Starting and idle issue on a 97 GTS

[Vital Velocity]

Friend has a 97 GTS thats been sitting for about a year and a half (outside under a tent). Long story short when its running it is missing.

When you go to start it up it will crank and crank and crank for about 10-15 seconds before it catches unless you turn the key to on and then off and then on and off back and forth for about 4 times and then it starts up a little easier ( or if i apply some pressure on the gas peddle while cranking it will start quicker ).

I put new gas in it (about 8 gallons) but only drove it about 15 miles.

Where to start looking?

 

[KNG SNKE]

Changed the oil already? Clean the fuel filter?

 

[Vital Velocity]

Oil was changed after driving it home, he has not done the fuel filter yet.

Would that cause the constant miss?

 

[KNG SNKE]

If its not allowing good fuel pressure sure. Fouled spark plugs, corroded spark plug wires, bad connection. There is a lot of things that can attribute to this. Vehicles are not meant to sit for really long periods of time without the proper preparation.

 

[Vital Velocity]

Im just trying to decide which ones to attack first with him...... im changing the wires from my 02 so im going to give him mine to throw in there. But should i do the plugs/wires first or the fuel filter?

Where would tehre be bad connects?

Yeah its a damn shame this car has sat so long we just want to get it up and running properly. What makes me think fuel is the whole prime it a few times and it goes.....doesnt seem as it would be a spark issue does it>?

 

[KNG SNKE]

Im just trying to decide which ones to attack first with him...... im changing the wires from my 02 so im going to give him mine to throw in there. But should i do the plugs/wires first or the fuel filter?

Where would tehre be bad connects?

Yeah its a damn shame this car has sat so long we just want to get it up and running properly. What makes me think fuel is the whole prime it a few times and it goes.....doesnt seem as it would be a spark issue does it>?

The wires would be the bad connection. They are rubber and tend to corrode. I would definitely pull the plugs and look at them if not change them. Not too expensive and during this you can check out your plug wires. Was the battery dead as well? I'm sure it was, did you replace it or just charge it?

 

[britospeed]

After it runs for a few minutes pull the plugs and read them to see if you rich or lean. This will also let you know how each cylinder is doing. You can also check the rail pressure at the test port to see if the "prime" is generating the correct rail pressure before cranking.

 

[RTTTTed]

After doing spark plugs, oil and filter changes, you FIRST drain the fuel out or drive it until all the old/bad fuel is gone. Then, if there are issues after the old fuel is gone you start to look for problems. Wires are a good choice for changing if the ones on the car are old.

Ted

 

[Vital Velocity]

Is there a good fuel addative/cleaner i can run through it......

 

[Steve-Indy]

Techron is a good product.

 

[Vital Velocity]

Is it worth dumping the fuel treatement into it prior to pulling the fuel filter to see if its gunked up?

 

[RTTTTed]

You could send a PM to Tom, but wouldn't it be easier to either dump the fuel or drive it off? You could add an additive, but I wouldn't expect it to help now, unless your problem is too much water/condensation (then an alcohol/isopropenol additive would be helpful). Fuel Stabilizer should be added to any car getting parked for a few months or more. Cars, sleds, bikes etc, should never be parked with less than a full tank of fuel as condendsation can build up in air spaces as it sits through climate/temp changes

Ted

 

[Dom426h]

I am not aware of a product that can fix/clean OLD gas.
I'd figure out a way to drain the tank...

Once you get Good fuel in her, add a container of Techron
Our Fuels: Fuel Additives: Techron Concentrate Plus
This will hopfully clean up your injectors that are likely gunked up with the old fuel.

Battery. Was it on a tender? If not, Replace it with a new one.

best of luck getting her back to 100%, and if your bud is ever planning on letting her sit for that long again do me a favor and him.

 

[Vital Velocity]

He didnt let it sit he got it like that from someone who was just letting it sit. He is sending me a few videos of the car from the rear for you guys to listen to. When he picked it up the tank was on E so the first stop he made was to a gas station

 

[Vital Velocity]

all were taken after the intial start up (where it takes a really long time to fire )

Quick start up vid

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Engine Bay

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Back of the car moving camera around the pipes

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Longer start up, tehn back of car and a few revs

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[KNG SNKE]

Ok your startup sounds fine to me. The viper takes a few kicks over to start. My current one and my old one both took a sec to get started. The exhaust clips and engine clips make it hard to tell how it is idling.

