06 s/c coupe vs modded z06

[Fadi]

I am looking at both of my dyno sheets right now. I dynoed my bone stock Viper and Z06. This is a very general analysis as to why the Z06 is quicker than the Viper.

Let us look at the upper rpm range as that is where races will take place.

Viper @ 4,500 rpms = 400 rwhp
Z06 @ 4,500 rpms = 370 rwhp
Viper @ 5,000 rpms = 425 rwhp
Z06 @ 5,000 rpms = 400 rwhp
Viper @ 5,500 rpms = 430 rwhp
Z06 @ 5,500 rpms = 430 rwhp
Viper @ 6,000 rpms = 420 rwhp
Z06 @ 6,000 rpms = 440 rwhp

Viper shifts. Back @ 4,500 rpms = 400 rwhp
Z06 @ 6,500 rpms = 454 rwhp
Viper @ 5,000 rpms = 425 rwhp
Z06 @ 7,000 rpms = 450 rwhp
Viper @ 5,500 rpms = 430 rwhp
Z06 shifts. Back @ 5,500 rpms = 430 rwhp
Viper @ 6,000 rpms = 420 rwhp
Z06 @ 6,000 rpms = 440 rwhp

Repeat with the Viper shifting....
...
..

As you can see, when the Viper shifts at 6,000 rpms, the Z06 will really start pulling away while having an ~54 rwhp advantage. When it is time for the Z06 to shift, it is still making more rwhp than the Viper at its given rpm. Remember, I am solely going by my stock Viper dyno (437 rwhp @ 5500 rpms) and my stock Z06 dyno (454 rwhp @ 6500 rpmws) Some cars can be weaker, some can be stronger.

This is just a quick, high-level analysis.

Remember, this is not considering the gearing nor the weight in which both characteristics favor the Z06.

So according to this data, Going to a steeper gear in the Viper would be counter productive. It would make you shift even sooner and reduce your top speed. It would multiply the torque but the Viper already has more torque and it doesn't seem to matter. Interesting. The Viper needs mor revs, which it's high displacement kills.

If torque really mattered, the Viper would be the fastest car on the road today, or close to it. Tq will get you out, hp will keep you going.

I raced a Gen II Viper with an exhuast (Corsa) about a few weeks ago. When we raced from a 2nd gear punch, he stuck by me for a split second due to the massive amount of tq the car has. It got him 'out' fast, but when my rpms started climbing he was history. Look at the Gallardo, CGT, Enzo, Murci, etc.. All of these cars have less than 480 tq to the engine, while having massive hp.

 

[pumpgas]

Two words and $750-$1,000 to fix at least one of your problems. Methanol Injection. No more heat soak, more torque and hp. Then if you wanted higher boost just throw on a 10lb pulley.

Otherwise you can throw on a 75 wet shot of nitrous coming on at 3,000 rpm with a cutoff at 5,500 rpm and it's game over for him.

 

[SnakeBitten]

It is the gearing, the weight, and the redline of the Z06 that makes it more supreior in the acceleration department.

So basically exactly what I said in my post..but some of these guys will never get it...Extreme myopia.....

 

[Viper X]

Hi John,

Glad you are enjoying your car. Interesting post. Some of what I've read is pretty accurate. Some isn't. It seems that we have a few corvette worshipers in our midst.

It was nice getting to know you at the Woodhouse event at Amercian Racing Academny in Vegas a while back. Your driving really improved over the 3 days that we were there. Hope you can make VOI this September.

Doug is right, heat soak will adverstly affect your hp / tq and therefore your performance. During the rebuild, I went to a larger intercooler and this has helped me loose less hp / tq on warm so Cal days.

I have a few suggestions for you when racing your buddy.

First, I wouldn't run back to back races. Let the car cool in between runs.

Second, learn to modulate the throttle. What this means is don't go right to full throttle with the Paxton. Let your engine spin up a bit and "roll" on the throttle. Throttle application will vary but given enough time, you will learn how your car best responds to throttle inputs. This is hard to do when you're excited, but it will help your performance. It works for me.

Third, you have very good tires in the Toyo RA1's. They are pretty sticky but not quite as good as the Kumho Ecsta V-700's. The Toyos would be my second choice for an all around tire. The Nitto drag radials work really well on the street - better than the Kumhos. BFGs seem best for the drag strip.

