Gen V impressions after 1,200+ miles

PilotaX

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Since I purchased my GTS a month or so back I’ve had a number of Viper owners ask me how the car compares to earlier model Vipers. So I decided I would start to put down some of those thoughts in writing for anyone who’s thinking about ordering a Gen V down the road.

For starters, here's a little background on the car and driver for frame of reference.

Model: 2013 Viper GTS Launch Edition
Owner: Middle aged racecar driver/business owner
Date: May 21, 2013
Mileage: 1,200+
Maintenance to date: None
Problems to date: None

Now on to the impressions.

When I bought the GTS, I expected it to be good for “spirited” drives on the back roads, club events and an occasional track day. Surprisingly, I’ve found myself driving the GTS most of the time, as though it were my daily driver. I’m not sure if I can explain why… But I’ll give it a shot.

From the seat of the pants, it feels like the GTS has an additional 60-70 HP over my Gen 4 Viper. The lighter flywheel and shorter gearing may explain part of that feeling. But the Gen 5 also seems to have a much wider power curve than earlier cars. For comparison, my Gen 2 (lightly modified) has great low-end torque, but tends to run out of steam above 5,500 RPM. In contrast, my Gen 4 feels a little anemic at lower RPMs but goes like a bat out of hell once it gets on the cam. The Gen 5 combines the best of the prior generations with a mountain of torque from 1,500 – 6,500 RPM.

The transmission is silky smooth. It has a distinctly American feel to it; those who are used to German cars may not immediately take to it. When changing gears it feels just a little bit “heavier” than say a current Porsche. But it is equally precise and smooth, and gearshifts are just as quick. The throw is also shorter than a Gen 4 Viper (and, needless to say, much shorter than a Gen 2 Viper). I’d have to say that it’s one of the best manual transmissions I’ve used to date.
The suspension is also much improved for spirited driving on everyday roads. By that I mean that it absorbs road imperfections better than the Gen 4, while retaining the same overall feel for the road and with a higher peak level of grip. On the other hand, you still have to be careful when putting the power down on a bumpy section of road.

This past weekend I took my first relatively short road trip in the GTS. My son and I drove up to “Viper Car Sunday” (the SoCal VCA was featured at “Supercar Sunday” in Woodland Hills, CA). It was about a two-hour drive each way and, in between, we also took a leisurely 28-mile club drive on the Mulholland Highway. I was surprised at how well the car handled the bumpy So Cal highways. It seemed to absorb the bad stuff better than my last Porsche Turbo (997 version).

Finally, there is one oddity in the suspension that I will probably “fix” by some minor upgrade(s). Specifically, the car does not respond well to trail braking. I’ve found that I have to switch my brain to “rear-engine race car” mode, completing 99% of heavy braking in a straight line. That’s unusual because most front engine, rear drive cars respond well to a more gradual release of the brakes as you begin turn in. Talking to Dan Cragin on Sunday, he mentioned that the Gen 5 suspension allows more dynamic toe change (vs. prior generations). I believe that explains the issue. Though the difference appears to have been intentional, I think lap times will likely be better if you are able to use more of the friction circle (which is what trail braking does for you).

BTW, I haven't had the 2013 on the track yet. So, my thoughts regarding the toe change issue are untested at this point. With the race season going on right now, I probably won't have time to try the GTS on the track until the Fall.

I’ve also received a number of questions about the car’s “comfort level” and “luxury features”. This is not an easy question to answer and I think to some extent many journalists have conveyed somewhat of a superficial sense of what the car is really like. IMO, the quality of the interior materials, fit, and finish is far better than prior generations. As far as the quality of the materials used, they are on par with the higher trim levels of the Porsche 911. But these features don’t necessarily translate into comfort or luxury IMO. For example, the seats are comparable to the optional Porsche GT2/3 race style seats in terms of comfort (though a little wider in the hip). I personally like them. They are functional for a car with this level of performance. But I wouldn’t call them comfortable. With this in mind, I think that SRT should consider offering an optional seat that is more oriented toward comfort. I would be willing to bet that more buyers would opt for the “comfort” seats than the “performance” seats (which, btw, is consistent with what the majority of Porsche owners opt for).

