Well, not scary as in dangerous- but this really makes you think twice about Dodge having their head completely pulled out of there (insert appropriate term here)!
"Shock Knock"
"Shock Knock"
Want to know something scary about your SRT suspension?
- Thread starter Viper Specialty
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Kelly06
Viper Owner
Aaah, horsepuckey. First we have f355 (should be renamed as AH666) trying to excite and scare us about falling prices and now we have the "BIG BOLT ISSUE." 
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No shock knock here, not yet anyway.
OP
OP
Kelly06- PSSST! PSSST! (LOOK AT MY SIG, I OWN AN SRT...I am not stirring the ***. What good would it do ME?)
I agree with Dean's comment in the other forum. The essence of which is that if the fasteners are torqued in the loaded condition and torqued properly, then there should be no relative motion, and no reliance on the fastener OD except for initial positioning.
It was a good idea and I applaud all ideas that attempt to improve our beasts. So even though I do not see the value in these (at least for stock shocks) I do value the contribution.
It was a good idea and I applaud all ideas that attempt to improve our beasts. So even though I do not see the value in these (at least for stock shocks) I do value the contribution.
OP
OP
Ugh, what do people have to do to convince you guys? If it wasnt for the fact that I would have to take my suspension apart...AGAIN, I would show you were the "bite marks" from the stock bushings didnt do one ounce of good- they were still pushed all over the place! which WOULD NOT have happened if the bolts were correct in the first place.
And lets not even get into Dodge's ability to properly torque fasteners...
And lets not even get into Dodge's ability to properly torque fasteners...
My guess is that yours was not torqued properly if there are clear signs of motion. As an engineer I expect that a fastener in the situation like the shock mounting will "work" through its clamp load and friction between the surfaces, and not via the fastener fit and cantilever. I would expect that it would fail in bending (due to the cantilever effect) in that situation. IN addition, if the clamp load was insufficient to prevent motion, then the joint would be subject to wear. That would not be a good application of a fastener.
Another perspective is that even if you have reduced the diametral clearances significantly, if there is any clearance available, motion will occur between the two surfaces. Unless of course the clamp load is stopping it. And if the clamp load is stopping it from moving then the amount of clearance is irrelevant (at least from a movement perspective).
So I was not trying to be a pessimist at all. Just using my engineering judgement and knowledge of fastener joints. So I apologize if it came off that way.
Another perspective is that even if you have reduced the diametral clearances significantly, if there is any clearance available, motion will occur between the two surfaces. Unless of course the clamp load is stopping it. And if the clamp load is stopping it from moving then the amount of clearance is irrelevant (at least from a movement perspective).
So I was not trying to be a pessimist at all. Just using my engineering judgement and knowledge of fastener joints. So I apologize if it came off that way.
OP
OP
They were indeed torqued down correctly, I was just being cynical in my comment about Dodge and their Torquing abilities. I do appreciate what you are trying to say, but at the same time, must disagree with you from my engineering perspective. Regaurdless of the clamp load, hit a bump hard enough, and it WILL move...short of welding it together of course. My whole point is to eliminate NOISE, not movement directly. If it is going to move, and there is nothing that can be done about it- why give it any more room to do it than you have to? If it has nowhere to go- then it cant very well go there, even if it did have the necessary force to "move" it. As far as your wear comment goes, wear surface area is greatly increased with the use of "normal" bolts, whereas the rolled thread bolts are being worn in 2 particular areas, both in direct relation to the edges of the collar in the shock. If anything, the wear that would be occuring is reduced to an extreme degree with the swapping of the bolts. Lastly, These bolts are much stronger than what the factory supplies- if you want to increase clamp load, have at it! You can do it SAFELY to some degree with these bolts, where the stock bolts would be taxed.
Skip White
Enthusiast
I'm inclined to think along the lines of Daniel. If the oem setup has a that much play in the bolt, that would deffinetly move about. Are you guys forgetting this in not just a shock, it's the complete suspension. The working load in this area is many times greater than just a shock setup would have. And far as clamping force being enough, I seriously doubt that. I also think the coilover when compressed, moves in a somewhat anglular motion, due to the geometry of the lower control arm. I'll look for evidence of movement. I'm not going to have my customers mount a set of Aldan on the car with a bolt smaller than the sleeve they go in, thats for sure. If there is movement, then this would create a somewhat sloppy feal, just as worn bushings would.
Skip White
Skip White
OP
OP
Skip- Aldan's are where I first was able to pin point the issue. The noise was quite evident on SHARP turns at about 20-30 MPH, especially if there was a dip in the road. I would hear a sound that can mostly be compared to a spring from the suspension being hit with a rubber malet (shock extending and popping collar down) then shortly thereafter, (20 feet down the road/another dip/accelleration/etc) I would get the KNOCK as the collar resettled where it originally was.
GTS Dean
Enthusiast
OK, one more time....
The problem is not really so much the bolts' fit in the bushing sleeve, it's the sloppy tolerance relative to the bolt diameter at the hard points - the frame and the LCA. If you don't allow the bolts to settle against them in compression before final torquing, you will have relative motion and wear caused by shock loading in jounce. Disagree all you want, but that's the main issue.
As long as you retain rubber bushings in the suspension pickup points, all you have is an ordinary passenger car.
The problem is not really so much the bolts' fit in the bushing sleeve, it's the sloppy tolerance relative to the bolt diameter at the hard points - the frame and the LCA. If you don't allow the bolts to settle against them in compression before final torquing, you will have relative motion and wear caused by shock loading in jounce. Disagree all you want, but that's the main issue.
As long as you retain rubber bushings in the suspension pickup points, all you have is an ordinary passenger car.
