Pulling your car out of storage? Jump starting? READ THIS FIRST.

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Hey guys,

Well, its that time of year again... pulling the cars out of storage, and also time of the year for damaged PCM's and other oddities as a result of doing so. Hopefully, this post will save some of you a headache, or at least get you sorted out faster if you do have problems.

The number one cause of PCM damage is Jump Starting, Jump Boxes, and old school Battery Chargers. As the electronics age, they become increasingly sensitive to voltage surges and possible reverse polarity situations.

-NEVER use a transformer/rectifier based battery Charger, especially those with a "jump start" feature! They leak AC Ripple like it was in their design specifications.
-AVOID Jump Starting whenever possible unless its an emergency. And for the love of god, if you do, MAKE SURE THE CABLES ARE THE CORRECT POLARITY.
-Whenever possible, charge the battery with the KEY OFF, and remove the charger before attempting to crank and fire.
-DO use a microprocessor controlled "float charger" to keep your batteries charged. Once a battery goes dead ONE SINGLE TIME, it will never be the same and will degrade quickly.

If you suspect you have a PCM issue:

Turn key on.
If you have:
-No Fuel Pump Prime or constant fuel pump prime.
-No Check Engine Light Self-Test
-No Comms with a scan tool
And you *do* have power and ground at PCM connectors for both Constant 12V and Run/Start 12V...

...Your PCM is damaged.

In the case of Gen-1 cars, *ALWAYS* unplug suspected defective PCM's, as they can be a fire hazard even with the key out and power off.


Please contact us for assistance if you suspect you have PCM issues. We are the primary retail/wholesale PCM supplier and remanufacturer for the Viper [All] and Ram SRT-10 markets, and have been slowly heading into other portions of the market as well, with Gen-3/4/5 BCM remanufacturing, and hopefully soon Ram SRT-10 TIPM's.

And I cannot stress this enough: please consider the source for your parts, especially PCM's. While I plainly admit we are not the cheapest option, we are the best. Period. Full stop. The sheer number of butchered PCM's that come through my hands is staggering. The guy that claims to fix PCM's for 250 bucks on Ebay? Yeah, after he gets done destroying it and collecting his bogus Diag fee, I am the one who has to put Humpty-Dumpty back together again. The quality of work is absolutely atrocious, as you would expect. The larger problem however, is the dwindling number of available cores. Every time these guys destroy a PCM, that is one less in circulation, and things are already relatively tight. To expand on that, having an invalid core is a VERY large cost difference when getting a replacement module. If I don't have access to a fixable core, I need to source it elsewhere, and you are the one that will end up absorbing that other guys diag fee, along with a core replacement or penalty for making my life exponentially more difficult. To add insult to injury, core theft is a VERY REAL thing right now. These clowns know what Viper PCM's are worth, and they have been disappearing left and right. I have heard about no less than a dozen core module thefts and "convenient losses" in the last 6 months alone.

Secondly, please understand... virtually none of these guys have the first clue what they are doing, fixing, or selling you. There are literally 15 different versions of Viper PCM hardware, and I know every single version of them. You cant "reflash" your way to a hardware change. To add to that, there are literally 50 distinctly different software versions, with a different version for every year + Export, Race, and specialized versions. Those guys selling controllers for the wrong year because they happen to look the same? I am sure the various sensors and actuators that changed nearly every model year would appreciate, you know, BEING PLUGGED INTO THE PROPER HARDWARE DESIGNED TO RUN THEM. Hard to believe that its even a "thing", but it is. It drives me insane, and I see it every day. When we supply controllers, you get the CORRECT VERSION, most recent software, pre-programmed to your car and Plug & Play, and optionally with custom tune files. We also have the ability to transfer unobtanium tune files in most cases, as well as recover many SCT device issues and PCM pairing problems.

Please, think of the Vipers, not the pennies.

Here's a few pictures of the trash I deal with. Not much comparison compared to our products. Can you tell which components were replaced on our controllers? No? THATS THE POINT. OEM quality, ALWAYS.
 

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Well done, Dan !!