The Gen 5’s audio and electronics are vastly improved. The GTS’s sound system is on par with the optional Burmeister system offered by Porsche. The climate control also works much better than what was offered in the Gen 4. And while my Gen 4 actually has a factory navigation system, the controls are barely functional. The Gen 5 rectifies that problem with a very easy to use and intuitive interface.

I haven’t used many of the “Apps” and other electronic features yet. I’m usually so focused on the driving experience that I really don’t tend to use those things much. I even forget to turn on the data acquisition system in the race car sometimes. So I can’t comment much on those features just yet. Maybe I will let my 12-year old comment on those later, after he’s had a little time to play with them.

In terms of noise, vibration & harshness (NVH), you can tell that SRT has done quite a bit of work to reduce the amount of noise entering the cockpit from the outside. Squeaks and rattles are also much less apparent (vs. my Gen 4), but still more than what you’d find in a conventional unibody car.

Ironically, while the cabin is generally quieter, when you are on the throttle the exhaust sound level is actually louder than in my Gen 2 with Belanger headers, high flow cats and Corsa exhaust. I think SRT may ultimately need to offer an optional “touring” exhaust system that’s quieter on the inside. Don’t get me wrong, the exhaust sounds great. And after driving the car for a month or so now, I’m not sure whether I’d opt for a “touring” system or keep the “sport” system that came on the car. But, I’m willing to be that the system that’s on the car now is louder than many buyers are expecting (maybe 50% of buyers?).

One final thing that a number of people have asked about is the traction control. Unfortunately I haven’t been able to answer that question because, out of habit, I always turn off traction control before I leave the garage. When traction control systems first started to become more widely available, I experimented with them in autocross and on the track, and found that they absolutely killed your lap times and ruined all attempts to steer a little with the throttle. So I haven’t been able to bring myself to use it—even though I know that TC systems have improved immensely since my experiments in the 90s. But I do think it is a smart idea to equip the car with TC (even if it weren't required by law). The Gen 5 is a lot of car, with immense torque and high limits that require a high level of skill to bring it back if you exceed those limits.

Hopefully this helps to answer some of the questions that other Viper owners have. I still can't exactly explain what it is about the car that makes it so appealing as a daily driver for me. Well, I'll give it a shot. I think what it is is that it's the closest you can get to experiencing the feel of a race car, with just enough refinement to also drive it 4-5 days a week and not feel completely spent (as you do feel after you drive a race car). That's quite an accomplishment really. In fact, I think that if that's what SRT intended, they actually hit the nail on the head slightly better than the Porsche GT3RS (which is actually just a little too civilized to actually feel like a real race car when driven in town, even though it certainly feels like one on the track).
 

AZWHTSNK

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Thanks for the great assessment. Will be interested in your thoughts after 5k miles and some track time. Please keep us informed.
 

Makara

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Nice to hear what you think. Every viper I have owned I figured I would have forever yet I keep finding myself in newer models. I imagine I'll break down and get a gen V at some point. Sounds like a fantastic car. Enjoy the hell out of it.
 

01sapphirebob

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Thats for the writeup! Very informative and hopefully some of those that are still waiting for their cars will read this and not give up and stick it out. :)
 

strykergts

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Excellent insight. By your impressions, it sounds as though SRT delivered on everything they promised about the new snake.
 

Brian GTS

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That's a nice write up....and VERY ACCURATE to what my opinion would be....but I've only have 40 miles of driving on mine. :) I'm with you on the daily driver. This thing is a blast to drive and is something you can enjoy for an extended drive. Admittedly, I was a bit skeptical about this car initially, but it is in a totally different league compared to my Gen II / IV. In fairness, there are still things I like about my Gen II....raw, crude, simple, etc.....but this car is a great addition!!! You guys waiting for your cars are going to be pleasantly surprised. :2tu:
 

HyperViper

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Great write up. You sure your not a car magazine writer ;)

Question for you though. One thing that has always bugged me on my Gen 4 are the stupid sun visors. When I drove the Gen 5 at VOI it didn't appear that the ones on the new car were any different. Any better?
 

