1. CWhiteRun

    CWhiteRun Has Left the Room!

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    Wrong again Buckwheat.......................... If the car came with 700HP, it would have performed and therefor sold. It did neither, and is dieing. IF/WHEN the ACR comes out with 700HP, it might save the line. Otherwise it dies in 2-3 years. No more Viper. Get ready for it.
     
  2. CWhiteRun

    CWhiteRun Has Left the Room!

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    So explain why the corvettes are leaving the lots in record numbers?! Wha... What?! Don't have a response? Doh!
     
  3. DMan

    DMan Viper Owner

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    Man, the tide has shifted for me. This forum is becoming so useless, I was on here for things viper related 100% of the time, then half the time, then less .. Now I wonder every time I check in, why I bothered. Geesh. I don't mean to be insulting, truly, but how do posts like this serve as helpful in any way to the gen5 owner or enthusiast ...
     
  4. black mamba1

    black mamba1 Viper Owner

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    Posts like these exists because Viper nation is comprised of diverse, mature, and complex people. One reason VCA is so respected is that they accept and consider contrarian views and does not suppress or delete content that while may not tote the political ball, but is also not vulgar or offensive.

    Buying cars, loving cars, driving cars, following cars, devotion to cars is so much more than just pistons, modifications, horsepower, and the numbers. Its also a culture, and a culture thats evolving, changing, and at the same time, honoring and remaining the same.

    Cars extract a lot of emotion from car enthusiasts, and that means that sometimes you are gonna see or read something you do not value or agree with, and that's ok. The bigger picture is that cars have brought more people together than any other entity or industry world wide.

    There is value in dissension. The Viper came into existence because somebody was being a rebel and descended against the status quo. The Viper has evolved because of dissension.

    So, if you see something you don't like, read a post you don't like, simply move on to other posts you do like. No need to complain or whatever....

    One thing the Viper represents more than anything else...is Freedom...and that includes the Freedom of members to say and express what they feel and believe.:usa:
     
  5. Bobpantax

    Bobpantax Enthusiast

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    "And Bob....you were right that Obama would bring the economy back from the brink of depression...you were also right that President Obama would find and kill Osama Bin Laden, and you were also right that the stock market and the economy would also perform at record levels under President Obama...."

    1. The economy is still in the tank.
    2. Terrorism is worse than ever. (Remember when Obama said the war on terror is over? Another one of his lies.)
    3. The stock market, adjusted for inflation, is not at record levels.
    4. Ask fixed income retirees how they feel.
    5. Ask the record number of people on food stamps, SSI, and removed from the work force how they feel.

    Keith. You are drinking the Obama coolaid - you might say you have brand loyalty blindness.
     
  6. former345bhpLS1

    former345bhpLS1 Enthusiast

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    I'll admit that the Viper does not have enough power to make up for one's own insecurities and inadequacies (I don't mean you in particular, more as a generality). Even cars that do only do so for a few fleeting moments until the next better thing is released or you realize that your neighbors car is running more boost, etc. There are products that can help with that, check your email spam folder for details.

    I drive strictly for the sake of driving and drive simply because I enjoy it (and I'm 33y/o for the record). For that, the Gen V is perfect.

    The other issues you mentioned, I'm glad that isn't something that I'm compelled to worry about. Sounds like a fools errand.

    Fortunately we can agree to disagree.

    -Nick
     
  7. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    Dieing is not a word
     
  8. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    It is almost as if you so called "viper enthusiasts" want SRT to fail and the Viper to go away again. Some of you are cheering for it.

    Sad.

    This thread is the embodiment of why SRT ran away from the VCA.
     
  9. Alabaster Mamba

    Alabaster Mamba Enthusiast

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    So true and the OP is trying his best to portray everything as doom and gloom. I guess it makes him sleep better at night.
     
  10. black mamba1

    black mamba1 Viper Owner

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    Last edited: Nov 26, 2013
  11. Flylow

    Flylow Viper Owner

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    I agree with all of it. Hate loosing, sure wish this great engine had 800 hp, doom, gloom etc.