Fourth, for more power I would go to 8lbs of boost (stock Paxton set up), add headers, exhaust and a good tune. If you run at about 11.5 air / fuel under boost your car should be fine. Just leave the rev limiter at the stock setting. I upped my rev limiter to 6250 and was making 9lbs of boost at 6200. I think this is why I wasted 7 pistons. This seems to be the limit of the stock cast pistons.

My engine is now all forged, stryker heads, more cubes, blower cam, roller rockers, 6600 rpm rev limiter, etc, etc. We will be going to 12 lbs of boost shortly. Our objective is 950 rwhp give a take. No problems with any Corvettes, Porches, Ferraris or anything else so far, especially at higher speeds.

As for the C6 Z-06. Take a look at this link. This compares stock vs. stock in real world driving conditions and quite frankly, the stock SRT-10 is a dead heat with the C-6 Z06 car over the mile and the 1/2 mile. http://www.sscc.us/results-06-norc.htm#z2z

Good luck, have fun and be safe.

Dan

 

[Doug Supercharged Vipers]

Hello Dan,

Enjoyed reading your post! We originally wanted to go with the V700s, but as you may know they are not in stock at the present. John's car has the stock DLM Paxton kit, w/stock exhaust. We could easily extract more hp although the cast pistons are like playing with fire.

It sounds like you built a beast of your own! You shouldn't have any problem achieving your 950 rwhp goal. Here is a dyno sheet of a Built DLM SRT with a 708 cam, Greg Good heads and stock cubes.

SAE 900 rwhp & 831 tq.

Regards,
Doug

 

[1TONY1]

He said the Z06 traps at 130. there's no exhaust or a mopar pcm in the world thats gonna make the viper trap at that speed with a STOCK PAXTON sc.

Are you serious ? If I had a SRT with the stock Paxton, that ***** better run faster then 130 mph. Are they not doing that ?

 

[Viper X]

Hey Doug,

Thanks for the response. FYI, I have two Kumho Ecsta V700s that just showed up on my front porch today. They are back in stock at Tire Rack, rears only. Get them while you can!

Yes, the cast pistons are very weak when it comes to adding boost. I ruined the ring lands in 7 out of 10 pistons in my first stock engine. I made some mistakes. I added stage III heads, headers, roller rockers and bumped the rev limiter to 6250. The engine made a bunch more power but too much boost due to the higher revs likely killed my OE pistons. Also, I do use the car as it was intended, i.e., track days, NORC, drags, etc.

I'm getting the fuel system sorted out now. I've mounted 2 Bosch 044's at the rear of the car that pull fuel from the fuel "cannister" of the car which is fed by 2 smaller in tank low pressure / high volume pumps with reworked fuel rails and fuel lines. No fuel issues at this point with the Bosch pumps in the rear. My tuner originally mounted them in the "tunnel", where they got too hot on warm days.

After we get a few more miles on the new engine, we'll bump the boost to 12lbs and work on the tuning with the AEM.

Keep up the good work.

Regards,

Dan

 

[myfirstviper]

HI Dan(viper x) it was a pleasure meetimg you in vegas at the racing school also. I'm glad a haven't even looked at this post til now.Thank you for all of the guys who spoke up and knew what they were talking about.

it just really pissed me off that most guys assumed i cant drive my car and that is the sole reason of getting beat by a bit.

M2KVIPER i saw your beast last time i was at dlm's shop. I think you're getting more than just the basic package aren't you? there were a few blue/white FE's there and a few had monster work done.

DAN, I plan to go to vegas for the voi so i will see you there. you are definetly one of the coolest guys i've met thru the vca.

anyway, for all you other guys that had constructive input i appreciate it.

bottom line is i trust DLM and he has proven to me that he stands behind what he does. i didnt want a 900 hp car. doug built me exactly what i told him i wanted. yes i'm sure with more mods i can take my buddy's z06, but then he will just add more mods also. so i'm not really interested in to see who can blow up their car first.

all i know is my viper looks kick fing butt and it runs pretty damn fast for an all stock set up with safe hp.

maybe one day i'll want 900 rwhp and if i do, I'll let Doug Levin know. Then if i get beat by a 550 rwhp z06 you can blame it on my driving.

Mr Spanish Zorro, you're right about two things. I do need a hug (from a *********) and i should cut back on the juice.

thanks guys.