I Bin Therbefor

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Absolutely GREAT report. Many Thanks.

Agree about the GT seat, option from Viper. As to the exhaust. been thinking about working with an after market supplier on a selectable exhaust, pipes all the way to the rear and blow across the diffuser or select to out the side. :dunno:
 

Nine Ball

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Excellent write-up! Funny you mention that there should be an option for the comfort seats, when all the Corvette guys complain that their seats are too soft and they desire a performance oriented seat. I agree, having two different options would be good, the C7 Corvette will have this finally.

I'll have about 1400 miles on my Gen 5 by this weekend, and will also do a write-up review on it. Picking it up tomorrow :)

Tony
 

SilveRT8

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Thanks Great review! Makes me even more anxious to get mine in probably 2 months or so.
Since I already used my Gen IV as a daily driver on nice days, I'm glad to know this one will be even more enjoyable.
On the hard seat bottom, a solution might be to carry a square gel foam pad (as used for stadium benches) for long rides and keep it stored behind the seat when not needed.
 

Bobpantax

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Great write up. Great writing. How would you compare the steering effort and the feel of the steering wheel to your Gen IV? Your comment regarding the seats is spot on. To me, it is far less comfortable than the Gen III/IV seat. Too hard.
 

kratedisease

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Thanks for the objective review. Good to hear that the car is as good as expected !!
 

Voice of Reason

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First post!

I picked up my Red SRT this past weekend and it's my first Viper. My only comparison is from 11 years ago when my wife rented me an 01 RT/10 for a weekend and it's been too long for a good side to side comparison. But I will say that 36 years old, 6'2", 192 lbs the car fits me like a glove and I love the seats. If I were driving cross country they might feel a little stiff after a while, but for anything less they seem perfect for my build. I going to look into removing the stop/bump thing from the seat so I can lower it that additional 1" to see if that improves visibility out the front, but even if it didn't it's not a problem.
 

kdaviper

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First post!

I picked up my Red SRT this past weekend and it's my first Viper. My only comparison is from 11 years ago when my wife rented me an 01 RT/10 for a weekend and it's been too long for a good side to side comparison. But I will say that 36 years old, 6'2", 192 lbs the car fits me like a glove and I love the seats. If I were driving cross country they might feel a little stiff after a while, but for anything less they seem perfect for my build. I going to look into removing the stop/bump thing from the seat so I can lower it that additional 1" to see if that improves visibility out the front, but even if it didn't it's not a problem.

Congrats on your purchase and welcome to the forums!
 

SilveRT8

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First post!

I picked up my Red SRT this past weekend and it's my first Viper. My only comparison is from 11 years ago when my wife rented me an 01 RT/10 for a weekend and it's been too long for a good side to side comparison. But I will say that 36 years old, 6'2", 192 lbs the car fits me like a glove and I love the seats. If I were driving cross country they might feel a little stiff after a while, but for anything less they seem perfect for my build. I going to look into removing the stop/bump thing from the seat so I can lower it that additional 1" to see if that improves visibility out the front, but even if it didn't it's not a problem.

Congrats and welcome !
A "Voice of Reason" is often needed around here !
 

SnakeBitten

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:2tu:Nice write up. I really wanted to hear from owners about the comfort level instead of teh mag articles since you actually live with it as opposed to driving it for an hour or two. Im glad to hear the interior is on par with the 911 etc. That is quite an accomplishment by SRT in just one model year up from the G4. Just taken aback by the rattles etc you mentioned being heard on a 100-150k car.:omg: Most cars develop some niggling rattle or sound after a while but your car is brand new. Was not expecting to hear that at all. I await your breakdown on how it does at the track.
 

eucharistos

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thanks for the write-up :2tu:

the comments about being a good daily driver concern me as i wait for a low mileage garage queen in a few years :omg:

peace
 

Voice of Reason

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Lol, that was me a decade ago ... + 3lb. a year since.