I truly hope that a broad spectrum of Viper owners will "r
ead and heed" your sound advice !!!
One can only hope... but unfortunately this market has more new owners that "know better" than ever before, and it's causing countless issues. Sad result of Facebook where everyone is an expert, and fall of the forums unfortunately.
 

Steve-Indy

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Another important point:

BEFORE you even open your garage door, BE SURE that your insurance coverage is fully in place !!!

This is very important...especially for those who suspend their insurance over the winter months. And, YES...this includes those who plan only a couple of mile drive from a storage facility to home. Sadly, I recall two different Viper owners in two different states in early summer of 2020 who did not take the time to activate their policies. Both of these Gen I's were "totaled"...and in one case, so was a new limited edition car that one of the Vipers hit. All expenses were out of pocket.
 

serafins

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I can second making sure you hook up the cables correctly. Seems so simple but I managed to get them backwards on a battery I was charging (outside of the car luckily.) it actually revived that battery somehow but it was smoking hot by the time I noticed. On another car AAA roadside connected the cables backwards and fried my infotainment system.
 

SecureOpossum

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My car came with an EverStart onboard charger/maintainer installed; will that be safe for the PCM, or do I need to remove it and get something else? I’m also in central NC, so there are only a few months that aren’t conducive to getting the car out and driving it. I’m not sure I’ll really be storing the car in the sense that’s being referenced in this thread. Any help is much appreciated!
 

2004 SRT-10

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We are lucky to have you in the Viper community Dan. Thanks again for getting me up and running with my OEM body control module repair. Since Stellantis does not support repair or share their coding to put the original mileage back in the BCM you are the only option to get this done correctly.
 
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My car came with an EverStart onboard charger/maintainer installed; will that be safe for the PCM, or do I need to remove it and get something else? I’m also in central NC, so there are only a few months that aren’t conducive to getting the car out and driving it. I’m not sure I’ll really be storing the car in the sense that’s being referenced in this thread. Any help is much appreciated!
A maintainer of that type should be perfectly fine. I do however advise replacing them every 10 years, or after any type of electrical surge issue in your home.
 

Go-ran

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A maintainer of that type should be perfectly fine. I do however advise replacing them every 10 years, or after any type of electrical surge issue in your home.
So technically speaking, is it best to plug these maintainers into a surge protector?
 
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Since everyone is not putting these cars away for the season...

NOW IS THE TIME TO BUY A PROPER BATTERY TENDER!

The Noco Genius line is excellent- wall mounted, multi-vehicle float charging options. Hands down the best option out there.
 

Steve M

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Since everyone is not putting these cars away for the season...

NOW IS THE TIME TO BUY A PROPER BATTERY TENDER!

The Noco Genius line is excellent- wall mounted, multi-vehicle float charging options. Hands down the best option out there.
But what if we disregard this advice and buy the GUDCHARG tender from Temu/Amazon for $5? That's good enough, right?
 

GTS Dean

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I just put mine on a 2 Amp trickle charger for 10-24 hours about every 6-8 weeks. Hook up to the positive stud on the PDC, then ground to the stud on the rocker panel ahead of the hood guide. Seems to work fine for me.
 
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I just put mine on a 2 Amp trickle charger for 10-24 hours about every 6-8 weeks. Hook up to the positive stud on the PDC, then ground to the stud on the rocker panel ahead of the hood guide. Seems to work fine for me.

Works... but not recommended. You are still having excessive partial discharge/charge cycles that are not necessary. Buy a float charger, and leave it connected 24/7.
 

killerviper

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Thanks for the writeup, great info! I have mine on a "Battery Tender" make charger, that I saw was recommended on here on another thread. Hope this is an acceptable charger!

 

Tom and Vipers

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I've got the orange, cold weather CTEK on my 96 GTS. Also have a 1 amp NOCO usually on my 74 Datsun pickup. I like the CTEK because it is a LED for each stem of the charging process. The NOCO is a black box. I don't like black boxes...
 

