive from the factory. Does an aggressive alignment cause this?

Even at high speeds on relatively smooth pavement, the car is quite twitchy.

Thanks,

Dan

 

[GTS Bruce]

My car was always twitchy.Two different alignment shops made it far worse.Took it to Chuck T.They road tested it and thought it was undrivable.Four hours later with a little more agressive alignment than stock the car was a [*****] cat.Difference of night and day.Take it to someone that knows alignments blindfolded and Vipers like Chuck and Rob. GTS Bruce

 

[GTS Bruce]

I didn't know that that word was banned.In the future I will use kitty-cat or kitten instead of ***** cat. Bruce