    Still, this is probably the only (new) sports car where you are actually the driver - not the electronics. To me that is simply fantastic. I already love the design (except for covering the engine in plastic). I will go for the "chrome-colored" version, accepting it is not the fastest sports car out there. Then again, no one car is the fastest.
     
  12. 05Commemorative

    05Commemorative Viper Owner

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    wouldn't common sense suggest its 60K price tag and pent-up demand from its loyal followers? Seems pretty obvious really and in that price range, what else can compete with the vette? It really has that segment to itself. Not sure how that is related though to the 100-140k market he was describing though.
     
  13. tattooed

    tattooed Viper Owner

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  14. Nine Ball

    Nine Ball Enthusiast

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    Still the best Viper made to date. If you are a Viper enthusiast, then you'd still have some desire to own the best of the best.

    I often wonder what these guys that complain about the performance actually drive? Do any of you currently own Viper(s) that outperform the Gen V?
     
  15. viper GTS-R

    viper GTS-R Enthusiast

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    Yes. Alot of poeople do, they all currently own Gen IV ACR's. That's the point. Gen I/II's are their own breed. They got a little better with age and then the Gen III/IV's came out and they too got better with age but in 03' had been proven succesors to the gen I/II's and then when the Gen IV arrived the world took notice. The ACR went to Nurburgring and held that record for a pretty decent amount of time.

    Then the Gen V came out. The first mistake was sending it out and comparing it to the ACR...and it was slower. That's when people started questioning it all. Tires, suspension, horsepower, the stupid tech nannies, etc. If that car couldn't beat it's predecessor on a race track then what the hell happened? When it couldn't beat the outgoing ZR1, holy crap what a storm that was, THAT'S when it became an issue. It seemed that the TA's single purpose was to beat the ZR1...and it did, but not by much. It's pretty obvious that while the street car wears Pirelli's, the obvious choice are Michelins. Even the race car uses them.

    Better interior, fine. Better handling, fine. Adjustable TCS, fine. That's all fine. When the performance stops, hits a brick wall and the philosophy of the car gets watered down a little bit, then you have a problem. Those that bought earlier gens knew exactally what they were getting into and after everything that's happened so far, to them the gen V is just not the same.

    Of course people wanted the Viper to continue. There's a charm about it but this time it's lost a little bit of that charm. In a sea of computer controlled supercars the Viper was against all that, it was a sledgehammer in a sea of rubber mallets. If you guys haven't noticed, every once in a while comes a thread about an automatic or a HEMI being stuffed in a Viper.

    I personally like the car but at the same time I can't deny what's already been said. I've seen a dozen or so since VOI12, I consider that alot for only a year and it's amazing to look at. I even drove it at VOI, but maybe in a few months when it's warmer out I'll like it even more. Harold even invited me down to his place to photograph his car.

    --RS
     
  16. kennyhemi

    kennyhemi Viper Owner

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    + 1 and + A BIG 1!!!
     
  17. DMan

    DMan Viper Owner

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    Did you really just write "the reason the VCA is so respected", really, really?? You need to stop typing so much and read a little, my friend. VCA is fighting for its life, to say anything else is pure and simple denial, and it's not in trouble because of all the respect it has genned up.

    Hopefully the Viper will fail and indeed be gone in 2-3 years as you predict, then you can come here & post "I told ya" again and be right .. if this site exsits then.

    How do you see any benefit from your posts? Is Ralph going to read your post and go, "wow, now I see, with my shoe string budget that required more than half my $ to go to just getting legal on the traction & stability control, what was I thinking, guys get out that 8 cylinder adjustable twin-turbo motor ...".

    I'm on a bunch of boards for cars & bikes I own and most have a bitch session forum or "anything goes", this site needs one, so people can go ahead and post about how the gen5 is the Obama of exotics there, and leave the gen5 forum to guys trading info for owners & enthusiast about the car.