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Just got her back from 3 months hibernation. Had to install a new battery. Other than that, car started like a charm. (Still) No issues with the fuel pump... also, the infamous rough idle many are talking about after disconnecting the battery has never occurred to me in now 14 years of ownerhship (1998 RT/10). I do have a tune from Dan since several years (came with the SCT tuner I bought from him at the time). Even after 14 years turning the key for the first time after hibernation scares the shit out of me....:omg:
 

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One thing I haven't seen too much info about on here (in my admittedly limited searching)...

I had some discussion with someone who has a lifetime of experience building and rebuilding engines. He mentioned, I think quite fairly, that the time the car spends in winter storage is long enough that the engine will be completely dry by the time you start it up again in the spring. This is quite bad for the bearings. His recommendation is to install a momentary fuel pump cutoff switch (or remove the fuse), in order to crank the engine and build up oil pressure before actually starting the engine. I'm wondering what others here have done as good practice (e.g., what oil pressure should you build up to before turning on the fuel pump) for spring startup.
 
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One thing I haven't seen too much info about on here (in my admittedly limited searching)...

I had some discussion with someone who has a lifetime of experience building and rebuilding engines. He mentioned, I think quite fairly, that the time the car spends in winter storage is long enough that the engine will be completely dry by the time you start it up again in the spring. This is quite bad for the bearings. His recommendation is to install a momentary fuel pump cutoff switch (or remove the fuse), in order to crank the engine and build up oil pressure before actually starting the engine. I'm wondering what others here have done as good practice (e.g., what oil pressure should you build up to before turning on the fuel pump) for spring startup.


False. I have disassembled engines that sat for nearly a decade. They STILL weren't dry. I would not even consider trying to re-oil an engine that didn't sit for at *least* 3 years. Current oils are NOT old oils.

And what you are describing... ABSOLUTELY DO NOT EVER DO THIS.

You CANNOT prime a Viper oil pump at crank speeds! All you are doing is grinding away bearing material pointlessly and then "dry-starting" it anyway.

The proper process for truly avoiding a dry-start in a Viper engine is very cumbersome and complicated and virtually no one is going to actually do it.
 
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False. I have disassembled engines that sat for nearly a decade. They STILL weren't dry. I would not even consider trying to re-oil an engine that didn't sit for at *least* 3 years. Current oils are NOT old oils.

And what you are describing... ABSOLUTELY DO NOT EVER DO THIS.

You CANNOT prime a Viper oil pump at crank speeds! All you are doing is grinding away bearing material pointlessly and then "dry-starting" it anyway.

The proper process for truly avoiding a dry-start in a Viper engine is very cumbersome and complicated and virtually no one is going to actually do it.

Actually, hold on a minute. So you are saying that, even after several years, the engine is not going to be dry. But, if that's the case, then why would any bearing material grind away while cranking?

It is not obvious to me what is so special about a Viper oil pump that it cannot prime at crank speeds. If the oil pressure builds up during cranking, then clearly it's priming, right? Can you please clarify. It seems to me that, although the lower half of the bearings may not be dry, the upper halves the bearings may quite likely be dry and so the engine would likely benefit from priming before ignition after storage. What am I missing here?
 
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Actually, hold on a minute. So you are saying that, even after several years, the engine is not going to be dry. But, if that's the case, then why would any bearing material grind away while cranking?

It is not obvious to me what is so special about a Viper oil pump that it cannot prime at crank speeds. If the oil pressure builds up during cranking, then clearly it's priming, right? Can you please clarify. It seems to me that, although the lower half of the bearings may not be dry, the upper halves the bearings may quite likely be dry and so the engine would likely benefit from priming before ignition after storage. What am I missing here?

1. Oil drops to the lowest point in bearings, and pools. It does not "dry", it thins. This is enough to BRIEFLY avoid galling and material transfer, not build up an active oil film, and will quickly degrade and break down without active flow. This is no different than an engine that ran yesterday. Its still "briefly lubricated" and will immediately gall bearing material without oil supply in under a minute. If that wasnt a fact of engines as a whole... engines would be oil-less. Take an engine apart that sat for 5 years. It will look nearly identical to one that sat for a week.