 

[Vital Velocity]

Usually the start up takes about 3 times as long....he did dump some seafoam into the gas tank and let it idle for 15 minutes or so. He also when and pushed down on all the spark plug wires on the distributer and to the plugs.

He said his socket for plugs didnt fit into the heat shields for them

 

[KNG SNKE]

Usually the start up takes about 3 times as long....he did dump some seafoam into the gas tank and let it idle for 15 minutes or so. He also when and pushed down on all the spark plug wires on the distributer and to the plugs.

He said his socket for plugs didnt fit into the heat shields for them

Wrong socket then. If it takes 3 times longer normally then that is wrong but in those videos it sounds pretty normal.

 

[Vital Velocity]

Hmm maybe ill tell him to just do the plugs and wires and take it out and drive it for a weekend to see how it does?

Im on my blackberry.... what size socked can i text him to use?

 

[KNG SNKE]

Hmm maybe ill tell him to just do the plugs and wires and take it out and drive it for a weekend to see how it does?

Im on my blackberry.... what size socked can i text him to use?

5/8 spark plug socket

 

[Dom426h]

Sounds fine to me, but its hard to tell listening to the crappy quality sound. (i assume that was just the wind making the distorted sound in the 3rd clip?)

Whats up with the quick stabbing revups in the last clip? A gradual increase in rpms to about 5000 might be more helpfll to listen to.

Does it Sound like its missing?, or Feal like its missing?
If its just sound I think the problem might that you are used to listening to a creampuff(00-02viper). They have a much smoother running tone when compared to a 96-99viper wich has a "lumpyer" cam making it sound inconsisent. so you really cant compare yours to his...

Also, that exhaust does not sound stock. Def atleast a rear muffler delete and maybee hiflow-cats or no cats.
A 96-99 viper with a modded exhaust makes an 00-02 with stock exhaust sound like a honda...

 

[Vital Velocity]

Maybe i am just used to my 02? It sounds like its missing but seems to pull well. The thing that throws me off is the starting....when he first goes to start it you have to crank for about 7-10 seconds.


He dumped some sea foam in it is going to drive it around tommorow for a bid then do the plugs/wires for it tuesday and the fuel filter

 

[KNG SNKE]

If it is literally 7 to 10 seconds that is too long. Mine takes about 3 to 5 seconds normally.

 

[Brian GTS]

Maybe it's not missing. Maybe you're just hearing the lumpier CAM as it does sound much different than an 02. I also have 97 GTS with the exact same problem, tough to start unless I give it gas, takes 10 seconds or so to get her running, etc.

How old is the battery? I heard this can cause this exact problem...not enough amp hour capacity. That is where I would start unless you battery is new.

 

[jay01m]

The gas tank could be varnished and sludged up if the gas was sitting for a year and a half. If that's the case new gas goes bad quick. I'm having the same problem with one of my other cars, and the arrows are pointing towards the gas tank. Never cleaned a Viper gas tank, but my first thought is that you'll probably have to pull it to clean it out. There are online searches you can do to get the exact procedures and materials.

 

[Compensating]

one word.... BATTERY!!!!!!

My 97 does this every 3 years or so when its time for a new one... no really.. even if the battery is a tad bit wore out it will cause this..

 

[Vital Velocity]

Well i know that the map sensor and the iac sensor is bad....

 

[Vital Velocity]

So we changed the sensors and went to change the spark plug wires....appears the person before really was a lazy ass.....number 1, they didnt bother to do the rear two.

On top of that 3 out of the ten wires were not "clicked" on. Did that and it seems to have fixed the miss....still a little lopey compared my 02.

Still a starting issue, however i believe it could be the battery....it cranks and cranks when first started, but if i go out and drive it (alt charge it ) it starts a lot better.

 

[Vital Velocity]

Used Tom, F&L GoR primer timer and fixed the starting issue. My buddy says thanks a million!!

 

[Dan Cragin]

It sounds to me like this is a simple fuel pump module check valve issue. Hard starting, long crank time. I have not followed on the post, but call me if you need help.