    That way posts like these can live and thrive but be dropped into that forum and keep this forum clean. Without it, here's my prediction, this forum is going to die, along with the site. In fact, it is, as I observe the posting volume between here & the alternatives, it's gettin pretty anemic here, which also increases the the ratio of posts like these, only making things even worse, and so on.

    But anyway, back to the gen5 as you were saying what about Obama ... :crazy2:
     
  18. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    Last edited: Nov 26, 2013
  19. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    I think the only real issue (which you hit on) was the fact that the Gen V wasn't a big enough upgrade from the Gen IV ACR. It wasn't enough to make the guys with the Gen IV ACR's run out and trade their cars in.

    It is everything I expected a Viper to be, coming into the platform, but I can see why guys with IV's find it a bit lack luster to toss down another $40k to "upgrade"
     
  20. kdaviper

    kdaviper Enthusiast

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    Woah, woah, everybody, it's obvious that Black Mamba speaks for every previous Gen owner...
    All I'm getting from his posts is "the Gen V won't compensate enough for my lack of self-confidence because it won't let me win all the bench racing I plan to do"
     
  21. VENOM V

    VENOM V Enthusiast

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    LOL! Pretty much sums it up
     
  22. Twister

    Twister Viper Owner

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    My buddy has av aventador.. he's takin me on plenty of 0-140mph blast.

    My gen3 viper was 3300 pounds and 550 rwhp. Pretty much dead on to a genV.

    That car pulled on a lp570 superlegerra and felt maybe a tad slower than the aventador.

    Point I'm trying to make is that the genV is a very very fast car.

    Every review said that the viper felt a little faster than the zr1.

    Every vid shows that the genV when properly driven can pull on 911tts modded z06s and even give built gtrs with an extra 200 awhp on tap a run for their money.

    I've seen intake only z06s run even with 458s and lp gallardos.

    The last vid showed a z06 with intake exhaust and tune at 480 rwhp ( a full 40 rwhp over the stock 440 rwhp) get dusted by two car lengths by a stock genV.

    The genV has a power to weight up their with the big dogs. It is very fast.

    But honestly I'm looking at a v8 r8. Its not all about speed. Its also style and interior.

    But the genV also has that in spades.

    I'm just not undeestanding how anyone can discredit a car that does everything perfect. You literally get it all.

    To each their own but how is 640 hp not good when the Aventador and mc12 are only in the 600s themselves for twice the price. Maybe 3x.

    I've probally got 1000 passes down the 1320.

    No ones calling a low 11 high 120s car slow.

    When someone takes a genV to Atco we will likely see 130-132 mph out of a stocker
     
  23. tattooed

    tattooed Viper Owner

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    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/dieing

    (Dictionary.com Unabridged. Based on the Random House Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2013. )
     
  24. 05Commemorative

    05Commemorative Viper Owner

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    You guys do realize only a couple 100 ACR's were sold/built during some of Vipers weakest sales period (Gen 4). You guys also realize that everyone wants to talk 0-60 and 1/4 mile for bragging, but the ACR was not better or faster in those areas, but a monster on the track. U also realize the TA broke the ACR's record at the track, right? my point is, let us use facts vs emotion for these discussions. Point I am making is are u suggesting their is a ton of gen 4 ACR owners disappointed and did not upgrade to Gen V? I suspect not the case in they would be waiting for a ACR regardless. Bigger question is why are not the conv and coupe prior owners not upgrading? Conv owners is pretty easy answer as not option there... That is my reason and really the only opinion I can speak to with authority. seems like others need to remember to discuss their opinion and not what they think others are.
     
  25. ViperSmith

    ViperSmith Enthusiast

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    I group them in with the ACR owners, Gen IV owners as a whole.

    The Gen V is fast as hell and already set the record at Laguna, I am not sure what people want from it performance wise.

    Personally, I've never seen the Viper has a 0-60 car so I am not sure why people care so much about it. It is a track beast and there it still runs over everything. As you said, people don't really tout the ACR as a drag strip monster, I am unsure why people think the Gen V should be some breakaway hit at the strip. It has always been a track monster.
     