2. Priming a pump means pulling a column of oil UPHILL against gravity at a faster rate than air can be introduced into the system through clearances or bleed back through the rotor lobes, before they are effectively sealed by the oil they are designed to pump. Gerotor pumps at low speed are NOT designed to pump air, and they seriously **** at it. It takes well over the ~200 cranking RPM to pull enough vacuum to wet and seal the gerotor lobes... unless you are pulling a vacuum on the pump outlet at the same time you are doing so... but that doesnt help your bearings either.

Pulling the ASD or FP relay and cranking doesnt build oil pressure. It just moves a little air around in the oil pump, and thats it. We dealt with this CONSTANTLY in our race engine program years ago and needed to specifically address exactly this problem in order to pre-oil the engines before shipment, and that included a vacuum pump on the outlet, a pre-charged accusump on the feed to make sure it wasnt actually being spun dry, plugs out, and then as soon as it was primed, it was all reconnected and cranked under starter power until the entire system was oiled and shipped ready to go, cooler, lines and all.
 
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1. Oil drops to the lowest point in bearings, and pools. It does not "dry", it thins. This is enough to BRIEFLY avoid galling and material transfer, not build up an active oil film, and will quickly degrade and break down without active flow. This is no different than an engine that ran yesterday. Its still "briefly lubricated" and will immediately gall bearing material without oil supply in under a minute. If that wasnt a fact of engines as a whole... engines would be oil-less. Take an engine apart that sat for 5 years. It will look nearly identical to one that sat for a week.

2. Priming a pump means pulling a column of oil UPHILL against gravity at a faster rate than air can be introduced into the system through clearances or bleed back through the rotor lobes, before they are effectively sealed by the oil they are designed to pump. Gerotor pumps at low speed are NOT designed to pump air, and they seriously **** at it. It takes well over the ~200 cranking RPM to pull enough vacuum to wet and seal the gerotor lobes... unless you are pulling a vacuum on the pump outlet at the same time you are doing so... but that doesnt help your bearings either.

Pulling the ASD or FP relay and cranking doesnt build oil pressure. It just moves a little air around in the oil pump, and thats it. We dealt with this CONSTANTLY in our race engine program years ago and needed to specifically address exactly this problem in order to pre-oil the engines before shipment, and that included a vacuum pump on the outlet, a pre-charged accusump on the feed to make sure it wasnt actually being spun dry, plugs out, and then as soon as it was primed, it was all reconnected and cranked under starter power until the entire system was oiled and shipped ready to go, cooler, lines and all.

Ok, I understand your point on #1. For #2, however, GM LS engines have the same setup, with a gerotor pump mounted on the crank snout, long pickup tube and a rear sump oil pan, and they do build oil pressure while cranking (usually within 10-20 seconds to get to 10-20 PSI). So is there something unique about the Viper that would make this not happen? Or rather I should ask have you ever tried this empirically and NOT observed an increase in oil pressure while cranking?
 
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Ok, I understand your point on #1. For #2, however, GM LS engines have the same setup, with a gerotor pump mounted on the crank snout, long pickup tube and a rear sump oil pan, and they do build oil pressure while cranking (usually within 10-20 seconds to get to 10-20 PSI). So is there something unique about the Viper that would make this not happen? Or rather I should ask have you ever tried this empirically and NOT observed an increase in oil pressure while cranking?

First, I cannot speak to the GM design. They may have different pump volumes, clearances, pump height over oil level, etc.

Second, 10-20 seconds of cranking to get any pressure at all is literally 5x longer than you would get just starting the engine... and I can assure you, results in more bearing wear than just starting the damn thing. The enemy of plain bearings is insufficient oil flow and rotational speeds too slow to properly form a hydrodynamic oil film.

Third, I answered your last comment above. When I said we dealt with this constantly, I meant exactly that. We had to develop a method of priming these engines because they WILL NOT do it on their own at cranking speeds in any remotely reasonable time frame to avoid doing more harm than good.

Go try it yourself and then come back and you will see that I am not exaggerating... if you dare!
 
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