Congrats on your car; enough headroom to go racing?

I've been so excited to finally get the car of my dreams I hadn't checked yet! So I just went the garage and yes, my helmet does fit but it touches the ceiling. Bumps would not be plesant like that so I definitely need to remove those peg/stop things to lower the seat an inch. Your mileage may vary, I have a big head and use a XXL helmet size.
 
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PilotaX

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FWIW the minor squeaks are mostly from the seats where they touch the console behind. If i move it forward just enough it goes away. But them i seem to end up moving it back again when my right knee acts up. ***** getting older. :). Funny but i have a similar noise coming from the backseat area in my 991 Carrera. Compared to my gen 4 the amount of extraneous noise is about 90% less in both the gen 5 and Carrera.
 
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PilotaX

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What was it that bothered you about the sun visors? To be honest I haven't used them a and I can't even picture what they look like right now. I guess I'll have to check that out tomorrow. :)

Great write up. You sure your not a car magazine writer ;)

Question for you though. One thing that has always bugged me on my Gen 4 are the stupid sun visors. When I drove the Gen 5 at VOI it didn't appear that the ones on the new car were any different. Any better?
 
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PilotaX

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I like the selectable exhaust idea. Porsche offers that and I think it's a good solution, though Porsche exhausts are so quiet I always just ended up leaving the exhaust in sport mode. I think if the Viper's quiet mode was about the same volume as the Porsche's sport mode it would be just about right.

Absolutely GREAT report. Many Thanks.

Agree about the GT seat, option from Viper. As to the exhaust. been thinking about working with an after market supplier on a selectable exhaust, pipes all the way to the rear and blow across the diffuser or select to out the side. :dunno:
 
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PilotaX

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Wow,1,400 miles in the first weekend! Glad to see I won't be the only one having trouble keeping the miles down!

Excellent write-up! Funny you mention that there should be an option for the comfort seats, when all the Corvette guys complain that their seats are too soft and they desire a performance oriented seat. I agree, having two different options would be good, the C7 Corvette will have this finally.

I'll have about 1400 miles on my Gen 5 by this weekend, and will also do a write-up review on it. Picking it up tomorrow :)

Tony
 
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PilotaX

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On the hard seat bottom, a solution might be to carry a square gel foam pad (as used for stadium benches) for long rides and keep it stored behind the seat when not needed.

I don't think the seat bottom is hard... But that reminded me of something I meant to say. For me there are two things i would change about the seat. First I'd like some adjustability in the lumbar area. Even just a simple inflatable gizmo like the gen 2 has would work. Second, it would be great to be able to save the electronic seat settings so you can easily return to positions that work for different types of driving (like highway cruising vs track).
 
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PilotaX

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Interesting question. I don't have any complaints about steering effort in either car. All three of my Vipers seem within reason to me in this area... not too light and not too heavy.

On the other hand I think the steering feel is better in the gen 5. The gen 2 and gen 4 seem to respond in what feels like a bit of an exaggerated manner. By that I mean a small amount of steering results in more directional change than I would normally expect. That said I always adjust to them fairly quickly after I get in.

Maybe that was what you were referring to re the steering?

P.S. The toe change that occurs under trail braking Is the only scenario I've found where the steering feel and suspension response are a little off IMO. That should be an easy fix.

Great write up. Great writing. How would you compare the steering effort and the feel of the steering wheel to your Gen IV? Your comment regarding the seats is spot on. To me, it is far less comfortable than the Gen III/IV seat. Too hard.
 

Mister Viper

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Viper Engineering thanks you for the great, and detailed, feedback! You've given us our report card - now we keep working at making it faster and better! ;) Thanks again for the wonderfully detailed feedback, it really helps us know what you like, and what needs 'more loving'.

Enjoy.

PS. If you're finding yourself driving the Gen 5 more than you expected, we're glad! Mission accomplished!!
 

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