  26. IWishIHadaViper

    IWishIHadaViper Enthusiast

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    President Obama would find and kill Osama Bin Laden

    He did no such thing. Our intelligence community found him and SEAL Team 6 killed him. To suggest other wise is a disservice to those that were involved. It also smacks of ignorance.
     
  27. Paul Hawker

    Paul Hawker Viper Owner

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    Think we are getting into just a bit too much drama and detail.

    Maybe it is just as simple as price.

    Most everybody I know would trade even, their Viper for a New Gen V. (Only people that would not drive heavily modified cars and do not want to put all the money necessary to again modify a new Gen V.)

    All but a few would upgrade if it would cost them +/- $10,000 plus their current Viper.

    Still a bunch would upgrade if it would cost them +/- $20,000 plus their old Viper.

    At $30,000 those numbers begin to fall off dramatically.

    At $40,000 I can barely get the conversation going.

    At $50,000 - $60,000 only the people with stupid money will get into the game. (stupid money means that even though it might not make sense financially, it make sense emotionally to some very well off people)

    With a fully loaded Viper costing over $160,000 out the door (with some additional dealership markups even much more), some might say the bang for the buck limit is causing some to hold off for a while.

    Maybe a decontented SRT or discounts from a dealership might open up the flood gates.

    These are still pretty recessionary times for many members.

    These cars are more than twice the price of any other Dodge, or even any other SRT. Maybe this is just reality setting in.

    No matter…I still love my O9. It is my 3rd Viper, and I will mostly likely pick up a new Viper after the first of the year. No other car makes me feel so connected to the Vehicle, and the vehicle so connected to the planet. When MOPAR talks about Direct Connection, the Viper embodies this directness more than any other Vehicle, (except maybe a Jeep CJ out on the trails).
    When you belt into your VIper, it becomes directly connected to you, both physically and emotionally. You drive the car. It does precisely what you tell it to do. You are in charge of a tremendously powerful and agile mechanical extension of yourself. When you drive the car, you do not consern yourself with price, you just feel like one of the luckies people on the planet.
     
  28. BigDawg

    BigDawg Enthusiast

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    You can afford a Pagani, F40, F50, Enzo, La Ferrari, Koenigsegg, Bugatti, F1, P1, Carerra GT, 998 and you have never owned any of them!!!??? And when you say afford I assume you mean paid in cash without feeling a thing. That's impressive restraint I must say...unless you are in a very capital intensive business.
     
  29. 05Commemorative

    05Commemorative Viper Owner

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    Are those really fair expectations. Last year of Viper was 2010, so even the newest prior model is 3yrs old. You don't expect it to drop in value over 30k in that timeframe? For me, if diff was 30k, would do an a heartbeat. heck would do for 40k in a heartbeat. Of course for even money or up to $20k difference, folks would do it as that would be a crazy good deal. You can easily get into a GenV for 95-110k right now. plenty out their in that price range, so I don't grock the price statement. Lets not constantly use the 140k price point as the starting point as that is the on very high-end.

    btw, add 100hp to the car with the same prices and suspect you will get very similar results and here is the reason:
    1) >50% of prior Viper owners have converts- so they don't have a new car option
    2) 10%? of prior owners have ACR's - so would be waiting for a ACR and don't have an option
    3) ~40% prior viper owners have Coupes - really the only true prior owner target for the car, but yes you have to pay money to get it. Would +100hp solve that issue? I don't think so, but who knows.

    So, when you look at this, it comes down to one thing, you need to get new buyers. Majority of new buyers in this price range are not looking for a manual, but instead paddle shifters. Quite simple really. Put in an 8sp auto and watch you sales rate double over night.
     
  30. ACR steve

    ACR steve Viper Owner

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    Funny why people equate Hp to speed . Speed is the end result to a total package. (Hp, weight, braking ,handling etc.) Most of the guys that want 700 or 800+ Hp cars can’t even drive the cars they have now 10/10's or even 9/10's but the want to brag to their friends that there car has more Hp. I don't get It ??? I guess everyone owns a car for different reasons
     

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